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Patch Notes 11/11/2020

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VindicoAtrum
Posts: 58

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#21 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:59 pm

"- Squig Armor: Cooldown reduced from 10s to 5s.
Matches cooldown on Marauder and Shadow Warrior stance switches. And this makes it easier to pop out of Squig Armor to for example dismount enemies, without having to stay outside of Squig Armor for a long time."

Sigh.

Just put 100 damage on squig leap, there's nothing wrong with reversing changes that weren't quite as expected. We don't force stance changes on aSW to dismount, why do we do it to mSH?

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xanderous
Posts: 484

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#22 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:59 pm

hammerhead wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:55 pm
This is not critical, but in this version, Hollow-Points loses any meaningful meaning. And the Quick Reloader stacks with the Expert Skirmisher :twisted:
Potentially MDPS version of engie incoming hehe
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Starkus RR68 BG Snaptz RR83 SH Plagueis RR81 Magus Alec RR82 Engie Sourgazt RR64 Shaman
Kreaver RR79 Marauder Dugald RR74 Slayer

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Grunbag
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Posts: 1847

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#23 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:00 pm

xanderous wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:57 pm
Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:45 pm
xanderous wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:43 pm


I was speaking in regards to the " to "Snipe and Gun blast now build up one second faster" not the AP part of the tactic
I got that . Again , the build up faster tactic replace te trash -35% AP cost tactic , which magus didn’t have (cause they have crit tactic instead) unless you are asking to remove crit tactic from magus havoc and add build up reducer ?
If you are saying you cannot add a tactic without removing something on the mastery tree then i suppose you could swap out "fiery winds" a fairly useless tactic imo, put "changers blessing" at the bottom and new tactic up top, chaos unleashed can sit in the middle, it would not effect builds as single target spec builds up past that anyway.
I am not sure the crit tactic will ever move down to 7 pts tactic for any career . And the goal is to replace useless -35% AP tactic from all career that had it , not to rework the masteries
Grunbag - 40 - 33 Squig Herder
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Sulorie
Posts: 5035

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#24 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:02 pm

Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:45 pm
xanderous wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:43 pm
Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:40 pm


Magus didn’t had the -35% AP stuff and have access easily to crit tactic in this tree , where engi have to spend 11 pts in tinkerer.
I was speaking in regards to the " to "Snipe and Gun blast now build up one second faster" not the AP part of the tactic
I got that . Again , the build up faster tactic replace te trash -35% AP cost tactic , which magus didn’t have (cause they have crit tactic instead) unless you are asking to remove crit tactic from magus havoc and add build up reducer ?
The -35% ap tactic nobody uses, so replacing it is a good idea. Magus got crit tactic at that place, which makes sense for ST tree. Engi having crit tactic in right tree makes actually little sense, because the tree is not about dealing high dmg.
I actually would suggest to move the crit tactic to Rifleman tree to match magus and give some other tactic to Tinkerer 11pt.

The cast time reduction on the other hand adds too much dps to a already strong range dps tree.
Dying is no option.

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Grunbag
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Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#25 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:04 pm

Sulorie wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:02 pm
Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:45 pm
xanderous wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:43 pm


I was speaking in regards to the " to "Snipe and Gun blast now build up one second faster" not the AP part of the tactic
I got that . Again , the build up faster tactic replace te trash -35% AP cost tactic , which magus didn’t have (cause they have crit tactic instead) unless you are asking to remove crit tactic from magus havoc and add build up reducer ?
The -35% ap tactic nobody uses, so replacing it is a good idea. Magus got crit tactic at that place, which makes sense for ST tree. Engi having crit tactic in right tree makes actually little sense, because the tree is not about dealing high dmg.
I actually would suggest to move the crit tactic to Rifleman tree to match magus and give some other tactic to Tinkerer 11pt.

The cast time reduction on the other hand adds too much dps to a already strong range dps tree.
We will actively look at te impact of this tactic , and take the results into consideration. Also I believe mythic places the crit tactic in tinkerer because it’s based on playing near turret (and tinkerer is a tree working around turret and gadget)
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emiliorv
Posts: 696

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#26 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:06 pm

Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:16 pm
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
junkxjunk wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:08 pm
diedrake wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:07 pm
hmm interesting changes, the SH change seems right as technically armor is a stance.

Not sure about engy changes but then again i don't play engy. Just to clarify, the engy lost the mine but magus still has it?

i guess the healing on turret/minion is good?

All in all interesting changes :)
No the tactic that increases buildup times is now on Flashbang instead of the mine.
It’s fair for both sides : it was a strong tactic for core, and not mirrored to magus. Now it require to invest points to get it.
In another hand , engineer doesn’t need to give free immune by using landmine to apply the build up increaser
Landmine cooldown is 15s
Flashbang granade cooldown is 10s
Disorient duration is 10s

So 5s less CD and free of inmunities...so yes, is a 100% uptime AoE cast increase +50%.

