I have a DREAM

[Hyas]

Hello my fellow players,

I'm not a forums guy, neither is english my mothers tongue.

I am Cretur, the pink dwarf, or Creturus the pink Kotbs. I'm playing order only, so some might know me, others dont. I was leading WBs hundrets of hours the last months, I had great times but always struggled on how the game processes and is played but others. I wont call out anyone, im looking for a solution for the game I love the most of all times!

When I think about RoR, ofc i played on live, its always the PvP aspects i loved. A world of magical keeps, a world you could not enter alone, fights, defences, commitment. Thats what that game is about for me, thats what I love. Thinking about unique tactics, surprise ur enemy, thats what RvR means to me! But im old (43), i dont need to be the best anymore, i just wanna have fun, my wbs are always open for everyone, i dont mind losing at all! But even when losing, I will not step back, I will keep defending my keep, i will try everything - thats what the world of RoR is all about.

Im writing here, because i got many conflicts the last weeks with the leaders of organized WBs. I did not fit their gameplay with the way i like to lead my WBs. There are different mindsets, thats okay for me - but some are destroying the game for others. Thats what my post is about.

If organized WBs focus on min-maxing their RR/minute - huge aspects of the game are lost. Let me explain what i mean: If my WB is organized, i win against any pugs, thats great RR/min for me. If RR/min is my focus, i will always work on a situation where i can get the most out of it. Thats what is happening all day. The best situation is praag (small map many players) and to farm them again and again.

Now, imagine, a pug WB spawns a ram in praag, trying to take the keep. The enemy faction ofc wants to defend, but the allied wbs on the side of the attackers .... they dont want it to happen, coz otherwise theyll be losing RR/min. What happens then is that several pug WBs get slaughtered while org WBs are just watching. Many ppl leave the game. And even I have no fun to continue anymore. There is 0 weight on the keeps right now, farming ppl is much more efficient.

I dont want to take anyone anything - thats why my whish is simple: Lets commit here, all together! If a keep is attacked, EVERYONE of the attacking faction needs to help, same goes for EVERYONE of the defending faction!

But im old, that will not work. So the solution is looking a bit off. Dramatically reduce the RR/player killed in a WB context by 70% min! Higher the RR for taking BOs, Keeps etc by 10 times. Maybe cap it at 100k. For a t4 fort win. And raise the outcome for LotD too - sidefact: its won by the "pve" WBs - i got a 100% winrade - who else ?

I know many will not agree with me .... but we need a solution, or more and more ppl will leave - and who do we farm in praag then?

Regards

Cretur the Pink

[Starx]

You forgot the part where the defenders purposely let rams get to keeps, and let them knock down the outer door when at any point they could easily have murdered them so they get a defense tick.

Oh and the classic sending your warband out in PvE constantly for no other reason than to deny the other side AAO.

Attacking is way too hard, and not worth the frustration or effort. It is also indirectly why city was removed from the campaign. EU times city push was nearly impossible, then when they logged off NA got on with much snaller population a single organized WB or even just a couple good 6 man guilds could get a free city and reset the campaign for EU.

Ram being the only thing that can deal damage to doors was what made me lose all interest in attacking keeps, and that happened so long ago.

[wonshot]

It is honestly a good topic, but ill try to represent an other side of it.
And why I dont personally bother building or leading warband guilds anymore.

It feels like friendly fire when you have a good read on the zone in primetime, there is barely any aao. Both sides take wins, maybe theres even a decent looking heatmap. And then out of the blue someone spawns a ram.

What will happen, is that the behavior of both realms snap and instantly changes. No matter if the siege have any logical chance of winning. Let alone the chances are even lower if there is no agreement across the besieging realm to siege so the ram force will not be fully supported and the even numbers in the whole zone(or across the pairings) then turn out to be an outnumbered siege attack.

An other thing that also seemed to matter more some years back, maybe this has changed others please let me know, is that if you have a planned gamer-date with your guild in rvr. Besieging a keep is honestly a bit dull, you have spent time and effort organzing irl schedules with your guild, people have geared and brought out characters to have a balanced groupsetting, you might even have gone beyond and praticed strategies or built a composition for how to fight wb vs wb or outnumbered. And then your enemies are lured away by a ram, and all you get are the leftover situation where there is barely any button pressing because the experienced eye can see a siege will not be succesful as there are too many organized warbands inside a 3star keep where the outer posterns were not even blocked. So its not really about your rp per hour going down, it just simply is not fun sieging watching 4 tanks playing a minigame on the ram. while the defenders are already inside, happily not wanting to do postern sworties as they very well know an advantageous funnel is waiting them.

