Tesq wrote:there is no problem with mara moral drain
25% to remove 225 points of moral from a hit that can be block/parried are you joking?
if your wb is positioned well there is no way this be an issue of course if you push with melee mixed with tanks yes...put first tank then the rest even if 9 ppl get it and you make those mara stay back and way from your dd lines by aoe even with a 100% ignoring attack he would hit 8 tanks and 1 dd; moreover chosen/bo only have access to raze which can be interrupt by aoe interrupt or aoe KD (or trade a m4 for the base lol).
This early bomb some of you are talking about is none existent, because no other destru classes have moral gain tactic for himself and/or other classes benefith classes which have or are primary aoe hitter like are bw/sorc (or need to exchange 1 shammy for either a dok/zealot) also an aoe m2 which in case of BW is all around him is a lot better than a positional from mara/we which most of times tend to miss if ppl moveing too much while the bw just need to be in the middle of anything and blow anything away lol.
Also you lower a lot the dmg of mara and force probably the mara deeper with the tank that is guarding him plus the chance to punt the tank away and leave mara undefended by magical damages. Order had their crit nerfed becaus it was a passive bonus 100% time active which require nothing from a kobs than just put a guard.
Order from the start of the fight in EVERY party have this passive advantage; if any destru party want choppa fasta is instead forced to take a choppa in every party. And moreover destru alpha strike last 20 sec while you're passive bonuses are always on.
Your alpha strike is a lot better than the destru. It feel only normal then the much the fight scale and go the more destru have better morales ( the only disadvanateg destru have atm in small/large scale is BO snare, well not like kobs+sm have a badder solution eh probable better in small scale).
The am yes is a problem which is why me personaly said fix it by himself since it could have problem due to being a cloth healer with the new way moral bumo work. But if Am got worse it's just that; not like mara became OP all togheter and can use 5-6 tactics. I always saw 1 am at least in every wb before moral patch
Fix am moral tactic would be the right course
No the am is not the problem, the problem here is chosen, BO and etc able to gain moral way faster than order tanks, you are only saying that cuz you dont wanna see your chosen without that OP tatic
spikespiegel84 wrote:Morale gain is useless if using destined for victory.
For the rest, I will trade chosen for kotbs immediately, without blinking. The kotbs is simply, overall, totally better.
Except the look. They look like armored clowns.
Tell me more about mixed Defenses and Crippling Strikes
dontcomplainx wrote:
Tell me more about mixed Defenses and Crippling Strikes
Chosen is a parry based tank that need to proc block in order to get high parry. KOTBS has shield rush and the coordination tactic. not to mention the armor buff and vigilence which is essentially a detuant.
Chosen may have mixed defenses but x2 KOTBS can provide you multiple viable and strong auras, triple target snare, 20% grp crit, 10% healing crit and 15% increased healing and lastly even if they go full def tank a KOTBS can soft cap stats for 30s with runefang and emperors champion.
The KOTBS provide far more potent grp buffs than chosen and unlike chosen its actually viable to run 2 of them
Crippling stikes was needed to deal with orders crit chance abilities: dirty tricks, encouraged aim and ancestors fury to name a few.
dontcomplainx wrote:
Tell me more about mixed Defenses and Crippling Strikes
Chosen is a parry based tank that need to proc block in order to get high parry. KOTBS has shield rush and the coordination tactic. not to mention the armor buff and vigilence which is essentially a detuant.
Chosen may have mixed defenses but x2 KOTBS can provide you multiple viable and strong auras, triple target snare, 20% grp crit, 10% healing crit and 15% increased healing and lastly even if they go full def tank a KOTBS can soft cap stats for 30s with runefang and emperors champion.
The KOTBS provide far more potent grp buffs than chosen and unlike chosen its actually viable to run 2 of them
Crippling stikes was needed to deal with orders crit chance abilities: dirty tricks, encouraged aim and ancestors fury to name a few.
dontcomplainx wrote:
20% group crit? hmm i think devs nerfed that
Nah they split it you can still have 20% crit if you take a 2H KOTBS and an SnB one which is acctully something may people have doen as it allows your KOTBS to have greater freedom in what auras and tactics they can run
dontcomplainx wrote:
Tell me more about mixed Defenses and Crippling Strikes
Chosen is a parry based tank that need to proc block in order to get high parry. KOTBS has shield rush and the coordination tactic. not to mention the armor buff and vigilence which is essentially a detuant.
