WL is probably the most broken class

[Avernus]

İm talking about ST mara so i dont care monstro proc. WL and mara both are using medium armor. However WL doing 69%more average damage then mara.
WL is OP atm. İf you cannot see it, it is your problem. Just dont try to convince ppl for your selfish toughts.

I can't even comprehend how terrible you are as a mara to say something like this...

69%! Why is destro still refusing to die when i just look that them when playing as WL?

[Rapzel]

You realise we have simulations that confirm that the highest DPS on any melee career is WL right?

Thing that i asked in first place? Then send them to devs, im sure they will acounted if they are correct. Obviosly u counted even ap drainage, lvl of arp in both st and aoe specs, and remembered to compare utility (cos u surely realise DPS is not only factor that makes class OP) available to all mdps classes including bw ( i was on impresion they hit harder based on our warband stats, prob my mistake) and sork. TY for your job, i wish other classes had such hard analysis and maybe we finally cound compare them with full understanding and one day this game will be balanced. Im confused why your organisation didnt say a word about such hard everyday questions like sork disaster, kotbs 2h spec, existence of regen WE, or slay situation, and enlighten us with pure analysis ? Nvm, obviously (for some) WL is #1 issue. Do what must be done. Im finally ready to open my eyes and start to believe.

Thread is about absurd WL dmg, you start talking about moral drain. Nice whataboutism

[normanis]

lets increase wirling blade radius and reduce id radius to 5 feet + 10 feet around = all balance what we have seen
p.s mara ball ( BALL) even ability pic is flail /ball on chann and u need spin it)) is 180degree vs 360 wl.

[Alubert]

I'm shocked that there's even one person on the server who can defend WL/Mara.
Arm pene is broken or too high tooltip dmg aoe spin. Both WL and Mara.
The best WL/Mara on the server themselves say that the classes are too powerful.

I don't know why this topic exists because it's impossible not to notice it unless you're blind.

I have faith in our Devs.
They did a great job with the balance of all healers and tanks (for the first time in the history of war/ror, all of them are fun to play and well balanced).
So I'm sure that in the upcoming dps patches, they will bring WL/Mara up to the level of other classes.
I'm sure of it.

[wonshot]

I'd like to look at it from an other point of view, I dont think Whitelion is overpowered. I just think it does too much, so that reduces the appeal for other options

In a 24man warband you have X amount of slots, if you organize and try to get as much out of your warband you get the following from slotting a WL:

- No ramping Class mechannic. That means you can frontload channel with Fury pressed + Loner classmechanic
- Medium armor class. So somewhat durable
- MPD archtype. Acces to Pounce + Snarebreaker + Charge
- Aoe interrupt. In a Meta where coordinated channels are the combined burst for your warbands collective punch. And very good to apply procs with 1.5sec GCD
- M2 aoe dmg drop
- Nice overlapping abilities to finish/pressure singletargets to create a snowball effect or take out the enemy warbandleaders.
- Acces to 25% incoming healdebuff or armor debuff proc weapons for some utility for the warband's pressure.

Order has a proud tradition of stacking the same dps classes for orvr.
Wether it was BW for the Morale2 back before morale pumping tactics were nerfed and morales too.
Or if it was the 3 times stacking Broadhead arrow in forts.
Remember the Rampage + Retribution channeling days too?

What these periodes of time have in common is that the tempo is the same when you stack the same classes, The slayers had to go yellow then drop rage with Rampage and then climb back up into yellow while ID was ticking on top of Retribution channel. Having BWs/SW/WL on top were just not in sync. It could still work and was being done for the utility.

Whitelion didnt really get any direct buffs, they are just the "last one standing"
Slayers lost their ID + Rampage + Retribution punch despite being one of the few classes actually not camping at full classmechanic volume and going up/down for engaging gameplay. BW got -15% critdmg nerf. SW Broadhead got murdered. And what is left standing? The Lion which funnily enough does it all, and does it well in the current explosive frontloaded meta.

