[Engineer,Magus]Keg,Aegis change v.2

[Penril]

Didn't people complain on live because some of the engi toys were targettable, making tab-target useless if several of them were around? I'm sure there was a patch that made them non-targettable.

[tomato]

The problem is that Keg has no counterplay, whereas Aegis does (it can be removed since it is an Enchantment).

healdebuff, whereas Aegis is unaffected. Aegis doesn't require to stay stationary and within a 30f radius of the keg.

i don't see a issue here and neither skill has to be changed. nothing should be mirrored and both should stay unique!
mulkerson was able to heal 200k in one sc without heal on order/damage on destru and the keg comes to discussion, srsly?

[Tankbeardz]

Honestly, are we are arguing about keg? Maybe just limit to party if anything....But I don't even see that as a necessity.

Guys, you are really missing the ball on the magus aegis...you get the heal regardless on whether you have increased wounds or not. It's one of the best self heal abilities in the game which, to my knowledge, is not affected by heal debuff.

[Penril]

!
mulkerson was able to heal 200k in one sc without heal on order/damage on destru and the keg comes to discussion, srsly?

Yes, srlsy. The reason is that it IS an issue to several players. Therefore, if a proposal follows the format, it deserves to be discussed and it is up to the experienced players to prove the Keg is completely fine. However, just because something makes it to the Discussion forum does not mean OP's suggestion will be implemented.

I, for example, think Keg is absolutely fine and there is no issue with it. But I won't argue for it because I also happen to be a Moderator. So hopefully, people like you or Tankbeardz can prove keg is fine. Shouldn't be hard tbh.

[Sigimund]

They are less common but this is not the only out of party AOE heal in the game. They're usually on healers, where they are more powerful because of healing gear/tactics.

Keg is a situational gimmick ability that only gets results in gimmick builds on a highly situational basis. It will always be a gimmick while it scales with willpower and not engi mainstat.

[Thayli]

Didn't people complain on live because some of the engi toys were targettable, making tab-target useless if several of them were around? I'm sure there was a patch that made them non-targettable.

It's a tradeoff, though. Either you have something that shoots you, which you can't shoot back. Or you have to tab to several targets to hit the Engineer but you can actually kill the turret that is hitting you from a mile away. I just find it annoying that I can kill the turret, but not the keg.

As for AoE cannons destroying turret/keg. I feel that is a separate issue and one that boils down to a numbers game.

[TenTonHammer]

If keg is to remain an out of party heal, it atleast needs to be targetable like turrent deployables to have more counter pay

furthermore i still dont agree that the ability should stack due to its AoE nature

[Glorian]

If keg is to remain an out of party heal, it atleast needs to be targetable like turrent deployables to have more counter pay

furthermore i still dont agree that the ability should stack due to its AoE nature

The Engineers has also the Rod and the Landmines. Where Landmines are similiar to that exploding Nurgling on Magus.
All three are untargetable. Being a deployable gimmik doesn't need it to be targetable.

[Tesq]

i think its' better move from the first point which keg differents from live and some which not, that make it better:

1) as any other skill which provide regen (that goes for exemple for chosen/kobs regen aura too) they can crit (with base crit chance for heals being 10%+5% due kobs tactic), this was differently from live. Where these type of effect didn't critted.

2) over ground effect such dissoving mist /engi counterpart and sh/am pot these type of skill cannot be removed due to have a long CD and not being moveable around ; such is keg.
Moreover they all also have a target cap (9ppl) and dosen't stack in case of dissolving mist and engi equivalent.

3) i am not sure if either keg stacked or not in live ( i think not due to point 2)

4) but regardless the chance of 10-15% crit that engi have coupled with the fact that regen ingore heal debuff make it quite powerfull

5) keg it's spambale ( in the sense : A) cannot be removed B)when duration end can be reactive immidiatly and in addition to that it have 5 sec of redeploy pre the duration end)

My solution would be 9 as cap limit, AOE regen, but not make it stackable.
A) this way multiple keg end became a X value for the whole warband if they are positioned well.( 2x keg heal 18 ppl ingoreing heal debuff instead 9 with the double of the value).
B)due to point A to either preserve the engi to remain relevant for wb play but also do not allow those situation where in close space the only ppl to take dmg are tanks which make the stack of the keg a very easy and op tools.(all stack; all ingore heal debuff, only 8-9 take taking aoe and keg are healing only those with out any countermeasure).
C) they still can crit and benefith from kobs crit increase (now 15% vs 20% pre nerf---> crit give 50% of the add value)
D) restric keg to party only dosen't make sense due to 1) magus mirror effect (magus have problems with its mirror but of other type) and 2)skill intent which is of course to support the aoe play of the wb (in fact it's on the aoe mastery it's neither core nor onto another mastery; regardless it feels as a too heavy nerf ( remove the chance to use it outside the party and either lower indirectly the cap to 6 ppl).
E) as said aegis have its own problem but rather than mirroring any implamantion would be better fix that directly instead.

[Glorian]

Yes, Kegs stacked at live.
Yes, you can keep up two kegs at a time in RoR. On AoR it was only one.
So with 10 secs cooldown and then a recast time both Kegs can be up for 3,5 secs so you get once a 300 health tic doubled.

I'm not sure on the crit or not crit part on AoR.