Decrease in Population?

[Azarael]

I'll come in to say the same thing I say every time "open other zones" is mentioned, as it usually kills the conversation.

This game is not yet fully restored. The possibility exists of many more players being in T4 RvR than we currently have. Ask yourself what will happen if we triple the RvR population and then open all 3 maps. If the answer you get isn't "exactly the same situation we have now", then I want to know why.

Blobs are a product of the combat system. That issue isn't going to be sidestepped by opening all 3 zones.

[Jaycub]

I'll come in to say the same thing I say every time "open other zones" is mentioned, as it usually kills the conversation.

This game is not yet fully restored. The possibility exists of many more players being in T4 RvR than we currently have. Ask yourself what will happen if we triple the RvR population and then open all 3 maps. If the answer you get isn't "exactly the same situation we have now", then I want to know why.

Blobs are a product of the combat system. That issue isn't going to be sidestepped by opening all 3 zones.

Forts and cities flesh out the campaign, and bring actual meaning to taking "empty" zones. Zones honestly should never be left undefended unless there is good reason for the realm to divert everything else to one zone. Unless of course a realm doesn't care how they get to city, for instance like i've said before many times I saw people just saying "**** it" and letting the other realm push their city so they could farm warlord/sov/inv etc in defense instances...

Multiple zones being open at once allow for more depth in how the campaign is progressed and opens up options for forwarding the campaign if there is a stalemate in a certain zone.

Of course as it stands now, population doesn't support multiple zones 3x def would I feel like. And current endgame, no one really cares about anything other than farming RR/medals the campaign is virtually nonexistent and keeps function as a crazy lottery for bags and a means of funneling in pugs for EZ farming. Most 6 man guilds I know pretty much won't touch a keep attack, but the second AAO and Keep D is mentioned they are on that like no ones business.

There's also the problem of relatively low population times like in late NA/oceanic times were taking empty keeps could actually be abusing to forward the campaign, some kind of countermeasures would have to be in place... maybe something like supply for multiple zones at the same time requires a large population online so whenever the server dies down to a low pop only 1 zone can be contested?


I'm also just thinking in context of what I remember from live, maybe you have bigger changes in mind for how the game is played and how the campaign is going to progress so this might sound dumb.

[Miszczu5647]

@Morfee I support you but "nobody" is too strong word here. During last few days I had more than few great fight (from 6vs6 to 12vs12). Sure I sometimes zerg one lonely unlucky guy with my other 8 friends. And experience power of the zerg when meet full warband. But like Arthur said - there is a place to great fights.

@Azarael We should discuss, with respect for each other. I don't believe that blob is only combat system problem. Mentality also play role here. As also not knowing the full potential of this game. And surely much more.
But as I am data type guy I won't press more. No data so we can only speculate "what if".

Someone earlier in this thread said that game is very unfriendly for new players. Maybe this is a place for "experience members of community" to work on something? Some kind of voluntary work? Unless this statement wasn't referring to easier way to obtain BiS gear maybe we should by more helpful in game?

[Dresden]

The path an RvR game or open world pvp game takes is entirely dependent on the players.

Was it any better in guild wars, dark age of camelot, etc?

is entirely dependent on the players.

I assume this means you disagree. Then please offer a plausible reason or method for how to control how a large group of players play.

The devs could make every change requested in this and any thread and people would still find something to complain about, still form into a manner which gives them an easier, even unfair advantage, and claim it's the devs fault.

Games succeed and fail based on the community and players, not the game itself. There are plenty of good games out there that died on the vine because players either ruined it or never played it.

...

I assume this means you disagree. Then please offer a plausible reason or method for how to control how a large group of players play.

NOPE!

The devs could make every change requested in this and any thread and people would still find something to complain about, still form into a manner which gives them an easier, even unfair advantage, and claim it's the devs fault.

TRUE!

Games succeed and fail based on the community and players, not the game itself. There are plenty of good games out there that died on the vine because players either ruined it or never played it.

IF YOU SAY SO!

I WIN MOST SCENARIOS NOW BY AVOIDING FIGHTING! I ONLY PLAY SCENARIOS NOW TO FARM EMBLEMS AND RENOWN!

IIIIIIIIIF YOOOOOOOOOUUUUUUUUU SAAAAAAAAAY SOOOOOOOOO!

I don't care about scenarios anymore, i gave up on scenarios a while back and i have no real stance/opinion on them anymore.

It's alpha, we're guests, i finally took that at face value and gave up, i couldn't care less, they broke me, end of story.

[Morf]

I'll come in to say the same thing I say every time "open other zones" is mentioned, as it usually kills the conversation.

This game is not yet fully restored. The possibility exists of many more players being in T4 RvR than we currently have. Ask yourself what will happen if we triple the RvR population and then open all 3 maps. If the answer you get isn't "exactly the same situation we have now", then I want to know why.

Blobs are a product of the combat system. That issue isn't going to be sidestepped by opening all 3 zones.

