PVP seems a bit too 'bursty'.

[saupreusse]

But still no argument to force people to spend renown points for a renown ability, instead of balancing CC durations.

Balancing CC? For what? Ther current system works fine, and you may spend years for balancing, will you have the result? Yeah, you going to make some classes less playable, thats all. CW/RD is about small-scale fights, 1/1 and 2/1 fights, those who have CW/RD most likely wins, but even so with the help of Pots+detaunt+flee button every single SW i meet on my WE could turn the situation in a benefit for him, like only 2 of them actualy did, the others going to act some bitching on about "NERRF NERF RD NOT FAIR NERF I RUN I SHOT SHE DIDNT DIE WHY". Here are my arguments, put flee on you pannel, then put RD icon on Buffhead < use ap pot - enjoy win, ltp issue, and no need in years of balancing.

The story with WE and SW is only an example, every class has its counter play now, by reworking CW/RD you guys going to move current 1/1 meta, and its very fragile, and you have no idea how it works, and whats the most sad thing, you have no idea how it should work. So stop bitching please, bad casual SW will keep suffering from WE with CW/RD and a bag of pots, nothing goes wrong with that.

You activated my trap card! You only care about your very specific we vs sw fight yet fail to see what luth was talking about. Its about how balancing the game with all these abilities around is a pretty hard thing to do because - "but with the right renown abilities i can do x" - is a valid argument. The renown abilities were a bandaid to cover flawed design choices and are in the way. Sadly we had them for too long already thats why everyone thinks the game breaks without them. I call bullshit the game worked on live just as borked as it did with those renown abilities. Also there are lots of premades that have used/use the rr abilities from what ive got from forum comments. Bout your fragile 1v1 meta: dont you think its already just a shadow of what it could be when you agree that the one who pops rd wins the duel? On live you had no chance ppl would duel you more then once after you popped some things like rd or cw.

[Theseus]

But still no argument to force people to spend renown points for a renown ability, instead of balancing CC durations.

Balancing CC? For what? Ther current system works fine, and you may spend years for balancing, will you have the result? Yeah, you going to make some classes less playable, thats all. CW/RD is about small-scale fights, 1/1 and 2/1 fights, those who have CW/RD most likely wins, but even so with the help of Pots+detaunt+flee button every single SW i meet on my WE could turn the situation in a benefit for him, like only 2 of them actualy did, the others going to act some bitching on about "NERRF NERF RD NOT FAIR NERF I RUN I SHOT SHE DIDNT DIE WHY". Here are my arguments, put flee on you pannel, then put RD icon on Buffhead < use ap pot - enjoy win, ltp issue, and no need in years of balancing.

The story with WE and SW is only an example, every class has its counter play now, by reworking CW/RD you guys going to move current 1/1 meta, and its very fragile, and you have no idea how it works, and whats the most sad thing, you have no idea how it should work. So stop bitching please, bad casual SW will keep suffering from WE with CW/RD and a bag of pots, nothing goes wrong with that.

You activated my trap card! You only care about your very specific we vs sw fight yet fail to see what luth was talking about. Its about how balancing the game with all these abilities around is a pretty hard thing to do because - "but with the right renown abilities i can do x" - is a valid argument. The renown abilities were a bandaid to cover flawed design choices and are in the way. Sadly we had them for too long already thats why everyone thinks the game breaks without them. I call bullshit the game worked on live just as borked as it did with those renown abilities. Also there are lots of premades that have used/use the rr abilities from what ive got from forum comments. Bout your fragile 1v1 meta: dont you think its already just a shadow of what it could be when you agree that the one who pops rd wins the duel? On live you had no chance ppl would duel you more then once after you popped some things like rd or cw.

Well I at least wouldnt duel someone twice who would use a cheesy trick as QE, RD or CW. Those abilites are just broken and too strong. There shouldnt be skills all classes have incommon... I even dont like it, that all mdps or rdps have certain skills in common.... but well thas another story. Fact is, someone who has to rely on those renownskills should really refrain rom telling other people to learn to play. Personally I´d rather loose than using such bandaids.

