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Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Black Guard, Sorceress, Witch Elf, Disciple of Khaine

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Zxul
Posts: 963

Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#1 » Tue Sep 22, 2020 6:05 pm

Lvling my WE a time, and looking at options for defensive specs while still have enough dmg the following looks interesting- wonder if anyone tried it.

https://builder.returnofreckoning.com/c ... ,6050,5611

(Still not sure what I will use as secondary tree).

The idea is to stack MoM + aa haste on equip- conq shoulders +1/2 more, vanq boots + 1/2 more (potentially replace with 2-4 triumphant), and aa haste jewelry. Combined with MoM, it gives +85% total aa haste, which then combined with bb/be 2.7 speed main hand should add a nice dmg to WB build.

Rest of ren/equip defensive- full toughness/regen/parry.

Rotation something like opener from stealth or AW to build 1 point- Heart Render Toxin (free extra ailment to cover good stuff is nice) which triggers MoM- Wracking Pains- Envenomed Blade x3- silence/Sever Blessing/AW for 1 more point- WB- Sever Blessing/AW spam with occasional Envenomed Blade to renew dot.
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

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Wdova
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Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#2 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:19 am

I havent tried that actualy, but since Witchbrew has internal cooldown now, AA haste up to85% has no effect actualy.
Curently running wb spec with brute force, increasing pain, frenzied mayhem, taste of blood( not sure if those 2 last tactics stack for finisher) if does 40% dmg boost for all finishers including witchbrew and 15% for everything else seems nice.
I will definitely try AA haste spec coupled withpierce armor and bleeding edge tactic for some serious armor penetration when I get better gear. Curently run i full conq+3pc genesis... uh.
Pigbutcher - Choppa RR80+

Zxul
Posts: 963

Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#3 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:36 am

Wdova wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:19 am
I havent tried that actualy, but since Witchbrew has internal cooldown now, AA haste up to85% has no effect actualy.
Curently running wb spec with brute force, increasing pain, frenzied mayhem, taste of blood( not sure if those 2 last tactics stack for finisher) if does 40% dmg boost for all finishers including witchbrew and 15% for everything else seems nice.
I will definitely try AA haste spec coupled withpierce armor and bleeding edge tactic for some serious armor penetration when I get better gear. Curently run i full conq+3pc genesis... uh.
Yep, the idea is to use aa haste for straight up aa dmg (which is why slow base speed main hand) + more kisses+ possibly weapon procs (for example, armor debuff), without having to spec Sacrificial Stab, so you get dmg from both aa haste and from WB. +without having to use more than 2 tactics for dmg, since I want heal on kiss+ absorb in.

Besides 2-3 vanq, shouldn't require any high gear- aa haste jewelry is easy to get. Not sure what is better between 2 vanq/2 conq/2 merc for 3 str set bonuses+ regen from merc chest, or 3 vanq/3 conq for 2 wounds bonuses.
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

Krima
Posts: 334

Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#4 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:37 am

Wdova wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:19 am
I havent tried that actualy, but since Witchbrew has internal cooldown now, AA haste up to85% has no effect actualy.
Curently running wb spec with brute force, increasing pain, frenzied mayhem, taste of blood( not sure if those 2 last tactics stack for finisher) if does 40% dmg boost for all finishers including witchbrew and 15% for everything else seems nice.
I will definitely try AA haste spec coupled withpierce armor and bleeding edge tactic for some serious armor penetration when I get better gear. Curently run i full conq+3pc genesis... uh.
FM and taste of blood do not stack atm. Should of I guess...

@Zxul
Witchbrew has ICD of 0.5 secs.

In order to benefit from WB procing faster you would need AA speed less than 1.5. I would say 1.0. Its just not worth wasting alot of stuff to get AA haste. The daggers here in ROR are freaking slow - standard 2.4 speed or more. Daggers should be the fastest weapons in the game.

WEs needs the fast daggers in order to proc more kisses and WB procs.
Krima RR 80
Playing Witch Elf only since Live :twisted:

Zxul
Posts: 963

Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#5 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:50 am

Krima wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:37 am
In order to benefit from WB procing faster you would need AA speed less than 1.5. I would say 1.0. Its just not worth wasting alot of stuff to get AA haste. The daggers here in ROR are freaking slow - standard 2.4 speed or more. Daggers should be the fastest weapons in the game.

