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[Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Black Guard, Sorceress, Witch Elf, Disciple of Khaine

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emiliorv
Posts: 831

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#11 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:04 am

Atropik wrote:
Mon Nov 30, 2020 12:53 pm
emiliorv wrote:
Mon Nov 30, 2020 11:32 am
Gloom of night:
-move to destruction tree
-make it instant
-Reduce cooldown to 5s (can be reduced with CD reducers)
-Reduce duration
-Reduce dmg
Youve just described how ignite potion works xd
Really was thinking in inevitable doom => that 2 spells works the same way...but in current state GoN is crap and ID is working fine. So, if you change GoN to make it work like ID probably worth.
teiloh wrote:
Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:52 pm
Rampage is overrated, RUN AWAY! was hands down the best tactic in the game.

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ScumFM
Posts: 16

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#12 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 10:22 am

Reducing the cooldown of GoN to 5s would make it fit into the "circle the enemy blob" rotation with IW, Ice Spikes and occasionally a one-tick Shadow Knives.

"Reduce duration/reduce damage"? Reduced to 5 sec? Or to keep multiple GoN up at the same time? And damage reduced proportionally to the duration, so the damage per tick remains the same?

emiliorv
Posts: 831

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#13 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 6:44 pm

ScumFM wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 10:22 am
Reducing the cooldown of GoN to 5s would make it fit into the "circle the enemy blob" rotation with IW, Ice Spikes and occasionally a one-tick Shadow Knives.

"Reduce duration/reduce damage"? Reduced to 5 sec? Or to keep multiple GoN up at the same time? And damage reduced proportionally to the duration, so the damage per tick remains the same?
If you make it instant and reduce CD to 5 secs could be "spammable" using cd reducers (same as inevitable doom), so will need to reduce duration (15 secs is too much if can be spammable) and also reduce dmg to not make it OP, probably will need to reduce dmg per tick (will need to be tested).
If you get cd reducers from grp could more than 1 GoN on different targets running at same time....
teiloh wrote:
Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:52 pm
Rampage is overrated, RUN AWAY! was hands down the best tactic in the game.

Aezron
Posts: 32

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#14 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 6:21 pm

I quite like the suggestions I posted on the first page regarding Shadow Knives, Black Horror, and Gloom of Night.
Now I've thought a bit more about Shades of Death, and come up with some ideas to change and/or improve the skill. There might also be a combination of the effects below, that together make a nice skill. I'll just list all of them below, in no particular order.

Idea 1:
100 ft instant cast, 20(?) seconds CD.
Damage the target for a moderate amount, and knocking the target back a medium distance.
(Think Backdraft from BW, but single target and instant single target damage)

Idea 2:
100 ft instant cast, 20(?) seconds CD.
Damage the target for a moderate/high amount, knocking away allies within 30 ft of the target a medium distance. Also slowing the target and the affected allies by 20(?)% for 5(?) seconds.
(Used to isolate a target from e.g. guarding tanks, to enable the Agony Single Target tree to deal immediate single target damage. Damage on the skill to not make it completely useless if target is already isolated).

Idea 3:
100 ft instant cast, 5(?) seconds CD.
For the next 10 seconds, each time the target is affected by a skill, damage the target by a moderate amount.
(Works both on direct damage/heals, and initial application of DoTs/HoTs but not the ticks. Also works on buffs, like shields etc.)

Idea 4:
100 ft instant cast, 20(?) seconds CD, undefendable(?).
For the next 10 seconds, the target's resistances are reduced by X amount and the target cannot defend any attacks.
(All resistances are reduced, same scaling as standard like Wrath of Hoeth or Glean Magic. Unable to block/disrupt/parry/dodge)

Idea 5:
100 ft instant cast, 10(?) seconds CD.
For the next 5 seconds, when the target is facing you, target takes heavy damage every second.
(Mechanics like Hold the Line, but reverse and inverted. If target is facing you, meaning you are in front of them in a 180 degree angle, they take heavy damage every second. If they face away, they take no damage.
If damage is too high, switch some damage to utility, like: Target takes moderate damage every second and loses 10(?) AP every second)