[sotora]

RD CW and the rest were Mythic giving up. They went down that road other lazy mmos have where abilities are open to all classes. That wasnt what war was. War wasnt about 1v1 but they went there due to lazy developing. 1.4 was a mess and you saw the largest pop drop since the early days. That was the final nail. Even player in my old guild that never came back still talk fondly of 1.3.6. Not because it was a great patch but because it was the last good state war was in.

I doubt it was laziness. It was propably lack of resources. To actually fix wide arraying problems in a good way you need enough people working on it, thinking how to do it, and then coding it.

It happens in all MMORPGs that are past their prime and on an increasingly shoestring budget. They try to fix/change many things with one solution. There is only so many you can do when you lack enough hands and brains numbers to work on it.

[Luth]

2. No one cares about 1vs1 balancing.

No need to remove RD then.

I didn't write that the renown abilities are used exclusively in 1vs1 and don't affect the overall balancing; someone else wrote it (and btw it's not true).

[sotora]

2. No one cares about 1vs1 balancing.

No need to remove RD then.

I didn't write that the renown abilities are used exclusively in 1vs1 and don't affect the overall balancing; someone else wrote it (and btw it's not true).

Most butthurt about RD I see is from 1v1 or other very small scale (1v2, 2v2, etc) perspective. Like one of posters that was mostly annoyed that renown skills are used offensively and not only defensively (like i.e. RD is supposed to be defesive only to begin with, says who?). Sorry but that is obvious microscale complaint.

[Luth]

The abilities can be used by anyone in any situation and therefore affect the overal balancing; for balance discussions/decisions that is the point that matters. Counting numbers on the forums is not a good base to judge something.

[Atropik]

Fact is, someone who has to rely on those renownskills should really refrain rom telling other people to learn to play. Personally I´d rather loose than using such bandaids.

Well, then you have to agree, that some classes are designed only for winning, while the others are only for losing. Will you play on the losing side? You seem to a brave warrior, but the others...

[Atropik]

The abilities can be used by anyone in any situation and therefore affect the overal balancing; for balance discussions/decisions that is the point that matters. Counting numbers on the forums is not a good base to judge something.

I can use melee crit on my Runnie, and it will have the same impact on WB fight as RD does for me on any class, in such a large scale. - Nothing.

6man roamers use rd/cw, they are always 45+ so, in addition to 45 crit point they pick up some rd/cw, mostly because they have nothing to pick up instead, thess guys are focused on making pressure over the time on Caledor Woods or on kiting puggers till death, they have no need in abilities on 5 min cd and only 1 single effect.

CW/RD are mostly the escape tools for soloers 2,3 men parties, as it always was. Gamebreaking? Not as much as EyeShot or Pounce or Destro Morale Pump, so who cares? Here we should stop the discussion.

[Theseus]

Fact is, someone who has to rely on those renownskills should really refrain rom telling other people to learn to play. Personally I´d rather loose than using such bandaids.

Well, then you have to agree, that some classes are designed only for winning, while the others are only for losing. Will you play on the losing side? You seem to a brave warrior, but the others...

Actually I dont have to agree on anything.^^

But to the point, I dont think, that some classes are made for winning and some for loosing. It isnt that simple. I agree, that on some classes it is easier to win one on one than on others. SW may be easier than WH, but you can win on both if you do it right and if you set the rules of the duel right. When I played my WH on live for example there were rules that both contenders start outside the line of sight. So if the WH played clever he could have his stealth. Only for example as a duel. If you play WE and you try to gank people, you should be able to use the terrain to your advantage. Always.

So playing without these Bandaids is fundamentally really a learn to play issue. We just got spoiled and lazy because of them.

[Atropik]

If you play WE and you try to gank people, you should be able to use the terrain to your advantage. Always

Let me qoute this sentence, i just need it to remember.