City matchmaking

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Zhentarim
Posts: 102

Re: City matchmaking

Post#51 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:07 am

RuffRyder wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:57 am
And I say again (and again): Make Royal Crests from City account-bound and leave people the freedom to bring the classes their team needs most.
Less useless classes in City, more instances, hopefully less complaining. At least try.
I saw that suggestion in the balance thread but I disagree with it. If endgame content requires you to log a character you dont enjoy to gear up a character you do enjoy then its just flawed endgame content.

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Toshutkidup
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Re: City matchmaking

Post#52 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:38 am

reistahlen wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:35 am
Toshutkidup wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:06 am
Again I will say it for the 100000x time.. if you dont have a premade that can compete.. DONT que for city. But they will continue to Que , lose, complain .. but hey free bags right....
It's a "Blame the game, not the player" situation: going to Capital is a 3+ medaillong garanteed in less than an hour. That's two bags including one Gold in zone lock, so WAY more than an hour of RvR. So, yes, going to City unprepared gives less chance of winning, but as long as it is a faster way of earning Medaillins, people (including myself) will go.
And when u get those meds and gear what ya gonna do? if like 90% of players, quit because then another excuse or reason will come up. IMO if more people just played a pvp game for PVP and not Gear / rewards.. entire server would be better. But no people THINK gear = happiness then they get gear and find they are still getting asses handed to them. Then they blame classes and whine on forums for balance for THEIR class. Then IF / WHEN that change happens and they still get asses handed to them then its whine about whatever else. IMO hate to say it but if ur hear just to get gear.. WOW or maybe Minesweeper is a better game.. Or just get used to getting asses handed to you and deal with it.
First RR90 Slayer working towards the top of the mountain. NOT Full Sov, NO Bloodlord , Riposte spec and I still solo

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Zhentarim
Posts: 102

Re: City matchmaking

Post#53 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:55 am

Toshutkidup wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:38 am
reistahlen wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:35 am
Toshutkidup wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:06 am
Again I will say it for the 100000x time.. if you dont have a premade that can compete.. DONT que for city. But they will continue to Que , lose, complain .. but hey free bags right....
It's a "Blame the game, not the player" situation: going to Capital is a 3+ medaillong garanteed in less than an hour. That's two bags including one Gold in zone lock, so WAY more than an hour of RvR. So, yes, going to City unprepared gives less chance of winning, but as long as it is a faster way of earning Medaillins, people (including myself) will go.
And when u get those meds and gear what ya gonna do? if like 90% of players, quit because then another excuse or reason will come up. IMO if more people just played a pvp game for PVP and not Gear / rewards.. entire server would be better. But no people THINK gear = happiness then they get gear and find they are still getting asses handed to them. Then they blame classes and whine on forums for balance for THEIR class. Then IF / WHEN that change happens and they still get asses handed to them then its whine about whatever else. IMO hate to say it but if ur hear just to get gear.. WOW or maybe Minesweeper is a better game.. Or just get used to getting asses handed to you and deal with it.
The game should stop rewarding passive-play. Sitting in keep all day shouldnt feel rewarding with a bag roll coming in when you lose zone. Joining cities shouldnt automatically hand you 3 crests for participating and losing. All these rewards for passive-play promotes passive-play and in some cases people that make the effort to actually do something can get punished for it. We need to stop giving free things to people that do nothing. Rewards whatever it might be needs to promote active play, otherwise we get people sitting in keep all day not caring and people solo queuing cities over actually grouping up.

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Banjomissen
Posts: 107

Re: City matchmaking

Post#54 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:03 am

Zhentarim wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:55 am

The game should stop rewarding passive-play. Sitting in keep all day shouldnt feel rewarding with a bag roll coming in when you lose zone. Joining cities shouldnt automatically hand you 3 crests for participating and losing. All these rewards for passive-play promotes passive-play and in some cases people that make the effort to actually do something can get punished for it. We need to stop giving free things to people that do nothing. Rewards whatever it might be needs to promote active play, otherwise we get people sitting in keep all day not caring and people solo queuing cities over actually grouping up.
That easy to say if you play the realm with a 20% pop advantage.

