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Patch Notes 24/02/2023

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Dackjanielz
Posts: 50

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#111 » Wed Mar 01, 2023 5:04 pm

NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:25 pm
Dackjanielz wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:05 pm
NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 3:18 am

So now you can que in solo discordant and avoid them.
Except when ever i have a friend who's in Skirmish i'm not allowed to be in there now.

Lets say i have 10 friends online.
Apparently i now have to PM every single one of them when i log on and ask them if they're in skirmish or not and if ANY say the answer is yes i'm not allowed to join the mode until they are finished.

Feels like if i so much as make eye contact with other players on my team in there i could potentially be banned for it - That's the world we live in now.

It's sucked the joy out of the experience somewhat.

Ok, let's follow up:
- you have a friend you want to play scenarios with. How do you contact them?
- you have ten friends who you can potentially queue with. How do you contact them?

Having 10 friends online means you have no problem with forming a party to be in same scenario every time. The real question is: do you want to play some scenarios or do you want to farm them with your friends?

What sucked the joy out of the experience somewhat is that discordant skirmish, which was supposed to be solo/pug experience (as opposed to premade heavy normal scenarios) was dominated by duo/full party setup that was too afraid to join normal scs because then they'd be fighting against other like-minded individuals.

The line is clear: duo, trio, six men - those are premade teams and they deserve to fight on equal terms. Loosing sucks, I get it - but why does your sucky experience outweighs other players who explicitly join s o l o que?

The issue (and situation we're in right now) was caused by players abusing the system for their own personal gain - and, same as xp scrolls for example - ruin the fun for everyone. It's not about "so much as make eye contact with other players on my team in there i could potentially be banned for it" - it's about abusing queue system (and discord) to farm noobs/pugs.
How do i contact them? i don't understand this question at all, i literally said PMing them - what do you think i meant??
I don't have 10 friends it was simply an example of why this line of regulation is going too far.

How on earth is someone with a SINGLE FRIEND classed as a HARDCORE ABUSIVE PUG FARMING PREMADE - Exactly?
So now me and my friend who are both casual pug players are expected to be thrown back to the wolves in normal SC's to the genuine abusive gamers of ROR

We're being punished for something we didn't do.

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NSKaneda
Posts: 957

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#112 » Wed Mar 01, 2023 5:23 pm

Kpi wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:52 pm
NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:25 pm
Spoiler:
Dackjanielz wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:05 pm

Except when ever i have a friend who's in Skirmish i'm not allowed to be in there now.

Lets say i have 10 friends online.
Apparently i now have to PM every single one of them when i log on and ask them if they're in skirmish or not and if ANY say the answer is yes i'm not allowed to join the mode until they are finished.

Feels like if i so much as make eye contact with other players on my team in there i could potentially be banned for it - That's the world we live in now.

It's sucked the joy out of the experience somewhat.

Ok, let's follow up:
- you have a friend you want to play scenarios with. How do you contact them?
- you have ten friends who you can potentially queue with. How do you contact them?

Having 10 friends online means you have no problem with forming a party to be in same scenario every time. The real question is: do you want to play some scenarios or do you want to farm them with your friends?

What sucked the joy out of the experience somewhat is that discordant skirmish, which was supposed to be solo/pug experience (as opposed to premade heavy normal scenarios) was dominated by duo/full party setup that was too afraid to join normal scs because then they'd be fighting against other like-minded individuals.

The line is clear: duo, trio, six men - those are premade teams and they deserve to fight on equal terms. Loosing sucks, I get it - but why does your sucky experience outweighs other players who explicitly join s o l o que?

The issue (and situation we're in right now) was caused by players abusing the system for their own personal gain - and, same as xp scrolls for example - ruin the fun for everyone. It's not about "so much as make eye contact with other players on my team in there i could potentially be banned for it" - it's about abusing queue system (and discord) to farm noobs/pugs.
You forgot an important thing... there are similar number of duos in both sides, and the duos counter each other.

It is easy form duos for casual players or when you have only time to play 3-4 SCs, but it is hard do 6 man for casuals or if u will play from a short period of time

Precisely - premades cancel each other out. Not really PUG experience, is it?

Besides, please, don't act like you can't join normal scenario que with your wife or a friend in duo group - because you can and frankly you'd have higher pop rate this way. Of course you won't win that often but that's not the issue you're rising here now, is it? You want to queue as duo. You can.

Normal scenarios are not strictly full party mode. You can even join them as solo...

-
-

Dackjanielz wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 5:04 pm How do i contact them? i don't understand this question at all, i literally said PMing them - what do you think i meant??
I don't have 10 friends it was simply an example of why this line of regulation is going too far.

