Scenario balance proposal

[butsushi]

Hi, first I would like to thank the devs for keeping this alive, this is the only MMO I ever played, ~5 years in live and now here, so thank you very much.

I cannot spend the time needed putting together a premade and the hassles that come with it ruin the game for me, e.g., Discord noise, Egos, etc...

I would like to suggest the following if I may:

Three options to select in the scen queue UI:
1. Solo: Solos would play against Solos only, so both sides groups would be formed by solo players only. Having the whole pool of scens available instead of only one pug scen.

2. Six players group: 6 players groups would play only against 6 players groups, One six players group on each side maximum.

Spoiler:

3. I like it rough: This option would allow the solos to queue into the 6x6 premade scens on item 2, because we have to respect those that appreciate entering a scen and being farmed relentlessly by a RR80+ well-coordinated premade with coms and give them a chance to get utterly destroyed while also allowing the well-coordinated premades to feel the accomplishment that is spending time putting together comms, strategy, synergies etc... just to consistently destroy the same uncoordinated low RR players over and over. Whole pool of scens available.

If you read my post, thank you for spending your time doing so.

[CyunUnderis]

1. Solo: Solos would play against Solos only, so both sides groups would be formed by solo players only. Having the whole pool of scens available instead of only one pug scen.

There is an equivalent for solo/duo, since last patch:

A new scenario queue "Discordant Skirmish" has been introduced. This replaces the currently selected Pick Up Group scenario. Queueing for Discordant Skirmish will randomly select a scenario from a curated list.

Currently the Discordant Skirmish pool contains the following scenarios:
- Gates of Ekrund
- Nordenwatch
- Pyramid of Settra
- Reikland Factory
- Lost Temple of Isha
- Mourkain Temple

[gyps]

For solo playing or duo you can qeue in "discordant skirmish" which is basically what you describe, I've read pretty good comments about it.

teorically premades can't enter that, but they could try joining "discordant" making 3 groups of two and hoping to be matched together...don't know if its even possible..

Third option is just normal scenarios!

[butsushi]

1. Solo: Solos would play against Solos only, so both sides groups would be formed by solo players only. Having the whole pool of scens available instead of only one pug scen.

There is an equivalent for solo/duo, since last patch:

A new scenario queue "Discordant Skirmish" has been introduced. This replaces the currently selected Pick Up Group scenario. Queueing for Discordant Skirmish will randomly select a scenario from a curated list.

Currently the Discordant Skirmish pool contains the following scenarios:
- Gates of Ekrund
- Nordenwatch
- Pyramid of Settra
- Reikland Factory
- Lost Temple of Isha
- Mourkain Temple

Hi CyunUnderis, thank you for your input and yes, I have been queueing Discordant Skirmish.
It is a good step towards more enjoyable sessions, however, I just left one and I took some prints, still not sure whether I can share or not as I believe we cannot display names. It was a temple of isha discordant skirmish where there were at least 4 players from the same guild that I could spot, a BO, DOK, SORC and Choppa and they were obviously in comms as their movement was clearly coordinated.
My point being, allowing anything else besides solos still ruins the fun (e.g. Duos and same Clan players that will queue together and behind the scenes be in Comms).

Elaborating a little bit more, Solos could be filtered by not being in a group and not allowing same guild members to be placed in same queue.

[Hootmaroot]

teorically premades can't enter that, but they could try joining "discordant" making 3 groups of two and hoping to be matched together...don't know if its even possible..

this seems to be happening now, meeting 4+ of the same guild in what technically should be solo/duo but doesnt seem to happen too often yet, but i guess it will be happening more and more in the future when premades get pissed at meeting only premades and not being able to just farm a pug

[Emissary]

For solo playing or duo you can qeue in "discordant skirmish" which is basically what you describe, I've read pretty good comments about it.

teorically premades can't enter that, but they could try joining "discordant" making 3 groups of two and hoping to be matched together...don't know if its even possible..

