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Open the 3 zones already

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Poll: Open the 3 zones already

Open 3 zones like before
117
77%
Stay with 2
35
23%
Total votes: 152

rejndjer
Suspended
Posts: 431

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#21 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 3:47 pm

yoluigi wrote: Thu Oct 06, 2022 2:43 pm Like some said some zones are just bad. If praag was alwas open nobody would mind it lol. Having 3 zones give more fun for solo/duo trio, 6man, 12man and warbands
even praag gets boring after 2hour slugfest.

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Fenris78
Posts: 787

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#22 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 3:48 pm

wonshot wrote: Thu Oct 06, 2022 7:37 am I think the main arguement is being missed, for why 3 zones should be available.
Not all zones are equal...

If Caledor, KV are the only two options there will be players, groups, or guilds who simply get a worse evening because of the open available zones. Having 3 open means that there are a higher chance for a better balanced open rvr map will be availabel, henec the product and fight potential being higher.
Agreed on you here, all zones are far from equal... :/

The main issue is (was ?) to be locked on one map forever, or get 8h of stalemate on same boring map until fort pairing reset.

Now it should be (is ?) always 2 open maps at same time wich is not bad, except if the two zones are disliked by most (Caledor especially, KV is not THAT bad but still an enclosed circus without many options to move/flank, reikland is meh but still better, etc.), wich lead to fewer activity or shameful traps (see this morning KV with 60% aao right until Order started siege, like every Destru refused to play and popped in only to defend...that's a good sign how hated are some maps).

The risk with 3 zones is to never actually push a "shitty" zone, and only actually fight for the two other, but still it should eventually tend to unlock a even more disliked zone, and get people to switch over the one they disdained before...

I dont think the system will be perfect for both options, but it can worth a try, even better it could allow more time for open T2 zones, wich for I never fought (ever) since weeks now (or I didnt show up at needed hours :p). And I love T2 zones, actually...

Ideally, it should be always a T2, a T3 and a T4 opened zones at a time ; sadly with campaign system and player behaviour (who want to push Forts preferably, who can blame them ?), it's not really possible, BUT I clearly remember we had something like that with previous system, even if that meant one empty zone, at least it allowed solo/small groups to play without being zerged by one or two wbs roaming around...

Now with 2 open zones, you just concentrated the population in smaller area, wich is very detrimental to 6v6 or solo roaming play, and I think it's detrimental to the game health...

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Secrets
Former Staff
Posts: 414

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#23 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:21 pm

Personally:

Zones open should be two factors:
1) Population. If population on the server exceeds 750, open another zone. Check this every hour.
2) Once a pairing is completed, it will not open another one if the system doesn't dictate it. The existing structure for the new city siege system should stay in place, with the exception being the above checked every hour.

This will work with the existing code in place, as GMs can manually force open another pairing.

To trial this above system, the community / administrative team could attempt opening all 3 pairings for a week before solidifying it in code. While manual, it would gauge player sentiment of multiple open pairings.

The concern for me would be that when population drops below 700, pairings not in use would need to automatically close.

I think the old style system of city siege (capture 2 forts into city) was more fun and engaging for completing forts into city, however, the lack of city incentive has lead to more interesting fort fights and reduced city participation. But under that system, we would have (and had) the same issue OP describes. We resolved it by opening locked pairings for population distribution automatically based on population numbers, but once a pairing went to fort, it would simply reset to T2.

I personally prefer the fort fights to city because city is instanced content that isn't rewarding for a majority of participants, so I think what I posted above is a healthy compromise.

Garamore
Posts: 397

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#24 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:32 pm

Pretty sure order prefers fort fights as they win the majority of them. Fort fights are pretty much instanced content to give free bags to order.
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Secrets
Former Staff
Posts: 414

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#25 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:43 pm

Garamore wrote: Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:32 pm Pretty sure order prefers fort fights as they win the majority of them. Fort fights are pretty much instanced content to give free bags to order.
Depends on the time of day.

I've seen destro win plenty at the intended size (cap on both sides).

The issue with forts is that reservations end up making the population numbers imbalanced as an uneven number of warband players end up getting reservations, and all the solo players that log off after a zone flip have their reservations drop after Stage 2, resulting in imbalanced fort fights if not everyone who had a reservation participates.

There needs to be a way to have 'priority' given to some players on Stage 2. But the population gap that is present at cap must be maintained at all stages of the fort for balance purposes, and an even number of players must be allowed in to allow that same ratio to enter.

I was going to code that at some point (easily doable, just red tape with the team), but it's a bit too late for that now.

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Akalukz
Posts: 1587

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#26 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:53 pm

Very few things kill ORvR quicker than KV / Caledor stalemates. Especially if KV is only zone open, which happens often.
-= Agony =-

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Secrets
Former Staff
Posts: 414

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#27 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 7:37 pm

Akalukz wrote: Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:53 pm Very few things kill ORvR quicker than KV / Caledor stalemates. Especially if KV is only zone open, which happens often.
Tell me you're playing the game within the last 17 hours without telling me you're playing the game the last 17 hours. :P

I agree.
Even back during the Lazypeon wave, one active zone absolutely destroys the chance of meaningful ORvR or successful sieges. It's not fun to have that many people crammed in one zone, and often times other zones have players in them on that fact alone.

Sure looks cool. But it isn't fun to play in.

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space44
Posts: 480

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#28 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 8:17 pm

wonshot wrote: Thu Oct 06, 2022 7:37 am I think the main arguement is being missed, for why 3 zones should be available.
Not all zones are equal...

If Caledor, KV are the only two options there will be players, groups, or guilds who simply get a worse evening because of the open available zones. Having 3 open means that there are a higher chance for a better balanced open rvr map will be availabel, henec the product and fight potential being higher.
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Kpi
Posts: 517

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#29 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:25 pm

3 Zones open means more tactical movments in RVR. Yes pls
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Scottx125
Posts: 965

Re: Open the 3 zones already

Post#30 » Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:53 pm

space44 wrote: Thu Oct 06, 2022 12:06 am you chose option 2 how very boring of you
What are you talking about? I voted option 1. More zones = more chance to spread the zerg out. Not only that, there's a greater chance for a better map to be available and it increases the chance of zone pushes. I disagree with the dynamic growth of zones, I don't believe it's needed. Players naturally go to the same zone if they want to fight other people. The whole point of having 3 zones is so that if you have a zerg roaming in one pairing, you can then break off, leave the zerg in that one pairing and split with the remaining two, forcing the zerg to either move as an entire blob to another pairing (which is slow and hard to coordinate), or split themselves making it easier to fight them. And even though it's slightly off topic, I'd say SOR should have a delayed update of 5 minutes. So that if a force moves to another pairing, it's not immediately updated. People will have to communicate and have scouts to keep an eye on enemy movements. And it also gives a quick keep take more of a chance of succeeding if it's well coordinated.
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