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[AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

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zenzo
Posts: 12

[AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#1 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 9:49 am

Hello fellow AM players,

After having try all healers from live to Reckoning, I'm really stuck to AM, which I find the most fun by now.
Though, I think that even if we have nice utilities, and arguably the best Single Target- Low HP- Burst, we miss something that make us subpar with all other healer.
I open this dicussion because I don't see any direction or proposal concerning AM Healers, and I think we don't need that much to shine.

So lets share our Ideas!
Below are all ideas discussed on this topic, of course it's not a all buff brainless, maybe just 1 or 2 buff could make the AM Heal more competitive.

1- Buff Sustain / survivability:

I think AM is the worst healer in this domain ==> Even with "Run Between World" Tactic that can help a bit (even if we don't really have spot for this tactic) our on the moove heal, and escape tools isn't that great compare to all other healer

- Add/Change escape tools:
-Run speed like Sham ==> Might be too much buff?
-Escape bump like SW
-Change Wind Blast to a KD

- Add/Change absorb/healing tools:
-Auto detaunt like Sham
-Buff "Healing Energy" Base healing Or chance to crit
-Buff Magical Infusion, example: no chance to be crit, or add dmg absorb or toughness buff
-Make "Funnel Essence" Usable on the moove
-Run between worlds; Extend "non-setback" component of Walk between worlds to 10 seconds
-Balance Essence castable on move whatever high magic level

2- Buff AOE Healing

On this one, not sure how to score AM compared to Zealot/Rune thanks to EoV, but I would say, not far behind. I think we don't need much buff

-Decrease EoV CD to ~3sec
-Make "Apotheosis" and "Isha's Encourgement" stack + Be same tactic + add the Absorption to all members
-Apothesis buff value of Ishas encouragement heal +50% and Ishas Encouragement add for all groupmembers
-Make "Funnel Essence" Heal near target for ~10-20% the value
- Add a little healing aoe heal to "Mistress of Marsh"

3- Buff Utility

From my vision, this is the best Option. Raise Utility Power of AM in order to compensate it's less good heals

- AP Drain ==> Seriously, what is your disrupt chance on this... Sometimes I feel like it's a lost GCD when I get fully Disrupted 10 times... Make it undefendable, or at least 10% less change to be defend against
- Change Morale Burst to an actual usefull heal like "Funnel Essence"
- Instant rez without tactic (Maybe to OP for AM Dps) so maybe only if your at 5/5 Tranquility
- Instant rez Stun duration reduce (maybe ~1.5 sec)
- Any special buff add to any heal like Shaman "Do Somethin Useful" Toughness buff
- a group speed buff on a CD or that can trigger from another existing heal


What do you guys think about this points? Do you guys have any other Ideas? Or do you think that AM heal are in their right place right now?

Thanks for sharing, kiss kiss love love (to Elves ;) )
Last edited by zenzo on Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:03 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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Ugle
Posts: 546

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#2 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:52 am

Some good ideas here.

I think AM is not in such a bad place that it needs immense buffs, but rather some small tweaks. I am fine by being the most squishy healer, this requires positioning and awareness, but should be reflected better in the heal output.

My personal preferences;

First, I would change Willpower stat contribution dramatically for healers in general so that stacking willpower is actually a thing worth considering. AM suffer mostly because of defensive specc healer meta, where they are the worst, and low willpower is almost as effective as high willpower. This should be changed IMO. Want to be tanky, your heals are shlt, want great heal output, you will be accordingly squishy. This would assure some kind of risk/reward considerations that is lacking today.

Given that the above rather large structural change would not be implemented, here is the tweaks I would like to see:

Run between worlds; Extend "non-setback" component of Walk between worlds to 10 seconds, 5 sec is too litte to matter. This way you could be chaining this with Focused mind to give you 20 sec period where you cant be set back. Also you will have only 5 sec downtime on the effect of Walk between world setback immunity component. Then you have a good AoE heal output in typical fort defence push situations etc.

