Questions regarding Leading Shots and Dity Tricks

[Azarael]

Try An' Hurt Me is implemented as -100% to crit.

[Thorondir]

The drawback of leading shots is you have to run a sw in your group :^)

I think this is definitely a case where it shouldn't be judged till level 40 environment allowing us to see how sw performs endgame in the rr80 max enviroment, and if running a leading shots sw will even be meta... because from my expierence on live it wasn't.

Pretty much this.

Anyone complaining about leading shots, please show me the SW build. You have 3 absolutely mandatory tactics if your SW is going to do any damage:

Masterful aim;
Instinctive aim; and
Powerful draw.

The only tactic choices for the fourth is Enchanted Arrows or No Quarter. Any variation of this tactic set is going to be melee or skirmish, both of which are subpar burst dps in T4.

Why bitch about leading shots, there are only two instances where it would realistically even be used: PVE or by an undergeared SW - neither of which are going to be meta 6 man pvp comp. Also, keep in mind that the benefits of added crit chance are pretty diminished in T4 since most people will be pushing 40-50% anyhow. It helps but less than you might think.

Finally, this is a level 37 tactic. The time when it would really be worth while is below T4 - when you can't use it.

[Bozzax]

You are all talking about -25% stuff but what about the slayer/choppa debuff?
seeing the values.

Maybe ST stuff on 30s CD is very little real value in this discussion?

[Xaun]

I think that perhaps they should not stack as this opens a pandoras box of things potentially stacking unintentionally

Take +crit

Debuff initiative, scales astronomically as init tends towards zero
Encouraged aim, an effective buff to crit by increasing enemies chance to be crit

These two, under game mechanics, should stack.. And they should stack with ONE of the next two

Dirty tricks = a flat plus to (all) crit to group
Leading Shots = a flat plus to (all) crit to group (-sw)

Now look at options to counter

Reduce enemy chance to crit (CtW, SB)
Buff initiative (scales poorly upwards)
...but no reduces group chance to be crit

Destro dont have access to either of the +group (all) crit nor the aoe increase opposition chance to be crit

[Penril]

You are all talking about -25% stuff but what about the slayer/choppa debuff?

The point of it being 100% is to remove all your base crit chance, if its actually a -100% chance to crit, making you unable to crit unless you surpass +100% now that is some broken stuff.

So what are we aiming for here, every +/- crit should modify only base, be absolute or on case by case basis?

For the sake of it not being a mess, its better for everything to work in the same way but i doubt that was Mythic idea seeing the values.

Not broken considering that Enervating Blow and Try n hurt me:

- have a 30 sec Cd
- are ST
- drop your rage

[bloodi]

Try An' Hurt Me is implemented as -100% to crit.

Lol

So much for the discussion of BG + WE. Run a choppa and thats it.

That said, i am pretty sure in was removing your base crit chance, not just 100% on retail.

Not broken considering that Enervating Blow and Try n hurt me:

- have a 30 sec Cd
- are ST
- drop your rage

Well considering your 3 point is pretty meh because of wot rules? and power through, i dont think being able to negate the burst of any dps, specially the ones that need crit is a good balance, much less in the hands of slayer and choppa.

That is a pretty impressive defensive cd if you ask me.

And as i said, almost sure you still could crit under thhose skills on retail, it would be flat out impossible here.

Increasing TTK is never Broken/OP

You should not use those words when you dont know what they mean.

[Klev]

You are all talking about -25% stuff but what about the slayer/choppa debuff?

The point of it being 100% is to remove all your base crit chance, if its actually a -100% chance to crit, making you unable to crit unless you surpass +100% now that is some broken stuff.

So what are we aiming for here, every +/- crit should modify only base, be absolute or on case by case basis?

For the sake of it not being a mess, its better for everything to work in the same way but i doubt that was Mythic idea seeing the values.

Increasing TTK is never Broken/OP

[dave2278]

Will Trivial Blows help with the problem with Order critical hits.

[Bozzax]

No

[Penril]

No because we wont have Trivial Blows in this game.