Idea 6:
100 ft instant cast, 20(?) seconds CD.
Damage the target for a moderate/high amount, for the next 10 seconds increase the target's change to be critically hit by 10(?)%.
(10% flat. Fills a similar role as the current skill, but more useful and scales with the class mechanic)

Idea 7:
100 ft instant cast, 10(?) seconds CD.
Interrupt target, the target is disoriented for 5 seconds. If the target was successfully interrupted, damage the target by a high amount.
(If target was not interrupted, no damage is applied, the disorient is always applied though)

Idea 8:
5 ft range/melee(?), 5(?) seconds CD.
You touch the target with a freezing touch, dealing moderate damage and increasing their cooldowns by 5 seconds for 5 seconds duration.
If the target is affected by Chillwind, deal high damage and increase their cooldowns by 5 seconds for 10 seconds duration.
(Not sure how it is balance wise with melee range, but it suits the theme of the ability and also plays into the Sorceress cinematic freezing ability close to her)

Do you have other ideas to improve Shades of Death? Preferably other ideas than just increasing its damage (even though that of course also is a good solution).

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teiloh
Posts: 541

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#15 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:32 pm

Gloom of Night, if made instant, would be by far the strongest DOT and most damaging GCD in the game.

Shades of Death is a waste of a GCD. It used to crit and add 1.5x contribution to every single tick, leading to 1200+x5 in an instant which was hilarious if you didn't stack resists. If it were to be change, simply upping the damage would probably be the easiest change.

Shadow Knives has its uses because unlike POS, it can stack. That and it has a generally better targeting setup. Destro can also stack double AOE Corp debuffs to -780+
-- In the grim darkness of Warhammer Online, there is only Destrukaren asking for Rampage nerf.

Caduceus
Posts: 147

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#16 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 8:23 pm

What Sorc could really use is some stronger CC.

Perhaps reduce the cast time and damage of Arctic Blast to make it more viable as a CC. Or perhaps give Sorc a ranged KD like BW. It makes little sense that a AoE/warband focused class like BW gets CC, while a ST/small-scale focused class like Sorc does not.

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teiloh
Posts: 541

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#17 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 8:50 pm

Caduceus wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 8:23 pm
What Sorc could really use is some stronger CC.

Perhaps reduce the cast time and damage of Arctic Blast to make it more viable as a CC. Or perhaps give Sorc a ranged KD like BW. It makes little sense that a AoE/warband focused class like BW gets CC, while a ST/small-scale focused class like Sorc does not.
BW do not get KD in their AOE spec and their KD is just a meme/trolling ability. Sorc gets Disarm and Snare, core.
-- In the grim darkness of Warhammer Online, there is only Destrukaren asking for Rampage nerf.

Caduceus
Posts: 147

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#18 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 8:54 pm

teiloh wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 8:50 pm


BW do not get KD in their AOE spec and their KD is just a meme/trolling ability. Sorc gets Disarm and Snare, core.

I'd like to see Sorc get KD.

Disarm/Silence is not the same as stopping someone from moving like KD. I think Sorc needs a defensive tool like that.

Snare is not great defensively. The cast-time is too long. It's useful for snaring someone in a blob to ruin their day.

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teiloh
Posts: 541

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#19 » Mon Dec 21, 2020 10:01 pm

Caduceus wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 8:54 pm

I'd like to see Sorc get KD.

Disarm/Silence is not the same as stopping someone from moving like KD. I think Sorc needs a defensive tool like that.

Snare is not great defensively. The cast-time is too long. It's useful for snaring someone in a blob to ruin their day.
Ranged KDs were already one-way mirrored to Destro, Order would have get some CC to compensate.
-- In the grim darkness of Warhammer Online, there is only Destrukaren asking for Rampage nerf.

emiliorv
Posts: 831

Re: [Sorcerer] Sub-par skills?

Post#20 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:19 am

teiloh wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:32 pm
Gloom of Night, if made instant, would be by far the strongest DOT and most damaging GCD in the game.
Why? (with reduced dmg/duration)
teiloh wrote:
Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:52 pm
Rampage is overrated, RUN AWAY! was hands down the best tactic in the game.

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