Apothesis should be buffed to both increase value of Ishas encouragement heal component (+50%, from 900ish over 9 sec to 1350ish, considering they stack with themselves, much more vould be OP) plus add heal component to all targets affected (afaik the shield component allready does?). Still keep them as two separate tactics. Combining the two to one tactic would be too powerful IMO. (This way you have to sacrifice other tactic to recieve the effect -> not OP. Could also be defended by the 11 point placement of the tactic. (Can't be combined with EoV without sacrificing other important skills/tactics unless running full sov, and still with some sacrifices in your toolbox)

Make Balance Essence worth using again, preferably castable on the move no matter the Tranquility/Force mechanic situation (preferably a better balanced version of old Azareal mechanic)

Apothesis and Balance Essence changes would also be applicable for shammie equivalents ofc. Walk between worlds shammie equivalent is different and not comparable.

edit; added some text for clarification
Ugle - SW | Amoebas - AM | Amoeba - SM
Gief - SH | Sidathex - WE | Pnzr - BO | Uglegutt - SQH

User avatar
zenzo
Posts: 12

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#3 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:56 am

Thanks for your feedback mate, I'm adding your suggestions.
I really like the "Between 2 worlds" adding 5 sec more not set back. Willpower stat is an issue for sure, but change on a global stats will so much impact all around balance.

Concerning adding the change to Shaman, not really sure though, since I think they are miles away on the survivability scope.

Starx
Posts: 316

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#4 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:07 pm

The problem with AM is everything has a long cast time, we dont have good on the move healing and we only have 1 oh **** button. That and our buffs are inexcusably dogshit compared to the other two healer, runepriest/zealot being probably the most OP classes in the game in terms of the disgusting amount of non raw healing utility they bring to a group.

AM is the #1 priority target in any engagement as well, insta res is extremely powerful tool for warbands. So pair that with the above and you have a recipe for disaster. AM has place in 24 man, but its not because they are good raw healers. Insta res, puddle, drain, strip, penis pump, 24man taps. Just dont put AM's in a group that needs a lot of healing, idk how many monkey brained WB leaders put me in double slayer groups.

It's been explained much better than what I **** out above many times by better AM's than me but nothing seems to happen besides WL and SW tweaks and the curveball nerfs to meme specs that are only good in pug scenarios.

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zenzo
Posts: 12

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#5 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:12 pm

Starx wrote:
Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:07 pm
The problem with AM is everything has a long cast time, we dont have good on the move healing and we only have 1 oh **** button. That and our buffs are inexcusably dogshit compared to the other two healer, runepriest/zealot being probably the most OP classes in the game in terms of the disgusting amount of non raw healing utility they bring to a group.

AM is the #1 priority target in any engagement as well, insta res is extremely powerful tool for warbands. So pair that with the above and you have a recipe for disaster. AM has place in 24 man, but its not because they are good raw healers. Insta res, puddle, drain, strip, penis pump, 24man taps. Just dont put AM's in a group that needs a lot of healing, idk how many monkey brained WB leaders put me in double slayer groups.

It's been explained much better than what I **** out above many times by better AM's than me but nothing seems to happen besides WL and SW tweaks and the curveball nerfs to meme specs that are only good in pug scenarios.
I understand your frustration, and I know it was already discussed, though it's a long time I haven't seen a list of proposal to make things better for AM heal. If you have any ideas, feel free to share.

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Gurf
Posts: 327

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#6 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:20 pm

AM is great when alive and not constantly harassed, therefore they need the survivability level of a Shaman to be more viable in healing mode, maybe not the exactly the same level as they have other perks but at least somewhere near that survivability. AM is always the first targeted while Shammy one of the last, that shows you the massive gap between them in that regard.

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Xergon
Posts: 615

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#7 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:32 pm

Current mechanic punish u for either constantly healing or doing DPS, therefor most viable use is to constantly balance between 1 force heal 1 force dps, its hard and its also not GCD efficient. Sure there are some outplay potential, like stacking 5 dps force so u can have 5 strong and fast group heals, or other way, stacking 5 heal foce so u can spam 5 EoV (giving u have WW from SM) on the move. But all that is super conditional, extremly hard to pull off.