Yes there might be many more layers to this, but from an organized warbandleader/guildleader prespective this feeling was often what I faced in the past.
Simply that sieges are not a good timeinvestment for your scheduled guild-event. You stand around waiting for too long, for the ram to get to the door. To kill oil, then back on door. If ram got pushed you pull it away and heal it, back on door with the ram. Next oil soon. Door is down bait oil, build m4 push the funnel. Try again or beat on a lord for 10minuts.

Sieges are just not very fun, and deffo not worth all the effort going into building and maintaining a guild warband roster.
How come the best 6man platers dont deal with it I wonder, probably because the buttonpressing and funlevels are at an alltime low during ramming phases.
Afterwards on the otherhand the zone is the most fun, but also has the shortest lifespan during the 3/4BO + keep + Keepruin lock conditions. And more of the zone lifespan should have those objective focused conditions on the line to spice up rvr. Which would mean shorter sieges, more zonelocks and a faster campaign. But the main RvR dev personally disagrees with this mindset last we chatted. so theres that. <3

[deanmclean]

Sieges are just not very fun, and deffo not worth all the effort going into building and maintaining a guild warband roster.

I have thought & said the same thing since approx a month after starting playing.

it would be vastly better to swap the mechanics of territory capture in LOTD in place of keeps.

I've also had the idea that instead of just spawning the ram and straight dragging it to the enemy keep at a run, if it could be managed to make the ram into a sort of "escort" mode similar to games like overwatch, that might be superior.

[Hazmy]

I don't often reply on posts nowadays, but I feel this one is a bit disingenuous, and extremely one-sided. Especially since I personally know of 3-4 different warband leaders who tried to help and support you and FRENZY as a guild -- but got only backlash and immature responses in return.

Now, imagine, a pug WB spawns a ram in praag, trying to take the keep. The enemy faction ofc wants to defend, but the allied wbs on the side of the attackers .... they dont want it to happen, coz otherwise theyll be losing RR/min. What happens then is that several pug WBs get slaughtered while org WBs are just watching. Many ppl leave the game. And even I have no fun to continue anymore. There is 0 weight on the keeps right now, farming ppl is much more efficient.

I dont want to take anyone anything - thats why my whish is simple: Lets commit here, all together! If a keep is attacked, EVERYONE of the attacking faction needs to help, same goes for EVERYONE of the defending faction!

RvR is a team effort between the warbands on the same faction, or at least it's supposed to be. As someone who leads every day, I support almost any pug leader and warband ramming at any point. Hell, I even supported the Thunder Mountain Ram you spawned tonight.

The part that you don't mention in this post, is that this cooperation between warbands is a two-way street. Order has asked and pleaded over a dozen times per week to you personally, or other new pug leaders from the same guild you are in -- to listen to advice regarding sieges and prepare properly for it. Call it in time / Block / Spawn Cannons / Judge if you can fight the opposite side or not - and help the other warbands.

For instance, tonight I helped again on your Thunder Mountain Ram - and while I was trying to block for your siege - we got swarmed, while your warband was just watching and AFK on Main Door 30 feet away. That isn't about RR/minute or caring about dying -- it's not fun to support a siege where half the players are either AFK or unwilling to help in the actual important part of a siege.

So contrary to your statement, no - my warbands personally don't care about renown or kills whatsoever - we are just tired of trying to assist warbands to siege, who don't care and don't bother to coordinate with the rest of the faction / learn how to siege properly or even care about siege properly.

You spawn a ram without coordinating - you don't give time for Order to even get to you in time, so there is no blocking, no regrouping -- which would be fine, if you were one of the stronger warbands, since you could defend yourself. But you aren't, and then you blame others for your own mistakes.

You are free to play the way you like - and others are free to decide not to support Sieges where they are repeatedly burned due to careless preparation and coordination from the exact same warband leaders.

In fact I love sieges as a game mechanic, and when it is done properly I think it is very fun content. When it is done poorly, it is the most boring and frustrating experience.

And raise the outcome for LotD too - sidefact: its won by the "pve" WBs - i got a 100% winrade - who else ?

Coincidentally, this 100% winrate also happens to be in the exact same timeframe since we started organizing Order LOTD with the rest of the faction, except for you since you refused to.
This is unfortunately also just about being completely ignorant of what is happening around you, and putting extra strain on Order in Land of the Dead, while you take 24 men to just run around for an hour without any coordination with the rest of the Realm, despite multiple attempts at trying to coordinate with you.

I sympathize with you Cretur, but at the same time you ask others to support your playstyle, while you yourself refuse to support others or those who actually tried to assist you.

And from the looks of it and what you are saying - you aren't any closer to reflecting about it either.