How on earth is someone with a SINGLE FRIEND classed as a HARDCORE ABUSIVE PUG FARMING PREMADE - Exactly?
So now me and my friend who are both casual pug players are expected to be thrown back to the wolves in normal SC's to the genuine abusive gamers of ROR

We're being punished for something we didn't do.


What I mean is: if you happen to find yourself in same DS scenario as your friend/guildie of course you can contact them, assist them and, well, play as you're supposed to play in every scenario regardless of initial setup. HOWEVER if you find yourself contacting said friend in three, four or five scenarios in a row then be prepared to be called on shenanigans because there's a thin but clear line between coincidence and intent.

Please, be honest with yourself as to the reasons of your outrage. Coordinated duo in pug que is as impactful as full premade against three random duos.

You want to pug? Queue as pug. You want to play with a friend? Join team play queue. How is it classed as hardcore abusive pug farming premade? Ask those hardcore abusive pug farming premades that did it for months. Or remind yourself how we're not allowed to use xp reduction scrolls any more and why. Or why there are no napalm/blast pots any more. Or why... We've all been punished for actions of abusers. That's how it works and that's what choosing easy way will get you every damn time.
RoR: Burszui SH, Ropopuch SHM<|[]|>Ginnar IB, Vidarr HMR, Runatyr RP ++ REV guild ++
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *

Dackjanielz
Posts: 50

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#113 » Wed Mar 01, 2023 6:22 pm

NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 5:23 pm
Kpi wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:52 pm
NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:25 pm
Spoiler:



Ok, let's follow up:
- you have a friend you want to play scenarios with. How do you contact them?
- you have ten friends who you can potentially queue with. How do you contact them?

Having 10 friends online means you have no problem with forming a party to be in same scenario every time. The real question is: do you want to play some scenarios or do you want to farm them with your friends?

What sucked the joy out of the experience somewhat is that discordant skirmish, which was supposed to be solo/pug experience (as opposed to premade heavy normal scenarios) was dominated by duo/full party setup that was too afraid to join normal scs because then they'd be fighting against other like-minded individuals.

The line is clear: duo, trio, six men - those are premade teams and they deserve to fight on equal terms. Loosing sucks, I get it - but why does your sucky experience outweighs other players who explicitly join s o l o que?

The issue (and situation we're in right now) was caused by players abusing the system for their own personal gain - and, same as xp scrolls for example - ruin the fun for everyone. It's not about "so much as make eye contact with other players on my team in there i could potentially be banned for it" - it's about abusing queue system (and discord) to farm noobs/pugs.
You forgot an important thing... there are similar number of duos in both sides, and the duos counter each other.

It is easy form duos for casual players or when you have only time to play 3-4 SCs, but it is hard do 6 man for casuals or if u will play from a short period of time

Precisely - premades cancel each other out. Not really PUG experience, is it?

Besides, please, don't act like you can't join normal scenario que with your wife or a friend in duo group - because you can and frankly you'd have higher pop rate this way. Of course you won't win that often but that's not the issue you're rising here now, is it? You want to queue as duo. You can.

Normal scenarios are not strictly full party mode. You can even join them as solo...

-
-

Dackjanielz wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 5:04 pm How do i contact them? i don't understand this question at all, i literally said PMing them - what do you think i meant??
I don't have 10 friends it was simply an example of why this line of regulation is going too far.

How on earth is someone with a SINGLE FRIEND classed as a HARDCORE ABUSIVE PUG FARMING PREMADE - Exactly?
So now me and my friend who are both casual pug players are expected to be thrown back to the wolves in normal SC's to the genuine abusive gamers of ROR

We're being punished for something we didn't do.


What I mean is: if you happen to find yourself in same DS scenario as your friend/guildie of course you can contact them, assist them and, well, play as you're supposed to play in every scenario regardless of initial setup. HOWEVER if you find yourself contacting said friend in three, four or five scenarios in a row then be prepared to be called on shenanigans because there's a thin but clear line between coincidence and intent.

Please, be honest with yourself as to the reasons of your outrage. Coordinated duo in pug que is as impactful as full premade against three random duos.

You want to pug? Queue as pug. You want to play with a friend? Join team play queue. How is it classed as hardcore abusive pug farming premade? Ask those hardcore abusive pug farming premades that did it for months. Or remind yourself how we're not allowed to use xp reduction scrolls any more and why. Or why there are no napalm/blast pots any more. Or why... We've all been punished for actions of abusers. That's how it works and that's what choosing easy way will get you every damn time.
No one hates premaders more than i do and the fact that we are being accused of being them i find so ...Distasteful.
What next we start banning people for using a keyboard?

