Mighty Soul Removed?!

[Uchoo]

In this game classes have light/medium/heavy armor. In this game you rely on your party/warband to assist with teamwork to take down targets. If a target is of a light or medium armor class, you or someone else in the group can armour debuff them; combine that with your strength buffs, toughness debuffs and resis debuffs (good with blazing blade now), and your damage is optimal for assisting targets, even soloing the ones caught out. Yes shammies kite...however being one of two tanks in the party, you have a snare (aoe with tactic) you can constantly reapply, a knockdown and even a m1 root. If they keep running, they are not using cast time abilities

Hard for any tank or dps to solo kill a good/geared healer in endgame (city).

It's cool that you're learning the game and having so much fun, but I recommend you look into the buffs and debuffs that Swordmasters use as well. Your opinion seems quite grandiose for the level of knowledge you seem to be displaying.

Swordmasters have the biggest spirit debuff in the game, it has to be timed with other abilities in the second stance so not to mess with optimal rotations (snare, aoe interrupt). Along with a random resis buff and stat steal may/may not benefit the group. They have a pure dps tree and tactics like the IB's. Knights bring all the other debuffs and buffs the other two tanks don't, they fall short in the level of dps IB's and SM's can do in cities, but do just enough with the right gear to assist dps in the warband well enough to increase the ceiling of damage compared to not having one 2h in the warband. I feel like some players are quick to point the finger at issues when they don't fully understand the class they are playing. I wanna see buffs to the class especially with auras, but the crying over mighty soul is over the top, never ran it and my damage is fine. My damage might even be better now that blazing blade doesn't require a tactic to turn it into elemental damage.

Lmao. It's just so hilarious to me that you cite Str and Toughness aura, which no one runs. Then you use a reductivist fallacy about the SM stat steal which is 1000% more useful than a knight's stat aura ever will be. You talk about Wrath of Hoeth like it's some conditional, perfectly timed tool. ???? I don't even have a large opinion one way or another about Knight damage yet because I simply don't have a lot of number evidence, just a bunch of nonsense and opinion-pieces thrown around by guys like you, but you are either terrible at arguing a subject or just a giant troll. You have 0 credibility to any of us who read your posts, I'm sure you already know that. Rest assured, we are looking at the numbers ourselves, don't stress yourself.

[Uchoo]

I'm working on getting Knight numbers, but for points of reference, here's some BG numbers in the following context:

650 STR
142 Damage Bonus.
Bloodlord weapon, 5 bloodlord, 2 Sent

EDIT: No I'm not using Focused Offense.

https://gyazo.com/f9735d579b78061760b91300a2ed1269

Same test, few more crits:

https://gyazo.com/16c1e1b48f853953fbb3f38c0d1d6b35

[DirkDaring]

I'm working on getting Knight numbers, but for points of reference, here's some BG numbers in the following context:

650 STR
142 Damage Bonus.
Bloodlord weapon, 5 bloodlord, 2 Sent

EDIT: No I'm not using Focused Offense.

https://gyazo.com/f9735d579b78061760b91300a2ed1269

Same test, few more crits:

https://gyazo.com/16c1e1b48f853953fbb3f38c0d1d6b35

Unless they changed target in cities they are lvl 0 with no armor, resist or any def, which is ok. i normally test set ups on lvl 40 champs since they have higher armor valuves etc.

I wish they had added different levels of targets, even old DAOC had different lvl of targets outside the entrances to Frontiers where you could theory craft .

[Uchoo]

I'm working on getting Knight numbers, but for points of reference, here's some BG numbers in the following context:

650 STR
142 Damage Bonus.
Bloodlord weapon, 5 bloodlord, 2 Sent

EDIT: No I'm not using Focused Offense.

https://gyazo.com/f9735d579b78061760b91300a2ed1269

Same test, few more crits:

https://gyazo.com/16c1e1b48f853953fbb3f38c0d1d6b35

Unless they changed target in cities they are lvl 0 with no armor, resist or any def, which is ok. i normally test set ups on lvl 40 champs since they have higher armor valuves etc.

I wish they had added different levels of targets, even old DAOC had different lvl of targets outside the entrances to Frontiers where you could theory craft .

Target dummies have the same static defense, so the number comparisons are the same. Feel free to use my armor spreadsheet, or the one created by Rydiak which is about 95%+ accurate to the game for calculating defense -- or feel free to hit your friends.

That being said, BG's have the exact mirror to Precision Strike, it's called Murderous Wrath. They also debuff armor by about 1200 and Toughness by about 117. Don't discount dummy tests, though.

[detrap]

It's cool that you're learning the game and having so much fun, but I recommend you look into the buffs and debuffs that Swordmasters use as well. Your opinion seems quite grandiose for the level of knowledge you seem to be displaying.

Swordmasters have the biggest spirit debuff in the game, it has to be timed with other abilities in the second stance so not to mess with optimal rotations (snare, aoe interrupt). Along with a random resis buff and stat steal may/may not benefit the group. They have a pure dps tree and tactics like the IB's. Knights bring all the other debuffs and buffs the other two tanks don't, they fall short in the level of dps IB's and SM's can do in cities, but do just enough with the right gear to assist dps in the warband well enough to increase the ceiling of damage compared to not having one 2h in the warband. I feel like some players are quick to point the finger at issues when they don't fully understand the class they are playing. I wanna see buffs to the class especially with auras, but the crying over mighty soul is over the top, never ran it and my damage is fine. My damage might even be better now that blazing blade doesn't require a tactic to turn it into elemental damage.