The main force and majority of the players will always be located in a single zone no matter if 1 or 9 zones are open at a time, you cannot change this, its what ppl do, the point i am making is when u open up more than 1 zone you you allow the fight to switch from zone to zone allowing players to have the freedom and choices, switching zones to outsmart your opponent which can split up a zerg, currently splitting up the zerg means capturing bo's and getting ran over by the blob not long after, doing this a couple of times u soon give up and end up sticking to the blob and login off due to boredom, and as i have mentioned before it builds relationships between players, t4 chat is more meaningful, players feel more important when they can pass on info regarding what the enemy is doing in an off zone and also feel a sense of accomplishment if they send the word that enemies are attacking a keep and are soon wiped by reinforcements.

I dont understand why its not worth trying, with the rvr system how it is you cannot ninja an empty keep instantly, you need to build resources which gives enough time for a defending realm to see what is going on and react, you cannot easily kill a keep lord anymore its not uncommon to see an unorganised wb wipe to a keep lord and finally you get no loot from an undefended keep anyway so the only reason to capture a completely empty keep/zone is to push the campaign further towards the enemy capital, which when this comes into play it will be crucial that more than one zone is open otherwise you will see 1 side zerging like mad ending up with 3 city sieges a day.

Can we atleast try having all pairings open at once for a few weeks and see how it goes ?

[Mygnos]

I'll come in to say the same thing I say every time "open other zones" is mentioned, as it usually kills the conversation.

This game is not yet fully restored. The possibility exists of many more players being in T4 RvR than we currently have. Ask yourself what will happen if we triple the RvR population and then open all 3 maps. If the answer you get isn't "exactly the same situation we have now", then I want to know why.

Blobs are a product of the combat system. That issue isn't going to be sidestepped by opening all 3 zones.

Opening other zones will lead to empty keep swapping. To avoid the lags, the zerg, the uselessness of melees (excluding tanks) and many other things. Live version had reasons why it failed utterly, this has been one of it. To REPEAT the errors once made, will kill the private server.

Downside of this, whole parts of the game must be excluded forever/long time to repair what has been done miserably by the original designers. Again, AoR had tons of problems why it went down the drain. Some can be made undone, some not.

Done by fans who run a private server, not a $$$ company. Always remember this.

[Dresden]

I'd like to see Azaraels current battlefront system on each race area in T4 so that one zone is open in each race area if any given race area is not fully locked one way or the other.

For me, narratively, the 'battlefront' system has a very real-world feel to it.

I'm in full support of the direction Azarael is taking RvR in, that multi-open-zone thing is the last truely big sticking point for me now but i have total confidence we'll get something good because #AzaraelCrushsEverythingAndEveryoneInHisPath so i'm hopeful.

Congrats Azarael, you really are making great strides with RvR.


Q. when side A locks one T4 race area and side B locks two of them would it be prudent to unlock a zone on side A's locked race area so that the fight can continue in either direction towards a total lock?

[Morf]

Opening other zones will lead to empty keep swapping. To avoid the lags, the zerg, the uselessness of melees (excluding tanks) and many other things. Live version had reasons why it failed utterly, this has been one of it. To REPEAT the errors once made, will kill the private server.

Downside of this, whole parts of the game must be excluded forever/long time to repair what has been done miserably by the original designers. Again, AoR had tons of problems why it went down the drain. Some can be made undone, some not.

Done by fans who run a private server, not a $$$ company. Always remember this.

If the keep/zone lock system was the same it was when war died then i would agree 100% but the way rvr system works you cant flip zone after zone after zone by just buying a ram from an npc and standing afk at a keep.

As for repeating errors, what about the lower tier level changes ? on live this caused huge imbalance between the gear, skills, number of tactics etc etc a player can have, we now have the same problem here.

[theoddone]

This game is not yet fully restored. The possibility exists of many more players being in T4 RvR than we currently have. Ask yourself what will happen if we triple the RvR population and then open all 3 maps. If the answer you get isn't "exactly the same situation we have now", then I want to know why.

Blobs are a product of the combat system. That issue isn't going to be sidestepped by opening all 3 zones.

I do not think opening the zones will fix zerging at all. If you triple the population people will still zerg one zone, and go where the easiest rewards are available. It is not like if you triple the population, that it will spread out equally across the three zones. There will most likely be one very zergy zone, and two lesser zergy ones. However, there will be benefits as mentioned in this thread, and people will at least have the option to change zones.

As for the UI issue. If you dont want to swap zones, it is possible to use the search function. Pretty easy to figure out what a full wb of one guild is doing in an empty/unactive zone...

[charlysixb]

I dont like for myself but i respect blobs, zergs or whatever you guys like to call it. Its part of the game, a game that focuses mainly in Open Realm vs Realm ( Its Warhammer Fantasy, its the War! ). ORvR is like open sea where you can find anything and you need to expect anything! from a shoal to a sharks group or a single sardine.
You cant take it away ( like many people want ) because i believe its the soul of this game. Other thing is balancing the numbers.
Everyone play how they want, how they get fun and i respect that too.
I like to enter in that open sea alone, with a partner or 1-1-1 setup, those are my preferences...that adrenaline or risk is like a drug for me! others do 6man, others do WB and we need to respect eachother because there's place for everybody in here.
What we need to do ( players not devs ) is to incentivate other guys, to tell em there're alternatives. Create more duel, duos and 6man tournaments and its popularity will grow.