Third option is just normal scenarios!

This is happening more than you think as both sides are trying to circumvent the solo que discordant rules.

No matter what the devs do people will be people and try to cheat the system no matter what is done. They get in the 6v6 and get farmed so go into the solo que to make their epeens feel better. I thank the devs for the discordant scs. Except for the one evening I faced the same 6 man from the same guild all evening long in the discordant sc I have had a lot better time in solo que.

[Sulorie]

Elaborating a little bit more, Solos could be filtered by not being in a group and not allowing same guild members to be placed in same queue.

Do I understand you right here, you want to punish people for being in a guild? In a MMO?

Let's say you want to play with your friends and abuse pug sc, all you need is to leave your guild and all an enemy would notice is at best similar movement patterns.
Imagine you are in one of those mass pug guilds and multiple players queue solo and eventually multiple players of that guild get into the same sc.
How you identify people playing together?
You don't need voicecom to assist, stick with grp and swap guard.

[butsushi]

Elaborating a little bit more, Solos could be filtered by not being in a group and not allowing same guild members to be placed in same queue.

Do I understand you right here, you want to punish people for being in a guild? In a MMO?

Let's say you want to play with your friends and abuse pug sc, all you need is to leave your guild and all an enemy would notice is at best similar movement patterns.
Imagine you are in one of those mass pug guilds and multiple players queue solo and eventually multiple players of that guild get into the same sc.
How you identify people playing together?
You don't need voicecom to assist, stick with grp and swap guard.

Not actually no, you misunderstood my suggestion. Same guild members would not be placed in the same scenario queue but a different one for the Solo option. Right now ppl are abusing the duo to put 4 or 6 ppl in the same scen. I can appreciate that my suggestion is not the best and I will ponder on your criticism. I knew criticism would heavily come to my post. What I was expecting is that criticism would come accompanied of better solutions.

[Scottx125]

Question is how do you sort those who are guided who by happenstance get put in the same instance against those who are deliberately trying to cheat the system? You can't. Only way around it IMO is put a limit of 2 people from the same guild in each SC. And then if there are no other SC pops and players get invited into that SC. Prioritise any guilds/players that are not in the same guild as the 2 guilded players in the SC. If after 30s or whatever no other players can be found, relax the restriction to allow same guild players in.

[Dabbart]

How many players do you think this server has? Why should the 6man sit and wait with no pops while the PUGs can get instant Qs? Oh, as long as those PUGs aren't in the same guild ofc, if you dare to be guilded but not in a group, then you have to wait.

We've had a PUG/Duo only SC for a LONG time. The new discordant skirmish is just a different version of it.

And we have 6v6 systems in place. We also have the third option you propose. Those are all the other SCs.

People from the same guild are allowed to solo/duo q are the same time. Why wouldn't they be? Stop asking for ways to punish people in a guild/group. Lets find ways to reward those that play their roles, and play them well. A couple extra WCs after an SC isn't much of a carrot.

This is a group game. And SCs are a group based minigame.That's why you are put into groups during the SC. You don't fight as 6-12-18 solos like in ORvR(if youre solo)you are placed into groups. Fight as a group. Make a group. Play as a group. You'll find much more enjoyment and success.

Note:I didn't say join a guild or disc. Just a group. There are tons of people that don't want the same things the OP does. Group with them. Nothing wrong with a group out of coms. You're not trying to be competitive in 6v6... but you can still group up with 1-2-3 like minded players.

Edit:I actually solo quite a lot. I find often that soloers would rather a quick surrender than engage in a difficult fight and try to learn. Sure, sometimes you're just boned. But focusing the tank, not assisting, not detaunting, kiting directly backwards, not guard swapping, not using pots, poor placement, poor RR investment, etc will almost always lead to a loss. Want to know the best place to learn/get advice on these tools? In a Guild. A Guild that runs groups.