WEs needs the fast daggers in order to proc more kisses and WB procs.
Taking 2.7 speed dagger, with 85% aa haste it will have speed of 2.7/1.85=1.46. While however still hitting as hard as slow 2.7 speed weapon does. The idea is to benefit from both aa haste dmg boost, and from procs.
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

Sulorie
Posts: 4973

Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#6 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 12:01 pm

Zxul wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:36 am
Wdova wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:19 am
I havent tried that actualy, but since Witchbrew has internal cooldown now, AA haste up to85% has no effect actualy.
Curently running wb spec with brute force, increasing pain, frenzied mayhem, taste of blood( not sure if those 2 last tactics stack for finisher) if does 40% dmg boost for all finishers including witchbrew and 15% for everything else seems nice.
I will definitely try AA haste spec coupled withpierce armor and bleeding edge tactic for some serious armor penetration when I get better gear. Curently run i full conq+3pc genesis... uh.
Yep, the idea is to use aa haste for straight up aa dmg (which is why slow base speed main hand) + more kisses+ possibly weapon procs (for example, armor debuff), without having to spec Sacrificial Stab, so you get dmg from both aa haste and from WB. +without having to use more than 2 tactics for dmg, since I want heal on kiss+ absorb in.

Besides 2-3 vanq, shouldn't require any high gear- aa haste jewelry is easy to get. Not sure what is better between 2 vanq/2 conq/2 merc for 3 str set bonuses+ regen from merc chest, or 3 vanq/3 conq for 2 wounds bonuses.
When you go down the AA speed path, I wonder why you want to skip SacStab. It doesn't give aa speed, it gives aa damage. ;)

When it's all about 1vs1, then you could most likely need +2 sov bonus to grab both WB and SS.
Dying is no option.

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Wdova
Posts: 552
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Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#7 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 2:30 pm

Honestly without weapon skill investment, pierce armor and bleeding edge tactic, your AAs even at 2.7 speed wep. gonna hit like wett noodle. Only usefull is procing more witchbrews and kisses.
Anyway Test it and give us info how it goes. I am curious :-)

Edit:
FM and taste of blood do not stack atm. Should of I guess
.

I was vorried about that. I think keeping taste of blood is better than FM, because it increase all of Your attacks by 15% and not only finishers. I am using SR most of the time anyway for bit more survivability.
Pigbutcher - Choppa RR80+

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KissShot
Posts: 89
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Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#8 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 3:32 pm

Wdova wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 2:30 pm
Honestly without weapon skill investment, pierce armor and bleeding edge tactic, your AAs even at 2.7 speed wep. gonna hit like wett noodle. Only usefull is procing more witchbrews and kisses.
Anyway Test it and give us info how it goes. I am curious :-)

Edit:
FM and taste of blood do not stack atm. Should of I guess
.

I was vorried about that. I think keeping taste of blood is better than FM, because it increase all of Your attacks by 15% and not only finishers. I am using SR most of the time anyway for bit more survivability.
Armor meta = AAs aren't that great without armor piercing. I was a fan of SS/Haste/MoM builds until I realized in most real fights (not you blowing up some engi or BW) stacking AA damage/speed provides little value.

I do still strongly think that if armor meta ever goes away, an SS/AA build will be the best; I think it's the most fun build for a WE regardless of its effectiveness.

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Zxul
Posts: 963

Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#9 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 10:41 pm

Sulorie wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 12:01 pm
When you go down the AA speed path, I wonder why you want to skip SacStab. It doesn't give aa speed, it gives aa damage. ;)

When it's all about 1vs1, then you could most likely need +2 sov bonus to grab both WB and SS.
Should learn not to trust builder :) And as for using sov for +2 bonus, you might be getting both WB and SS, but you will be missing 20% aa speed from 2 other sets. And to speak of, I missed that inv/sov gloves give another 10% aa haste, so can stack it to 95% with MoM.
KissShot wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 3:32 pm
Armor meta = AAs aren't that great without armor piercing. I was a fan of SS/Haste/MoM builds until I realized in most real fights (not you blowing up some engi or BW) stacking AA damage/speed provides little value.

I do still strongly think that if armor meta ever goes away, an SS/AA build will be the best; I think it's the most fun build for a WE regardless of its effectiveness.
Ya will likely got Carnage secondary with this build for ws/armor ignore.
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

Sulorie
Posts: 4973

Re: Hybrid WB/aa haste WE spec.

Post#10 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:15 am

Zxul wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 10:41 pm
Sulorie wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 12:01 pm
When you go down the AA speed path, I wonder why you want to skip SacStab. It doesn't give aa speed, it gives aa damage. ;)

When it's all about 1vs1, then you could most likely need +2 sov bonus to grab both WB and SS.
Should learn not to trust builder :) And as for using sov for +2 bonus, you might be getting both WB and SS, but you will be missing 20% aa speed from 2 other sets. And to speak of, I missed that inv/sov gloves give another 10% aa haste, so can stack it to 95% with MoM.

You can use 6pc sov plus 2 single armor pieces with 10% aa speed each if you want. Didn't check whether aa speed is on same pieces.
Dying is no option.

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