Return of Reckoning

PTS RP/ZEAL changes

Hello, I'll start with a Thank you, for looking finally at the DPS spec of those classes I have been waiting for them fora ages with little hopes in sight, but finally they are here and I have to say they are a nice step up, but with a long way still to go.



First of let's talk about the Off Sov set, Pointing out that it's a Int and not a Willpower set is a nice touch, but still the 7th bonus not being able to apply to multiple targets is a bad choice in a set that focuses on supposedly AOE attacks, unless it is a BUG to be fixed in the future? I would strongly suggest to either change it to: increase crit chance and crit dmg, or a main stat (INT) bonus, or something that can utilize the AoE.


Let's talk about the Classes themselves:

RP:

Rune of battle it's still a good ability, but the direction of the dmg should be looked at no the position of its recipient doesn't matter and it counts the RP as the source so even if RoB is behind enemy lines the block and disrupt chance is counted from the location of the RP.

The changes to Rune of cleaving is a copy “pasta” of what Zealot have so I think is an upgrade to what RP’s had earlier.

Extended battle this tactic has been reworked completely and I believe it have been nerfed to oblivion, it moved DPS RPs from mid rage, into the front lines with little benefit. The 2 additional procs form RoB are not worth it, and the extended duration of RoC also makes no sense with the new CD reduced on this ability and the change to its uptime. Especially since it's not extending it duration on PTS yet.

Now on to the Grimnir’s Fury, this ability is not worth it at all, 2 dmg procs in a melee range with 1 sec cast, it pales in Comparison with Winds of Insanity utility, versatility and efficiency. It's even weaker than the Waves of Chaos tactic, or two uses of Rune of Might. This ability if it's supposed to be dps one, needs a significant boost or overhaul.

In terms of ST changes i feal they don't change nothing for RP, since they still make RP a stationary caster with it's 2sec cast times, with little way to expedite it.



Zeal:

Boon of Tzench a nice step up, but still this ability with its 2s cast while stationary will not be utilized much.

Scourge dps increase a welcome since this ability can become instant

Mirror of Madness a copy “pasta” of RPs rune of fate, significant improvement, shame thou its mirroring again and not anything unique.

Waves of Chaos, it became a potent tactic with the change to procs, when it gained additional main stat scaling synergies, now I would advocate to look at its scaling again with the new mastery investment bonuses.



Overall, the proposed changes are finally a small step into making a DPs heals who were forgotten a bit more useful.

The next step would be to balance the RP useless middle mastery Rune, Rune of Spead to make it at all desirable. And looking at making ST DPS spec viable, and comparable in output with other healing classes.

Ruin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2024 4:13 pm First of let's talk about the Off Sov set, Pointing out that it's a Int and not a Willpower set is a nice touch, but still the 7th bonus not being able to apply to multiple targets is a bad choice

You tested that? AoE spells aren't triggering the proc on everybody in PTS? Cuz it does so in the live patch.

If that's the case then yeah, no point in bringing that to oRvR.

on PTS the proc is only reaplied when the other one ends, while on live it can proc speperety on multiple targes.

Ruin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2024 4:13 pm RP:
Now on to the Grimnir’s Fury, this ability is not worth it at all, 2 dmg procs in a melee range with 1 sec cast, it pales in Comparison with Winds of Insanity utility, versatility and efficiency. It's even weaker than the Waves of Chaos tactic, or two uses of Rune of Might. This ability if it's supposed to be dps one, needs a significant boost or overhaul.

While it doesn't exactly disprove your arguement of 13p abilities needing to be at similar power, I'd like to point out the Grimnir's Fury is essentially "free" on the dps RP rr70 build:
What you need from the left tree is the Heal Debuff tactic and then the AP(left) or heal(right) rune for the party. Finally from the right tree you take 3 things; the armor+elemental resist debuff tactic, Rune of Battle and Grimnir's Fury.

On the other hand a rr70 dps Zealot on the same role will need:
The Heal debuff tactic from left tree, the AP(left) or heal(right) ritual and would ideally want 4 things from the right tree. These are the armor+corp resistance debuff tactic, the Wave of Chaos tactic, Chaotic Agitation and Wind of Insanity.

But they can only afford 3 out of the 4.

• Going with 7pc off Sov gives them 2 more mastery points but decreases their available crit by 4% or more (unreliable HD) and worse survivability

• Ignoring the heal debuff or Ritual is impossible (due to destroying the reason for the build, and being unable to use Waves of Chaos respectively)

• Giving up Wind of Insanity or Chaotic Agitation means that you either give up on your great 13p ability or that you lose out on any ranged AOE direct damage potential (and thus have to frontline all the time for the heal debuff)

• Giving up on Waves of Chaos is probably the prefered option, but losing out on extra AOE damage (even if not counted as direct) just feels bad. Especially since that would be the only way to compete with dps RP and their 2 and a half sources of AOE direct damage (spamable AOE attack + Rune of Battle + weaving in Grimnir's Fury)

TLDR: while Grimnir's Fury may be weaker than WoI in a 1:1 comparison, the fact that it doesnt restrict your build to take it basically makes it very valuable compared to Zealot who will have to give up an important part of their build (13ability, ranged direct AOE damage, or worse % to crit and less survivability) or just perform a even worse than RP dps-wise (already having no overlapping sources of direct damage --> less procs and also giving up their only source of overlapping damage, that is Waves of Chaos, even if it's not direct)

I have absolutely no idea why ppl think, the HD is a must have? If it's so good why every Chosen doesn't use, they aura for that?

Strike threw increase from Middle mastery is a lot better. And as you said Zealot have a lot more useful things in their masteries, it would be nice to have to choose between options.

Cuz to get kills what matter is the DPS vs HPS battle of your whole WB. If i can decrease their healing by 35% then its huge. Yes, my own personal numbers be smaller then the DPS RP running strikethrough, but my impact on fights will be a lot higher.

And you 100% want one Chosen running the heal debuff aura. But they don't stack so u just need one, same with the AP drain.

Getting hits in, rather than haveing a chance to HD on hit on crit might be more usefull, especialy since you wont the armor and resistance dubff in, and also since 2h staffs does not provide base striekthrew.

Ruin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 19, 2024 5:26 pm Getting hits in, rather than haveing a chance to HD on hit on crit might be more usefull, especialy since you wont the armor and resistance dubff in, and also since 2h staffs does not provide base striekthrew.

The strikethrough doesn't even compute relative to the hypothetical damage increase you provide a warband by healdebuffing multiple people. It's like a .000000000X% difference vs a very hard to actually pin, but let's say potentially 35% increase, warband (local area, really, since non-wb allies) wide.

pls Remeber that a Dps Heals struggle to gain cap dps stat.
And either way Zeal have a bit more options to do direct dmg from skills than RP.

Will healing ritual/rune still act as a direct heal and will proc everything?