Grouping up doesn’t always make things better. The few groups / WB’s that’s looking for players during a city siege are all looking for the same classes, rr and gear level. Sure you can make your own with other requirements but that won’t really help you win the city. Make all classes viable in all aspects of the game and it would be easier to actually do something when grouping up.

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Zhentarim
Posts: 102

Re: City matchmaking

Post#55 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:21 am

Banjomissen wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:03 am

That easy to say if you play the realm with a 20% pop advantage.

Grouping up doesn’t always make things better. The few groups / WB’s that’s looking for players during a city siege are all looking for the same classes, rr and gear level. Sure you can make your own with other requirements but that won’t really help you win the city. Make all classes viable in all aspects of the game and it would be easier to actually do something when grouping up.
Well I don't, I play Order and Im guilty of keep sitting and solo queuing city sieges. I think the city siege is the worst content in the game by far and would rather have it reworked in some way were the battle inside is a bit more split up rather than wb against wb. That would make the useless classes have a role too and even when you queue in with just a 6man it can do well in that reworked split up fight. But to reward people for doing nothing and just appearing at the right time in the right place, makes people do nothing.

VindicoAtrum
Posts: 130

Re: City matchmaking

Post#56 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:25 am

Banjomissen wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:11 am
The thing is that solo q'ers doesn't get matched with other solo q'ers - they are used to fill spots up to 24.

A order 6man premade can get 18 pugs and fight a Destro 18man with 6 pugs. That's not unusual. Today a full Order pug got matched with something that looked like a 12 - 18man premade. If there's no Order premades around pugs with be matched with premades.

Last week before the "tweak" solo q'ers had a better time than now that whatever-was-wrong has been "fixed" or "tweaked".
See, you say this, but what you're not realising is that the 18 man destro group was 4 guys who were roaming pre-city and a load of /5 finds. How do I know that? We we did that on the 22nd. Here's my record of it:

Image

(Columns: date, invaders, royals, royals change from prev day, notes)

8 dps, 11 healers, 4 tanks. Wanna know why there was only 4 tanks? Cause after about 2 minutes /5 has no more tanks. Wanna know why order had 16 dps? Cause they queued as 12 (5 dps 4 heal 3 tank) and got dumped with a load of engineers, witch hunters, and shadow warriors from solo. How do I know that? My guildmates were in the 12!

The only difference in the scenario you describe is that we have a guy who steps up, trawls his friends list and then turns to /5.

Rapzel
Posts: 199

Re: City matchmaking

Post#57 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:33 am

Banjomissen wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 8:00 am
Toshutkidup wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:06 am
Again I will say it for the 100000x time.. if you dont have a premade that can compete.. DONT que for city. But they will continue to Que , lose, complain .. but hey free bags right....
That’s the issue with city sieges: even if you make a premade you’ll most likely best stomped as it requires you to get the right amount of the right classes. Why shouldn’t all classes have an equal chance of being useful in every aspect of the game? Why does order need to bring 4 slayers, 1-2wl, 1-2bw and then 0-2 of the rest of the dps classes? Same with Destro (they don’t suffer as much as Order but still equal usefulness for all classes).

