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Armor Talisman & Potions

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Likeaboss
Posts: 230

Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#1 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 8:54 am

My Question came up in the Q&A for about 3s, and was answered with a No.

So i already have a Dev feedback on it :D
But i am kind of interested what the community thinks about it.

Question was:
Any thought about removing Armor Talis & Pots from the Game?


I know, healers with full 180 armor talisman slotted are getting pretty angry right now, but remember,
Dev's already said NO to that, so chill.... :lol:


My Toughtprocess was, if Armorstacking is not a Problem, why implementing:

-Armor-piercing Rounds (25% Armor ignore ability for Engi)
-Sigmar's Wrath (25% Armor ignore ability for WP)
-Drowning in Blood (25% Armor ignore ability for DOK)

-Blessed Blade (50% Armor ignore tactic for WH)
-Bleeding Edge (50% Armor ignore tactic for WE)
-Hack and Slash (50% Armor ignore tactic for WL (on 2 abilitys))
-Sharpened Arrers (25% armor ignore tactic for SH (for ranged ability))
-Powerful Drah (25% Armor ignore tactic for SW (for Skirmisher ability))

Did i miss something? :roll: Marauder has got Piercing Bite back on Live.

So Slayer and Choppa are the only (physical)DPS without armor pen tactic,
but they get a very high amout of WS, by Sets, Tactics & Abilitys

It feels like this tactics & Abilitys were implemented to fight the Symptoms.
The root Cause stays the same...

I mean, people said it must fit with the lore, how does it fit with the lore when a healer has more Armor than a Tank? ;)

Just my 2c
wargrimnir wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:50 pm
Accidental solo-friendly content doesn't stay that way for very long.

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Mergrim
Posts: 113

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#2 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:08 am

Likeaboss wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 8:54 am


Question was:
Any thought about removing Armor Talis & Pots from the Game?
Nope thx. The only thing we can fix is double armor from armor talismans for melle squig/assault sw. Rest is fine.
Last edited by Mergrim on Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Nekkma
Posts: 645

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#3 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:12 am

Likeaboss wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 8:54 am

The root Cause stays the same...

I mean, people said it must fit with the lore, how does it fit with the lore when a healer has more Armor than a Tank? ;)

Just my 2c
Healers in general do not have more armor than tanks, so yeah, that's that.

And if we talk about "root causes", why is it that healers typically slot defensive talismans (armor, wounds, toughness), renown and setbonuses? It is because willpower scaling is terrible and also that a robe healer get globaled if you run around glasscannon willpower speced.
Nekkma / Hjortron
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Bloodmasked
Posts: 132

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#4 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:18 am

Its called game balance, and called having class archetypes.

Tanks - borderline invincible. Job is to babysit DPS.

Dps - squishy or bruisers. Kill other dps or healers.

Healers - heal stuff. Avoid dying, heal teammates.

Lets just make healers die in 2 hits (remove armor, etc)? Then your rvr will just be a bunch of WHers who choose 1 healer each to jump on and kill in one rotation.

Bloodmasked
Posts: 132

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#5 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:23 am

And your explanation doesn't make any sense. This is like saying why do healers exist?? Just remove all damage from the game, then we won't have to waste our time healing stuff.

User avatar
Likeaboss
Posts: 230

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#6 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:39 am

Thx for the feedback so far, appreciate it :)

Gonna Edit when i'm home, but for now.. The stats for my RP look as followed round about...

Sov Armor: 2'200
Slotted with 7x180: 1'260
Potion in partyplay: 825
RS tactic proc: 1056

Total: 5341

Sure, as Tank you reach more when slot Armor as well, but most tanks go for toughness,wounds, or a mix with armor

In a perfect world, without armor pots/talis, people would improve their positioning as healers, tanks & dps gotta pay much more attention and so on...

But it is what it is ;)
wargrimnir wrote:
Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:50 pm
Accidental solo-friendly content doesn't stay that way for very long.

Caduceus
Posts: 235

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#7 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:45 am

What I find somewhat strange, is that despite there being an established "armor meta" (players stacking mostly armor in favor of other survivability tools), the classes and specs that deal magic damage still underperform at the highest levels.

Something else that is interesting, is that it is very easy to cap magical resistances (which are capped at roughly 44%) when in a warband.

So why does capping oneself on magic resists require almost no investments, while capping oneself on armor is almost impossible for non-tanks?

I think the solution to both the stale armor meta and the underperforming of magic users in organized play can be found in this strange situation that there exists no incentive for players to invest in magical resistances, because they are capped essentially for free.
"I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream; that's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor... and surviving." - Colonel Walter E. Kurtz

Bloodmasked
Posts: 132

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#8 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:49 am

Caduceus wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:45 am
What I find somewhat strange, is that despite there being an established "armor meta" (players stacking mostly armor in favor of other survivability tools), the classes and specs that deal magic damage still underperform at the highest levels.

Something else that is interesting, is that it is very easy to cap magical resistances (which are capped at roughly 44%) when in a warband.

So why does capping oneself on magic resists require almost no investments, while capping oneself on armor is almost impossible for non-tanks?

I think the solution to both the stale armor meta and the underperforming of magic users in organized play can be found in this strange situation that there exists no incentive for players to invest in magical resistances, because they are capped essentially for free.
When I play 24man city premade, the highest damage dealer is a particular Magus everytime (if hes in the wb).

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Caduceus
Posts: 235

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#9 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:54 am

Bloodmasked wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:49 am


When I play 24man city premade, the highest damage dealer is a particular Magus everytime (if hes in the wb).


I've also seen Magus perform very well. I guess I was thinking more about Sorc/BW.
"I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream; that's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor... and surviving." - Colonel Walter E. Kurtz

Mergrim
Posts: 113

Re: Armor Talisman & Potions

Post#10 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:55 am

Caduceus wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:54 am
Bloodmasked wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:49 am


When I play 24man city premade, the highest damage dealer is a particular Magus everytime (if hes in the wb).


I've also seen Magus perform very well. I guess I was thinking more about Sorc/BW.
It's same with engi. They both deal top dmg on 24man city.

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