High Disrupt is an issue

[Telen]

90% of the kills done by those topping zone kills will be on unguarded pugs. Its the continuing conundrum to balance to the masses or balance to the fotm setups. Either way theres going to be major inbalance.

[dansari]

its equally as much of a l2p issue to consider things to be perfect, as it is to consider it all to be doom and gloom broken.

Agreed -- it's like.. 85-90% of 6v6 is: is your group competent with a decent setup? The rest depends on the specific classes you're playing (WH > BW in 6man, for example), and most of the "hard" 6mans don't even play very often.

Thanks for the feedback, I know the routation from Live how to make all the damage connect at the same time so thats not my problem. I figured it would be breaking into the 31-40 bolster. I have my RR up at my level and got softcap int since level 15. I try to get Bypass disrupt where ever i can, however I simply dont and havnt felt like I will be able to perform the role as a damage dealer how disrupt it working right now. If each time on my dots have to bypass a disrupt check, the CC to peel for myself have to bypass 50%+ disrupt chance. I'll try to make it work because i like the class and the nostalgia, but I just tried to give my input as a returning player who is leveling and how godaweful it feels right now. I do hope it gets better, but from what I am reading I am setting myself up for disappointment. If ranged damage was too high maybe taking a look into the resist debuffs, resist caps or something about the mitigating would be better than stopping all spell connects, ticks, and effects.

Totally fair -- didn't mean to propose that you didn't know the class, just how things may have changed from live (I didn't play live much at all). You may just need to find a guild to run with so you can get that feeling of accomplishment that you're not getting currently.

[Cimba]

It's definitely a different world when you're rr40 vs when you're rr70.. the extra crit or extra defenses you can establish help a lot. But, I do agree -- some of the complaining just seems to be a l2p issue. Although comparing top kills to magus/engy is silly. Good magi/engies are few and far between, and the raw damage a BW can bring is gonna be a lot higher.

Sure top kills is not really objective but its one of the metrics you can see everyday. And considering that Tato managed to beat most BW/Sorcs in that metric kinda proves what engi/magus are capable of.

BWs/Sorcs are still the very same, very potent pugkillers they have always been ~ however I can't imagine either to perform well when up against a group with two SnB tanks or an otherwise min/maxed opposition, unlike mdps they lack the pressure to make up for the lack of damage during CC/morale/HtL/assist cycles. But then again, competitve small scale encounters occur once every thousand blue moons - (organized) large scale remains BW/sorc domain, after all.

Well mdps dont create any pressure when they are chasing rdps around the map either. So it's kinda even What I found is that while your normal damage is okayish for 6on6 the real danger is the single target M4. It puts a timer on the opposing team because if you get to it, something is going to die.
Which lead to funny situations where I was running around for like 2 mins just using instants to push morale before the big morale drop happend. Ahh good times I would suggest you try it before you rule it out.

[Darosh]

BWs/Sorcs are still the very same, very potent pugkillers they have always been ~ however I can't imagine either to perform well when up against a group with two SnB tanks or an otherwise min/maxed opposition, unlike mdps they lack the pressure to make up for the lack of damage during CC/morale/HtL/assist cycles. But then again, competitve small scale encounters occur once every thousand blue moons - (organized) large scale remains BW/sorc domain, after all.

Well mdps dont create any pressure when they are chasing rdps around the map either. So it's kinda even [...]

What I refered to specficially is that, for example, a rdps that is being assisted on is forced to leg it, a mdps can (likely has to, due to CC) linger; that a mdps can perform well in all environments, whereas rdps are likely dead weight in a CQ/LoS heavy environment and so on - moreso the drain on resources (guard range yadayada) is a considerable tad lower for mdps, especially in pugs. Its a thousand times more painful to float guard for rdps than it is to float it for mdps... (even in premades rdps have a tendency to act like headless chicken and position themselves very very awkwardly, might be just the nubs I happen to play with ~).

Surely, in the lakes whilst roaming on open field, as I've noted in my post, rdps still have an edge in terms of performance ~ you can't pick off people if you melt upon impact.

To stay on topic and to reiterate:
The changes to defensives impacted inner-realm competition postively, and, maybe, scratched cross-realm performance a tiny bit, imho.

Abbd.: Note: Having a mdps chase you, forcing you to move if you are a healer/rdps is plenty of pressure. More pressure than a fireclown fiercely staring in your eyes while your tanks have a HtL rave around you popping their morales and so on. :3

[peterthepan3]

incredibly easy to top kills in zone as a magus. most just don't know the rotation/prefer to opt for silly dot spam in the hopes it will net a kill. have to agree with Cimba. not to take away from dot vs disrupt predicament, but it isn't as bad as I had thought if you choose to: a) play Havoc/Rifle, only really using 2 dots (one of which should be undefendable, imo... but that's neither here nor there); b) ignore the useless middle trees. though i'm not sure what kills in a zone vs noobs/level 16s equates to in the grand scheme of things, but it's as good a means of gauging effectiveness as any, i guess...

I think it's time we stop flogging the dead 6v6 horse. it doesn't exist, so i don't know why people so vehemently argue from this PoV anymore (oh the irony right)

[Darosh]

I think it's time we stop flogging the dead 6v6 horse. it doesn't exist, so i don't know why people so vehemently argue from this PoV anymore (oh the irony right)

Flogging it out of existence for good measure.

[Cimba]

What I refered to specficially is that, for example, a rdps that is being assisted on is forced to leg it, a mdps can (likely has to, due to CC) linger; that a mdps can perform well in all environments, whereas rdps are likely dead weight in a CQ/LoS heavy environment and so on - moreso the drain on resources (guard range yadayada) is a considerable tad lower for mdps, especially in pugs. Its a thousand times more painful to float guard for rdps than it is to float it for mdps... (even in premades rdps have a tendency to act like headless chicken and position themselves very very awkwardly, might be just the nubs I happen to play with ~).

Surely, in the lakes whilst roaming on open field, as I've noted in my post, rdps still have an edge in terms of performance ~ you can't pick off people if you melt upon impact.

To stay on topic and to reiterate:
The changes to defensives impacted inner-realm competition postively, and, maybe, scratched cross-realm performance a tiny bit, imho.

Abbd.: Note: Having a mdps chase you, forcing you to move if you are a healer/rdps is plenty of pressure. More pressure than a fireclown fiercely staring in your eyes while your tanks have a HtL rave around you popping their morales and so on. :3

Since we essentially agree i dont want to argue about the finer points and derail the thread further Just try it. Runing around like a headless chicken in eternal citadell is kinda fun

[Reesh]

If someone missed that thread i highly suggest to read it: viewtopic.php?f=100&t=23995

As later on, it went into whole disrupt and whole class balance instead of staying on topic, so it pretty much overlaps what's being said here.

Needles to say, I simply stopped playing my BW. I'm happier.

[Darosh]

If someone missed that thread i highly suggest to read it: viewtopic.php?f=100&t=23995

As later on, it went into whole disrupt and whole class balance instead of staying on topic, so it pretty much overlaps what's being said here.

Needles to say, I simply stopped playing my BW. I'm happier.

It drifts into overall (class) balance because we do not operate in a vacuum exclusive to a single class, devoid of any synergies and countermeasures.

[covenn]

Renown ability to increase disrupt with no counter ability to increase strike through. Not really surprising disrupts make some classes feel unplayable, even stacking strike through.