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[AM] M1 Isha's Ward

These proposals have passed an internal review and are implemented in some way on the server. Review for specific implementation details.

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Dabbart
Posts: 1970

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#31 » Mon Apr 23, 2018 9:26 pm

^^^ then why keep it? Also, you are forgetting enemies using Buffhead, see you have a bubble up and so don’t attack you. Or the difference is n positional play that the bubble allows you to have.

You also ignore the potential of 55s into the bubble you get hit, and then fire off another on 6s later. Hence, I don’t believe my OP is false. I possibly should of used different terminology. But the ability to gain 7200 absorb from this M1, entirely because of he 60s duration IS possible, and is Over Powered imo.

Unless I misread you Luuca, these are fairly important points. And you basicallly argue for why it should be on a lower duration. So it is used properly, and intelligently... Why not change it, if everything you wrote is correct and true? (Note, I am not in agreement, just asking)

Also, I should point out that using this M1 then Flee+AP pot is an excellent tactic with all sorts of uses...

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Luuca
Posts: 1218

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#32 » Mon Apr 23, 2018 9:58 pm

You argue a specific situation that occurs less than 5% of the time in SCs or ORvR as your basis for 7200 damage shield. I submit that such anomalies of the game and timing, like stacking morales or staggered morales, should not be part of this conversation. Yes, I agree it occurs, but it is not the norm.

The proposal stated that this M1 is too powerful because of it's "100% Uptime"

It does not have 100% uptime when used as intended. When NOT used as intended it saves 1 keypress and does nothing to help the realm or hinder the other.

While I agree that a 30 second effective time once fired would be in line with other M1s on Knight and Choppa, we are not allowed to make arguments based upon other classes. As such I avoided it.

Your premise was 100% uptime, and yes, every morale can be used after its cooldown is up. This one just so happens to carry a longer effective time. As it is not 100% uptime, your proposal is moot and should not be considered.
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footpatrol2
Posts: 1066

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#33 » Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:18 pm

So I don't have a amazing argument here. Nor is the proposal for taking it away an amazing argument either.

It just sucks that this game is slowly getting it's flavor stripped away. It feels like this game is getting declawed. This game had a lot of flavor at one point and got smashed down due to community outcry and forum wizards.

Isha's ward is good and it is a advantage that AM's have over other's. So what... ... ... It's not a gamebreaking advantage. You want to take something that is unique and make it un unique which isn't gamebreaking either. There are inequalities all over the game and that is actually part of the draw... ... ...

rTrSleepy
Posts: 18

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#34 » Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:27 pm

Spoiler:
I think people are getting away from the point of why it's really good, it's fire and forget. It keeps you alive through the KD you didn't see coming. If it was on a destro healer that gets pounced/kd and then runs away unscathed; there would be tears abound from our beloved white lion community.
Let's leave the WL memes out of the balance forum - Dan
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footpatrol2
Posts: 1066

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#35 » Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:34 pm

Ya and you had to blow your morale so all the other morale option's are off the table for a full minute. Don't forget about the downsides of this morale.

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adamthelc
Posts: 661

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#36 » Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:38 pm

It doesnt have 100% up time, its an absorb not a buff. If it does end up having 100% up time it either did nothing or very little. If you take less than 3600 damage over 60 seconds you probably werent going to die and didnt really need it.

It lets you absorb 3600 damage every minute, which it would still do if its duration was 20 or 30 seconds. Ease of use whether its 20, 30 or 60 seconds is not going to change much. That argument should be thrown out a window.

The difference is that 60 seconds allows you to start the CD timer earlier.

If anything 60 seconds can actually punish poor play. If you try to maximize uptime you could take no threatening damage and have no shield 30 seconds into it, then face some threatening damage and have a shield up. Whereas a shorter CD you would be more inclined to hold onto it until you actually need it.

The 60 second duration is obviously the issue though. People are saying you have a 100% up time, fine lets roll with that. You can have an absorb for 3600 every minute, pretty good. But is it still good considering in order to have that you have to give up using any other morale?

That will be it for me, feel like I am starting to get redundant. Truth be told I dont really care if its duration is 60, 30 or 20. I dont think its game breaking and I dont think this ability will suffer that much with one of the other CDs. Part of the reason I was arguing against it, why change something that wasnt really a problem and wont really make a difference.

Didnt really like the arguments being made to justify the change. The best argument was that all morales are going to be looked at for flaws. Which makes sense, but was a little confusing because we were told to not make arguments based on other classes morales.

Dabbart
Posts: 1970

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#37 » Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:39 pm

So, correct me if I am wrong. But the argument for leaving it as is boils down to; “it’s really not a big deal” and semantics about my wording of the OP/argument? Not digging, trying to understand.

Edit: both of those arguments are valid. Just cause an ability is mildly OP, doesn’t make it game breaking or broken. Luuca’s argument is one I disagree with, but it’s still valid.

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Luuca
Posts: 1218

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#38 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:29 am

As the assertion of the morale in question having "100% Uptime" has been debunked, the OP has now changed his position to a "skill based" argument.

In light of this, I request that this discussion be closed and the OP can submit his proposition to reflect this change in argument for changing the duration.
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Dabbart
Posts: 1970

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#39 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:39 am

Luuca, wtf are you doing? Are you trolling, trying to be funny, or is that actually the argument you are making?

No. I do not consider the 100% uptime Debunked. it's true. If you are not attacked, the bubble will be up 100% of the time. You think that is bad play style is not debunking anything. I said you have a valid argument, but I disagreed with it. That is not changing my point. You brought up the skill based argument. By your argumentation, the morale should be changed, as it currently requires 0 skill to use properly/badly, but with a lower duration could still be used, but would enforce a certain lvl of "skill".

Sorry Luuca. I'm not playing troll games in the Balance forums.

Edit: "doesn't have 100% uptime when used as intended" is a bullshit lie btw Luuca. It has a 60s duration, how could you say it was NOT unintended to be used that way? Other than the designers, no one knows the answer to how it was intended. By the duration of it though, the argument that being used on CD was thought of, cause you can.
Last edited by Dabbart on Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Toldavf
Posts: 1586

Re: [AM] M1 Isha's Ward [Close Date: 6th May]

Post#40 » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:41 am

After some testing it seems that absorbs are unaffected by guard and detaunt.

With that in mind it seems that it would always be better to slot divine favour over this morale if you basically play properly and detaunt things or if you will get a guard swap. They are pretty much an equivalent amount of health though actually having divine favour might well count for more in the long run as there would be more mitigation.

Basically unless I'm wrong (i might be but i don't think i am and please do disprove me if you know better) it's pointless to slot Ishas ward if you don't keep it up 100% of the time and don't detaunt much. In any other situation divine favour is a far superior choice
Khorlar, Thorvold, Sjohgar, Anareth, Toldavf, Hartwin, Gotrin and others -_-

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