Try checking out how Whirling Axe scales vs Big Bouncing with 1050 str. One is a T3 monster and barely scales, while the other is slowly ramping up with gear. On top of that you get free armor pen and Ap reduction all in one super tactic for the whole build to benefit on both channel + filler.

I personally dont like WL, but I accept they are good and very very well rounded. But if we are to compare the list of why to slot a WL to a SW/Slayer it is much more clear that the WL does most of what the other options can provide to a limited warband slot, and just might be able to fit in one SW, one slayer for their unique utility such as morale drain, Numb Strike, Shattered Limbs etc. But in reality you maybe kinda wanna get as many lions(+procs) as possible.

Fun little thought experiment:
"How much more damage should a class canon dps deal over a powerhouse of a utility damagedealer before its "fair"
Does it make sense that the WL/MSH/Mara out performs the glasscanon BW/Choppa?

TLDR:
Bring the other DPS classes up so their damage makes up for not having the all-around package WL has in reflection of how much utility, dmg, sustain and mobility each career has!

[wildwindblows]

Totally agree with Bombling.
Damage gap between classes needs to be adjusted in upcoming dps patch.
However, some of the ppl likes **** post to insult ppl. İs there any moderator checking here?

[cairlaith]

Totally agree with Bombling.
Damage gap between classes needs to be adjusted in upcoming dps patch.
However, some of the ppl likes **** post to insult ppl. İs there any moderator checking here?

I'm truly shocked to read you. Are you the one who accuses those who disagree with you of being selfish, and you're saying that people are insulting each other here? Also, how do you completely agree with Bombling? Looking at your previous comment, you have a completely different opinion. Bombling evaluates it from a very different perspective, whereas you claimed that Wl deals 69% more damage than Mara (It's an another tragedy in which universe you came to this conclusion with the math).

[wildwindblows]

Totally agree with Bombling.
Damage gap between classes needs to be adjusted in upcoming dps patch.
However, some of the ppl likes **** post to insult ppl. İs there any moderator checking here?

I'm truly shocked to read you. Are you the one who accuses those who disagree with you of being selfish, and you're saying that people are insulting each other here? Also, how do you completely agree with Bombling? Looking at your previous comment, you have a completely different opinion. Bombling evaluates it from a very different perspective, whereas you claimed that Wl deals 69% more damage than Mara (It's an another tragedy in which universe you came to this conclusion with the math).

No, i just highlighted damage gab between classes. Unfortunately, it is really risky to use this data because average damage may not reflect actual situatuon. The reason is, while most if the wl running st build maybe most if the mara was running aoe.

On the other hand, while slayer/choppa losing armor and resist and we/wh using low armor somehow WL is top of the chart without any tradeoff.

[wildwindblows]

İf anyone able provide better data then average damage of 2023, please share.

[Sever1n]

Totally agree with Bombling.
Damage gap between classes needs to be adjusted in upcoming dps patch.
However, some of the ppl likes **** post to insult ppl. İs there any moderator checking here?

U said WL clearly OP, Bomb said he dont think its OP. Extremely fast change of opinion.

After caling people selfish for no reason, and dictating them what should they do u prob refering to yourself? Remember type of people who demands manager if someone dare dont agree with their point of view?

As predicted topic have no real info just opninions and mostly prolongates annoying drama that started in /3 and now dont have any bounds.

If anyone have proofs about lions being OP give them ro devs, but reapeating Lion OP without any basis like a mantra and demanding a nerf really is bad way of convincing people of something.

From my couch i still dont see how lion is broken, and it comes from person who catch scent of this mass madness in destro gamechats last years when lvled my sork dok and bg. Didnt agree with them back then, i dont agree after all this topics here, cos again i see them as witchunt on totaly normaly working class, instead of topics about fixing underperforming ones.

For people who dare scream about selfishnes and defending OP thing, and acuse me in bias, i dont really like to play WL and droped him immediately after realizing how boring he is for me in terms of mechanic, especially in aoe spec and didnt play him for years. Spent one wb on him just of curiosity why everybody scream so hard about OP, and didnt saw anything uniq or OP, compared to my other wb dps classes. So im not defending OP class, more annoyed by claims wich only base is "God told me so, and witch must burn".