There was a plans for big rework of AM/Sham mechanic. Which would change current situation. The more heal force u have then u heal faster n better, the more dps force u have, u dps better n faster, at least thats how i rmb the suggestions.
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zenzo
Posts: 12

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#8 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:23 pm

Xergon wrote:
Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:32 pm
There was a plans for big rework of AM/Sham mechanic. Which would change current situation. The more heal force u have then u heal faster n better, the more dps force u have, u dps better n faster, at least thats how i rmb the suggestions.
Do you know where to find out the plans on these rework, and if it is still in the pipe? Is it something discussed with dev on another place, or on this forum?

I think I've already seen a post answer from wargrimnir who says there was rework in the pipe for AM, but no idea what are the possible changes, or where to find any discussion about that.

/Update: Yes there is an answer on this post: viewtopic.php?f=76&t=39281&start=20

So yes : "AM/Sham is on the list to be addressed in the future." Though, don't really know if there are already a list of point which will be addresses, only AM/Sham mechanic? Or also more specific things on AM.

From my vision, Shaman is really more desirable and in a better state of performance compared to AM thanks to his huge suvivability

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Nekkma
Posts: 539

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#9 » Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:59 pm

Personally, I would like a redesign of magical infusion and shrug it off to be a real anti focus and oh **** ability. Shorten duration to 10 seconds and add a substantial defensive component and +heal or heal component. This should not be tied to any tactic as both classes already have good tactics (shaman have amazing tactics) and, thus, buffing through tactics gives little net effect as you then need to drop something good. Those abilites could then switch place with dsu/funnel essence to prevent them being used in dps spec.

I would also like to increase casting time on resurrections for all healers. Perhaps not to original level of 6 second but perhaps 4-4,5. This would increase the value of the tactic for instant resurrection. I feelt that change on live was a very substantial nerf to shaman/am pair.
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Starx
Posts: 316

Re: [AM Heal] An open discussion for AM lovers

Post#10 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:45 am

zenzo wrote:
Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:12 pm
Starx wrote:
Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:07 pm
The problem with AM is everything has a long cast time, we dont have good on the move healing and we only have 1 oh **** button. That and our buffs are inexcusably dogshit compared to the other two healer, runepriest/zealot being probably the most OP classes in the game in terms of the disgusting amount of non raw healing utility they bring to a group.

AM is the #1 priority target in any engagement as well, insta res is extremely powerful tool for warbands. So pair that with the above and you have a recipe for disaster. AM has place in 24 man, but its not because they are good raw healers. Insta res, puddle, drain, strip, penis pump, 24man taps. Just dont put AM's in a group that needs a lot of healing, idk how many monkey brained WB leaders put me in double slayer groups.

It's been explained much better than what I **** out above many times by better AM's than me but nothing seems to happen besides WL and SW tweaks and the curveball nerfs to meme specs that are only good in pug scenarios.
I understand your frustration, and I know it was already discussed, though it's a long time I haven't seen a list of proposal to make things better for AM heal. If you have any ideas, feel free to share.
There is so much you can do to AM/Shaman from a mechanic standpoint and also giving then new buffs/abilities and even introducing new mechanics into the game. I look up at the top banner and see "Alpha Phase" but that just seems to be something convenient to point to for the staff. Az was the last person doing actual alpha changes/experimental stuff to classes years ago, and while a lot of the ideas turned out to be bad at least it was keeping things fresh and there was a sense of things moving forward. There are a lot of classes that need love and really who knows if they will ever get any. We pretty much know whats gonna come out 3 years from now as much as we know whats coming out next week. The whole SW rework and SH being sidelined also kinda made me lose a lot of hope as well and I dont even play those classes.

There was a VERY well thought out post by a staff member for AM/Shaman mechanics that I cant seem to remember who exactly. But I don't think they are still around, and without someone on the staff to champion a class I don't really think anything will get done.

Edit: found it viewtopic.php?t=31862

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