[Chosen] SnB Chosen vs SnB KoTBs

[Gachimuchi]

I decided to roll a chosen. At a glance, between the 20% crit chance and AoE snare given by knight seems to far outclass anything chosen can provide. People usually cite crippling strikes as being very good, but it doesn't stack with challenge, and also requires you to go 2 hander for the crit increase. Chosen also gets the AoE wounds debuff, but when most groups have at least 1 marauder it doesn't matter that much. What does chosen do that KoTBs can't?

[Toldavf]

Well since it isn't slotting those tactics for crit it has the virtue of always having the long punts and being more mobile thanks to unstoppable juganaught. All that extra crit comes at a price making you much easier to cc fact is with 3 tactic slots if you want to bring the extra crit you will lack something elsewhere .

Any good tank will see their primary role as most important and should work towards that first. If you punts are weaker than an enemies you will loose an even fight allot easier likewise if you lack the ability to shed a snare and get back within 30feet asap chances are vs a strong train your DPS will be in big trouble.

ATM chosen should have more damage however the armour sets where built to soft nerf specs with their high spirit resistance so chosen is a bit behind thanks to that. Long story short though ignore the knights utility focus on the bread and butter of tanking and you will be all good.

[roadkillrobin]

You can't really look at classes like that.
You have to look at the big picture and mirror the entire realm vs realm. You also can't compare AoE buffs/debuff to ST ones as they obviusly have better use in different situations.

For example. a tactic like Slice Trough, Black Orcs have a "better" version of with Big Brawling.

10+10 crit when breaking down into pure dps numbers can be mirrored on to tons of abillties for Destruction. 20% crit increase on moast classes is just 10% dmg increase. BW on full Comb gets a 30% dmg increase from this. while WH WL if they slot the tactic gets a 20% but the rest gets just 10%. If it's worth it depends on your group comp.

[TenTonHammer]

Crippling strikes doesn't stack with challenge but it does stack with you missed me

[Razid1987]

I decided to roll a chosen. At a glance, between the 20% crit chance and AoE snare given by knight seems to far outclass anything chosen can provide. People usually cite crippling strikes as being very good, but it doesn't stack with challenge, and also requires you to go 2 hander for the crit increase. Chosen also gets the AoE wounds debuff, but when most groups have at least 1 marauder it doesn't matter that much. What does chosen do that KoTBs can't?

- Single target 25% damage debuff
- 25% parry with 100% uptime (50% with suppression)
- Higher overall damage
- Spirit damage, instead of physical damage
- Aura that reflects spell damage
- AoE Wounds debuff (100% uptime)
- An AP drain
- A movement boost-tactic (Combine with Quake?)

[Vaul]

You can't really look at classes like that.
You have to look at the big picture and mirror the entire realm vs realm. You also can't compare AoE buffs/debuff to ST ones as they obviusly have better use in different situations.

For example. a tactic like Slice Trough, Black Orcs have a "better" version of with Big Brawling.

10+10 crit when breaking down into pure dps numbers can be mirrored on to tons of abillties for Destruction. 20% crit increase on moast classes is just 10% dmg increase. BW on full Comb gets a 30% dmg increase from this. while WH WL if they slot the tactic gets a 20% but the rest gets just 10%. If it's worth it depends on your group comp.

Not specifically regarding the OP here but it's not always wise to boil crit down to it's average dmg increase. A lot of things happen (proc) on a crit, and crits create more pressure situations. I know you know this, so just saying in general.

[Morf]

I have both a kotbs and chosen and first thing i would say before i get into your question chosen is alot less boring then kotbs mainly because chosen - debuffs and kotbs - buffs so you are more active and feel like you are actually doing something other then just following someone.

As for your question crippling strikes, ap drain, wounds debuff and destined for victory at lvl 39.
I would much prefer 20% crit (dt,ea) as a chosen thats for sure because crippling strikes doesnt stack with challenge and wounds debuff cab be group cleanse by wp's so the only reliable thing you currently have is an ap drain where as kotbs can run an extra 20% crit that cannot be removed/countered.
Saying all that i would still prefer to play my chosen and there is alot more to playing a tank then what buffs/debuffs you can bring.

[Bozzax]

DT is actually +10% crit to attacks plus +10% crits to heals. Secondly DT (and Leading Shots) are "tactic" and stack with other "ability" crit increasers such as IBs AF.

EA is also very strong (also "tactic"?) but not as cheesy

EDIT
I actually bug reported the +10% to critically heal of KOTBs DT and DOKs Murderous Intent on live but they never fixed it. Both has tool tips that says "to critically hit".

[Bozzax]

@OP
Chosen IMO bring the best M4 in the game Sprout C together with Destined For Victory tactic

(Note: KOTBs M3 No Escape is the best M3 in the game and I'd gladly swap SC and DFV for it)

[spikespiegel84]

Something like Renown mastery+Tzeentch's Reflection+jewelry+Hold the Line=98% Disrupt?

And when you disrupt you heal yourself, silence the caster and move 30% faster?

And with Backlash and Discordant Fluctuation plus what said above a BW kills himself while your health bar is filled?