If destro was just being getting a hard time to compete in RDPS Vs order, giving this tool to the most played order RDPS is just....well, i have no words.

I´m wandering if order can reach a 100% winrate in forts with the right buffs...

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xanderous
Posts: 484

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#27 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:09 pm

Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:00 pm
xanderous wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:57 pm
Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:45 pm


I got that . Again , the build up faster tactic replace te trash -35% AP cost tactic , which magus didn’t have (cause they have crit tactic instead) unless you are asking to remove crit tactic from magus havoc and add build up reducer ?
If you are saying you cannot add a tactic without removing something on the mastery tree then i suppose you could swap out "fiery winds" a fairly useless tactic imo, put "changers blessing" at the bottom and new tactic up top, chaos unleashed can sit in the middle, it would not effect builds as single target spec builds up past that anyway.
I am not sure the crit tactic will ever move down to 7 pts tactic for any career . And the goal is to replace useless -35% AP tactic from all career that had it , not to rework the masteries
Thats fair enough i don't think the crit tactic being moved down that low would really change anything imo but if this change is motivated by mirroring stuff to some degree, magus won't have a build time reducer on "bolt of change" and "flickering red fire" giving technically engie advantage on burst dps race, assuming its even worth taking tactic vs keeping masterful aim as an example.
Bashgutz RR82 Borc Vaseryn RR61 SM Krantz RR82 Knight Corvinus RR70 Chosen Mormonty RR72 IB
Starkus RR68 BG Snaptz RR83 SH Plagueis RR81 Magus Alec RR82 Engie Sourgazt RR64 Shaman
Kreaver RR79 Marauder Dugald RR74 Slayer

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Grunbag
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Posts: 1847

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#28 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:12 pm

emiliorv wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:06 pm
Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:16 pm
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
junkxjunk wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:08 pm


No the tactic that increases buildup times is now on Flashbang instead of the mine.
It’s fair for both sides : it was a strong tactic for core, and not mirrored to magus. Now it require to invest points to get it.
In another hand , engineer doesn’t need to give free immune by using landmine to apply the build up increaser
Landmine cooldown is 15s
Flashbang granade cooldown is 10s
Disorient duration is 10s

So 5s less CD and free of inmunities...so yes, is a 100% uptime AoE cast increase +50%.

If destro was just being getting a hard time to compete in RDPS Vs order, giving this tool to the most played order RDPS is just....well, i have no words.

I´m wandering if order can reach a 100% winrate in forts with the right buffs...
Yes also Flashbang Grenade has 1 sec cast and need a target when landmine is instant ground target . And it moved from free core any engi build could have to a 11 pts spec tactic
Grunbag - 40 - 33 Squig Herder
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Zxul
Posts: 1007

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#29 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:16 pm

Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:00 pm
xanderous wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:57 pm
Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:45 pm


I got that . Again , the build up faster tactic replace te trash -35% AP cost tactic , which magus didn’t have (cause they have crit tactic instead) unless you are asking to remove crit tactic from magus havoc and add build up reducer ?
If you are saying you cannot add a tactic without removing something on the mastery tree then i suppose you could swap out "fiery winds" a fairly useless tactic imo, put "changers blessing" at the bottom and new tactic up top, chaos unleashed can sit in the middle, it would not effect builds as single target spec builds up past that anyway.
I am not sure the crit tactic will ever move down to 7 pts tactic for any career . And the goal is to replace useless -35% AP tactic from all career that had it , not to rework the masteries
The thing is how much dmg the new tactic adds. Snipe gets +33% dps, and spammable 100 ft range Gun Blast gets +25% dps. And unlike tactics like Expert Skirmisher, it has no melee range requirement, +unlike crits tactics it isn't effected by FS.

+Unlike rSH which has a similar tactic, engi had a +25% range and +40% dmg from full pet stacks, to add to that- compared to rSH +10% range OR +5% crit chance.
emiliorv wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:06 pm
Grunbag wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:16 pm
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
junkxjunk wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 3:08 pm


No the tactic that increases buildup times is now on Flashbang instead of the mine.
It’s fair for both sides : it was a strong tactic for core, and not mirrored to magus. Now it require to invest points to get it.
In another hand , engineer doesn’t need to give free immune by using landmine to apply the build up increaser
Landmine cooldown is 15s
Flashbang granade cooldown is 10s
Disorient duration is 10s

So 5s less CD and free of inmunities...so yes, is a 100% uptime AoE cast increase +50%.

If destro was just being getting a hard time to compete in RDPS Vs order, giving this tool to the most played order RDPS is just....well, i have no words.

I´m wandering if order can reach a 100% winrate in forts with the right buffs...
Heh a good point there.
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

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Grunbag
Project Team
Posts: 1847

Re: Patch Notes 11/11/2020

Post#30 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:19 pm

Guys , I understand you worry and like theorycrafting , but it would be nice to have you actually testing it for several days and give a real feedback ?
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