User avatar
NSKaneda
Posts: 957

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#114 » Wed Mar 01, 2023 6:26 pm

Dackjanielz wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 6:22 pm No one hates premaders more than i do and the fact that we are being accused of being them i find so ...Distasteful.
What next we start banning people for using a keyboard?

Cool, so we agree - if you dislike premades you can join as solo in pug environment. Glad we've came to this conclusion together.
Automated keyboard (and mouse for that matter) usage is already in ToS.

Good talk :geek:
RoR: Burszui SH, Ropopuch SHM<|[]|>Ginnar IB, Vidarr HMR, Runatyr RP ++ REV guild ++
Live: Karak Izor -> Karak Norn - Yarpaen IB, Ginnarr SL, Volundr ENG +Ithilmar's Chosen+
* * * playing 19 classes - running out of char slots * * *

Dackjanielz
Posts: 50

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#115 » Wed Mar 01, 2023 7:04 pm

NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 6:26 pm
Dackjanielz wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 6:22 pm No one hates premaders more than i do and the fact that we are being accused of being them i find so ...Distasteful.
What next we start banning people for using a keyboard?

Cool, so we agree - if you dislike premades you can join as solo in pug environment. Glad we've came to this conclusion together.
Automated keyboard (and mouse for that matter) usage is already in ToS.

Good talk :geek:
You haven't "won" any discussion here, you have simply hand waved it.

Caduceus
Posts: 614

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#116 » Thu Mar 02, 2023 9:54 am

A lot of folks find it weird that they cannot queue for discordant when even one of their guildies is queueing also.

I have a proposal that could reduce the effects of queue stacking (which seems to be the fear behind these kinds of rules):

Make the system create less 12v12 and more 6v6. I think it would be good for the game in general if there are more scenarios going on at any given time, because this reduces the amount of times people get queued with the same players over and over.

It might give players more incentive to queue, even when they lose, because there's a better chance of facing a different team in the next spin.

Queue stacking also becomes less effective.

This could even be extended to regular SCs as well, so premades who spin into stronger premades don't get defeated by the same team over and over.
"I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream; that's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor... and surviving." - Colonel Walter E. Kurtz

Everdin
Posts: 395

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#117 » Thu Mar 02, 2023 10:28 am

NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:25 pm
Dackjanielz wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 4:05 pm
NSKaneda wrote: Wed Mar 01, 2023 3:18 am

So now you can que in solo discordant and avoid them.
Except when ever i have a friend who's in Skirmish i'm not allowed to be in there now.

Lets say i have 10 friends online.
Apparently i now have to PM every single one of them when i log on and ask them if they're in skirmish or not and if ANY say the answer is yes i'm not allowed to join the mode until they are finished.

Feels like if i so much as make eye contact with other players on my team in there i could potentially be banned for it - That's the world we live in now.

It's sucked the joy out of the experience somewhat.

Ok, let's follow up:
- you have a friend you want to play scenarios with. How do you contact them?
- you have ten friends who you can potentially queue with. How do you contact them?

Having 10 friends online means you have no problem with forming a party to be in same scenario every time. The real question is: do you want to play some scenarios or do you want to farm them with your friends?

What sucked the joy out of the experience somewhat is that discordant skirmish, which was supposed to be solo/pug experience (as opposed to premade heavy normal scenarios) was dominated by duo/full party setup that was too afraid to join normal scs because then they'd be fighting against other like-minded individuals.

The line is clear: duo, trio, six men - those are premade teams and they deserve to fight on equal terms. Loosing sucks, I get it - but why does your sucky experience outweighs other players who explicitly join s o l o que?

The issue (and situation we're in right now) was caused by players abusing the system for their own personal gain - and, same as xp scrolls for example - ruin the fun for everyone. It's not about "so much as make eye contact with other players on my team in there i could potentially be banned for it" - it's about abusing queue system (and discord) to farm noobs/pugs.
I'm not playing since the beginning of this project, but as long as I play, pug sc was queable for duos, not only solos, duos!

Just because solo people call it a solo SC doesn't mean it was meant to be a solo SC.

And in fact the hurdle to play as a duo against full premades is much bigger then the hurdle to take to play with solos against duos. Solo/duo que worked fine for years, but since some snowflakes got a feet in the door with their "I feel offended by multiplayer content"-attitude, there will be more and more stupid demands until this project is gone due to leaving players.
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“A man can fail many times, but he isn't a failure until he begins to blame somebody else.”

― John Burroughs

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Asderas27
Posts: 180

Re: Patch Notes 24/02/2023

Post#118 » Thu Mar 02, 2023 12:50 pm

Can't wait to see next reason for getting farmed.
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