It’s fair game that to win you need a competent raid leader, comms and ppl willing to follow and learn but the class requirements are just stupid. I think it’s a very bad game design and I don’t see the reason for the endgame content to be such a bad experience for so many players.
Because Slayer is the best dps career in the game and requires little to no effort to be played on satisfactory level. It's the same reason people pick WP over AM, AM needs skill to be played while 90% of WP just spam different AoE heals win the healing done and think they did a great job. People stare at numbers for some reason and think that's everything. Without RP crit tactic would the WP heal that much? probably not. Yet people only see the numbers so AM is seen as a bad healer while for some reason Order thinks Shaman is good, even though Shaman has less healing.
Yet a WB without AM on order is terrible and every time I see a WB without AM I cringe (because yes they're good enough to be needed in a WB, not 8, but 1-3)
I've seen some really good AM healers and for a WB they're amazing, they might need some tuning when it comes to certain parts of 6vs6, e.g. buffing their resistance buff (applies to both shaman and am) to be stronger than KotBS/Chosen aura (which can't be cleansed) so there's a reason to apply it other than just using it to hide other buffs behind but w/e.
Order hates AMs though because of the fact 95% of them live in this self fulfilling prophecy of it being a bad healer, it's not.
BG is the worst WB tank in the game, it's miles behind all the other tanks in WBs yet it is played because you know what? AoE slow and a guard is better than no AoE slow and no guard.
Time and time again I see order priders complain about engi doing zero damage, yet when I see engies in cities they more than not end up in the top 5 damage dealers (both sides) [insert Alec meme].
Some careers require skill to be played well others don't the ones that requires skill are seen as bad on Order (just look in Order LFG before a city, usually 5-6 70+ IBs spamming for WB and IB isn't even bad for city WB)

The big issue on Orders is that people don't want to learn to play, they want to complain. Every whine thread about any part of the game is made by order solo players complaining about how it's difficult for them to have fun in the game when they get crushed by premade destro in Scenarios, ORvR, Forts, City and probably in PvE soon as well.
Start playing 6 mans, ranked solo queue, git gud and understand the mechanics of the game, if you keep losing EVERYTHING maybe you need to evaluate your own plays.

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soldude
Posts: 74

Re: City matchmaking

Post#58 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:39 pm

Zhentarim wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:21 am
Banjomissen wrote:
Sun Jan 24, 2021 11:03 am

That easy to say if you play the realm with a 20% pop advantage.

Grouping up doesn’t always make things better. The few groups / WB’s that’s looking for players during a city siege are all looking for the same classes, rr and gear level. Sure you can make your own with other requirements but that won’t really help you win the city. Make all classes viable in all aspects of the game and it would be easier to actually do something when grouping up.
Well I don't, I play Order and Im guilty of keep sitting and solo queuing city sieges. I think the city siege is the worst content in the game by far and would rather have it reworked in some way were the battle inside is a bit more split up rather than wb against wb. That would make the useless classes have a role too and even when you queue in with just a 6man it can do well in that reworked split up fight. But to reward people for doing nothing and just appearing at the right time in the right place, makes people do nothing.
that true :idea:

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Magusar
Posts: 20

Re: City matchmaking

Post#59 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:57 pm

This q system is the best that has ever been on this server.
Problem is not in system, problem in some org wb's, who just dodging org wb's on other side.
How its looks like at destro wb today-u are q in first seconds/first 3-4 mins and have only one/two mirrors (one of them pug, i think) and u can wait other next 15-25 mins for the next pop.
Dont have pop in a first 5 mins? Welcome to dodgefest. Did u wait 5 minutes? You will wait next 20:) And you have 2-6 instance in last 5 mins. If you have pop earler of this time-90% this is /5 wb, who just lost nerves. Org wb's just q in last 5 mins(i think "residual principle" start at 15mins,but nvm) and hope they will pop on pugs/5 wbs and farm them easy. Order's pugs just pugstomp by org des wb,because they have pop before org order's wbs.
Ofc problem in system /sarcasm. Devs do what they can. People dont want just play medium/hard, they want easy.
As a result, the system does not work as intended.
Last edited by Magusar on Sun Jan 24, 2021 2:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Drukar Netherlord

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Magusar
Posts: 20

Re: City matchmaking

Post#60 » Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:59 pm

Very often pop comes in the last 5 minutes and you have full 2 2 2 wb in sov players from one-two guild's tags inside.
The same ppl play at tower defense at eu primetime and push city in late NA primetime btw. How a person who maintains order, it is a little annoying. There is not fights outside keep/forts or far from them.
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But it doesn't matter what i sad above. Because order dont have lots organaising, des dont have lots pugs. Someone will be farmed anyway.
Drukar Netherlord

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