Chosen may have mixed defenses but x2 KOTBS can provide you multiple viable and strong auras, triple target snare, 20% grp crit, 10% healing crit and 15% increased healing and lastly even if they go full def tank a KOTBS can soft cap stats for 30s with runefang and emperors champion.
The KOTBS provide far more potent grp buffs than chosen and unlike chosen its actually viable to run 2 of them
Crippling stikes was needed to deal with orders crit chance abilities: dirty tricks, encouraged aim and ancestors fury to name a few.
20% group crit? hmm i think devs nerf that
cripple strike dosen't stack with challenge, ALL order crit tactic stack all- togheter and were all nerfed for that reasons
cripple strike require to hit+crit which mean either use clave and do lol dmg and still requiring crit or either spam ravange and get parry /block and still require to crit.
If you wanna go aoe -->backlash or rending blade; regardless you need to be either def as a stone to front line and debuff everything or enemy doing crap dmg or either have so many good comrade that at that point just rotate challenge between 8 tanks is better; it still don't work against enemy bomb tought and nor is m4 .... so exatly in which way moral tactic make chosen/BO so awsome? 8 x raze can be interrupt by 1 sm. ALl morales ignore M4 dmg reduction so you're bomb is actually ignoring our best tool? while your kobs crit increase tool is actually boosting your heal which is a better counter to our moral bomb because only heals/high wounds can save you vs moral bomb)
not to mention that all these things are on tactics and mixed defense is mandatory, destinate for victory is mandatory; wanna front line? tough is mandatory then you have 1 tactic so all the shiny build ppl wanna bring on the forum are praticable only in 1vs 1 wb format at max, for bigger number they are impossible you can't push throught enemy bomb with those builds or if the number are lowers you use a different set up while a kobs dosen't loose in any build all is tools. kosb also got unscattered by ap tactic nerf because his armor buff also regen ap EVEN WHEN FLEE and is up 50% of the time (tactic can make it up 100% of the time lol)
kobs tools require you to be in range of ppl you wanna buff/debuff and apply 1 guard
seriusly as happened for wh/we ranged snare, simply fix what is not working aka AM moral gain; not nerf what it is. I was a main protagonist of "if chosen need a touch is only slightly in moral tactic" so i don't need personal attack about i dont want the tactic being nerfed (lol), they alredy slighted nerfed that and it have my approva way before it happened, if it still too much for small skirm can happen again but to put it simply the moral tactic for rvr is fine now. PPl think you can raze + m4 ...you use 1 or another one then the moral is gone for 1 min where order have all possible passive buff while destru main game changing skill is choppa fasta (20 sec and then is gone for 1 min, also party restricted) which mean in multiple inc in row you're **** if you face multiple wb all strong enough instead orders have all passive bonuses with no CD and can keep push forever...camon you even have bw with a personal m2 and a personal moral tactic you should just feel ashame as order player ah ye you also get shatter limbs which after the g.cleanse tactic nerf is even harder to cleanse from yourself as healer( ah ye that is also spamable with a sm, the main reason why i don't even use anymore g-cleanse tactic and goging vanilla with cleanse m2 (that also nerfed due being problematic in small skimr))).
Last edited by Tesq on Tue Jan 17, 2017 2:30 am, edited 7 times in total.
Ok, so from what ive seen in the lakes now is... Order has no tools to counter the morale drain/dump of the destro. 1 Marauder is enough to drain AP and to burst our morale back to 0 in like 3 aoe hits. Yes order have better m2/m3 burst morale but we cant seem to get even to morale 1 when there is 1 marauder in the warband.. this is clearly working as intened... phalanx (ab)using this..
there`s been said we have a `window` to win a fight, can tell there is none
no salt just observation
It is not the destro moral pump or dumps that kill order in orvr.
Marauders moral drain isn't even necessary, at the present moment anyways.