Lmao. It's just so hilarious to me that you cite Str and Toughness aura, which no one runs. Then you use a reductivist fallacy about the SM stat steal which is 1000% more useful than a knight's stat aura ever will be. You talk about Wrath of Hoeth like it's some conditional, perfectly timed tool. ???? I don't even have a large opinion one way or another about Knight damage yet because I simply don't have a lot of number evidence, just a bunch of nonsense and opinion-pieces thrown around by guys like you, but you are either terrible at arguing a subject or just a giant troll. You have 0 credibility to any of us who read your posts, I'm sure you already know that. Rest assured, we are looking at the numbers ourselves, don't stress yourself.

You must agree then that randomly stealing 75 intelligence and ballistic skill from a Choppa train is more useful than a knight that is the only tank on order that can instantly strip 1200hp on most of the train and lower there defences by 10% plus another 5% on crit, plus maximising the dps by debuffing the targets resistances and toughness by over 100. Also increasing survivability of the party by buffing toughness and debuffing their melee trains strength. Which I'll add is better than the SM's Heavens Blade because buffing armour doesn't stack with pots that everyone in a pre-made will have. Wounds buff from SM is possibly useless if there's a WP in the party. So maybe Nature's blade is good for stripping other stats that the knight cannot do such as weaponskill and iniative but again it's random and uptime is not 100%, maybe it can be if you spam WoH but the ap costs are too great without the tactic, CA is on a long cooldown without WW and you lose out using better abilties.

No knight on the server runs strength or toughness auras? If a chosen is running similar auras and you fail to counter them you put your own party at a disadvantage the longer the fight is drawn out. Factor in already reduced stats from rez sickness and fights can be ended a lot quicker. And you are accusing me of being too opinionated? I'm just telling you the advantages knights have because it seems you have a misunderstanding of the abilities and want to compare classes 1v1 for damage. Because that's what's the game is about right? A blackguard does a little more damage on a dummy compared to a knight, yet the knight can debuff more stats on more targets instantly for the entire realm to do more damage on the area around them. You've made no legitimate counter case to enlighten me and rather just make assumptions more about the user than the subject at hand.

I don't always run the same auras, I switch out constantly depending on the situation mid fight. Unlike the blackguard we have even more auras that will add pressure to enemy targets and the more they are blobbed together the more effective it is. Auras are passive yes but actively switching to what is needed at the right time is not.

[Uchoo]

I would encourage you to be less confident in your understanding of the game. I really don't want to write a huge wall of text correcting every belief you hold in what you wrote. Play the game for awhile longer and I'm sure your belief system will change.

Don't take my word for it. Ask any good Knight in any situation which auras they run.

Also let me add this: Did you know that Blackguards provide almost all of the utility you listed as well (along with some of their own spicy utility) while also doing way better damage?

[Uchoo]

Some Knight Numbers:

Context: Bloodlord weapon, Focused Offense, Taunt

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... nknown.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... nknown.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... nknown.png

Detaunted Damage vs Conq DoK with no Taunt:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... nknown.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... nknown.png

[detrap]

I would encourage you to be less confident in your understanding of the game. I really don't want to write a huge wall of text correcting every belief you hold in what you wrote. Play the game for awhile longer and I'm sure your belief system will change.

Don't take my word for it. Ask any good Knight in any situation which auras they run.

Also let me add this: Did you know that Blackguards provide almost all of the utility you listed as well (along with some of their own spicy utility) while also doing way better damage?

Says the person that is charging $80 for a course about tanks and understands every tank in the game yet also admits not having much numbers to prove anything significant.

Against a DoK, your damage is great if you have an armour debuff, also in a six man ST party you won't be the one being detaunted. SM's and IB's have better tools to take down doks but knights have up to 4 interrupts to stop them from casting heals for the warband plus the outgoing heal debuff that stacks with any incoming heal debuff used on other targets. The setback aura works best with a cast time increaser from a bw or sm. Not even a mdps can solo a good DoK after it's been detaunted let alone a BG.

Nothing of what I mentioned about abilities is of my own beliefs when I'm just stating what is already on the tooltips and from my own experience from using them. If they buff the knight damage from all the crying the past week, I'll be a very happy player. But would still prefer an aura rework (esp removing the cooldowns, possibly GCD too) before any ST buff might be given back to chosens and knights.

For single target party yes BG can be better, but for the warband, no there is big differences. Again you are comparing 1v1. Dps spec'd Blackguards I've encountered don't have much in the way of mitigation and I've hit some for well over 1k on a SM. Whereas the knight can reduce incoming damage and buff toughness (which mitigates all forms of damage), wounds and initiative greatly. But you know all that right?

[Uchoo]

Ad Hominem logical fallacy. Try again and post evidence this time.

Is there a difference between "your experience" and "your beliefs"?

I'm pretty sure I just gathered a bunch of numbers from different people and had them posted. In fact, I've got another geared Knight about to post. ???? You done?

[kmark101]

...lots of random stuffs...

Dude wtf you are assuming that a knight runs with 6 active auras and 8 tactics all slotted and every spec line full skills/tactics available... just stop it. You can't do all those crap at once, you have to make hard choices..