What could we do to change the lack of balance between factions?

[Dajciekrwi]

The problem as i see it is that there is no incentive to defend keeps or forts with lesser numbers (or with even numbers as destro vs an organised wb with enough slayers). The vast majority of defenses that i have been a part of have died at the first attackers push with minimal kills as a defender. You end up spending between 15 to 40 mins hanging around for next to no gain. As time has gone on I see more and more that the warbands I have been a part of will skip keep defense and forts to just find kills in the lakes and to be honest it is less boring and more rewarding.

And since most times you will never see a side siege without a significant advantage in numbers the game actively encourages people to all play on one side if you want to progress.

So my idea would be to make sieges have an actual advantage for the defender. Part of this I personally see as a class balance problem, which its best not to go into as it has been said in a thousand threads on the forums already. So ignoring that, make defense more interactive and allow people to do stuff instead of waiting for the doors to go down. Actual ways to get kills, not tickle them with siege weapons. Perhaps they can damage based on the disadvantage in numbers your side has. Siege weapons should get ammo if your side has aao as its impossible to hold flags while you are already at a disadvantage.

Make keeps easier to get into if your side has a significant disadvantage. Maybe you can fly to the keep for free while your side has a certain amount of aao?

Most important is make defending a keep actually worth turning up for. Sometimes i actually get more renown of handing in one box than for trying to defend a keep.

Discourage solo play, encourage group play. Lessen the massive amounts of renown and crests certain classes get just because the have a viable solo build and increase the renown and crests tanks and healers get in a group to encourage people to play the classes and form bands.

SWEET JESUS, do You know whta thiss all will do with the game ?? It will completly kill any movement or action ibn RVR. If You want to give advantage and rewards for keep defending, soon every weakres Side will stay in keep, wait for siege and do NOTHING!!
Discourage solo players ??? That a true herd mentality, great How You want to bring more ppl to this game ? "Join the RoR , join the WB, you are meaningless"? On the end it will be one WB vs WB and thats a perfect plan for RoR!

[Sulorie]

The change to guard damage (undefendable attacks become undefendable guard damage) broke rampage. Aoe cap inc also made this ability over the top for a 5pts ability.

This is known and has been pointed out in millions of threads. It won’t change since to many influential players and devs are invested and don’t want to loose the cheese.

Disturbing how sorc IW spam and destruction reflects or morales is quickly nerfed but this is left obviously broken

One would think one tiny tweak like rampage not applying to guard damage would fix it. I have no idea why this isn't done.

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What annoys me as well is people comparing rampage to gtdc, when both skills are in entirely different tiers e.g. 5pt vs 13pt.

[Bozzax]

Order as a whole would benefit from rampage being tuned down to a 5pts ability in the ST tree ie a dot or a XX ap backo on next ability use or something

It is obvious

[MMXX43]

either pump order or nerf destro really, this is the ultimatum at this moment .

[HammerGuy]

2h or snb doesn't matter for rampage. Block and parry means nothing to rampage.

Please tell me how to mitigate guard damage. From what I understand it is not mitigated by anything on the tank, only by whatever the guarded teammate's mitigation is. The tank can block or parry the guard damage, unless it is from an undefendable attack (ie rampage).

Or lower the enemy's damage, or absorbs.

And ofc snb or 2h matters lol, I'm not talking about block here, but your spec/gear are totally different and you HAVE to spec parry since that's your only choice, and parry sux for destro.
Who u gonna parry anyways when they attack you ? One of the 3 WL on the server ? Or the WH ?
So you need parry for guard damage but you won't parry anything else, bad situation.

Also, many DPS spec parry which is useless, if they had defenses that work vs slayers, guard dmg would be lower.

But I am talking about block. I can get 42% block, 52% with a tactic, along with 31% parry, 61% with a tactic. For 10 seconds I can get my block over 100%. And rampage blows through all of it.

Your idea for mitigation is to use an absorb shield or lower the slayer's damage. Challenge is great, except it is gone after three hits, and since I'm guarding a melee dps the aoe from the slayer makes the challenge evaporate in no time. I could use distracting bellow, which is a morale 3. How long will that absorb shield last? Maybe two hits, unless it's the morale 3. Requiring morale 3 to counter a 5-point ability is not balanced. Especially when after 10-20 seconds that 5-point ability will be ready again while the morale will be on a 60 second cooldown.

I guard a marauder. Even with the marauder in sovereign and running monstrosity I will die from guard damage. I can tell when the slayer turns on rampage, not just from BuffHead but because my health is ok and then it just drops. I look at the combat log and my 52% block and 61% parry do nothing.


Since we're talking about WLs and WHs, you know what the difference between them and the slayers is? They require positioning to go through my block and parry. Their guard damage can be blocked and parried. A slayer hits a 5-point ability and my advantage as a tank disappears. Rampage will even ignore Shield Wall. Let that sink in. A 5-point ability will IGNORE MORALE 2 increasing block to 100%.

[Earthcake]

But I am talking about block. I can get 42% block, 52% with a tactic, along with 31% parry, 61% with a tactic. For 10 seconds I can get my block over 100%. And rampage blows through all of it.

Your idea for mitigation is to use an absorb shield or lower the slayer's damage. Challenge is great, except it is gone after three hits, and since I'm guarding a melee dps the aoe from the slayer makes the challenge evaporate in no time. I could use distracting bellow, which is a morale 3. How long will that absorb shield last? Maybe two hits, unless it's the morale 3. Requiring morale 3 to counter a 5-point ability is not balanced. Especially when after 10-20 seconds that 5-point ability will be ready again while the morale will be on a 60 second cooldown.

I guard a marauder. Even with the marauder in sovereign and running monstrosity I will die from guard damage. I can tell when the slayer turns on rampage, not just from BuffHead but because my health is ok and then it just drops. I look at the combat log and my 52% block and 61% parry do nothing.


Since we're talking about WLs and WHs, you know what the difference between them and the slayers is? They require positioning to go through my block and parry. Their guard damage can be blocked and parried. A slayer hits a 5-point ability and my advantage as a tank disappears. Rampage will even ignore Shield Wall. Let that sink in. A 5-point ability will IGNORE MORALE 2 increasing block to 100%.

Well, some defenses work vs slayers and some don't.
You want to continue stacking the ones that don't, what can I say ?

Also, for some reason you seem to think that it's normal to be impossible to kill.

[Phantasm]

Sad part is, if devs nerf Rampage order population will drop drastically and we will get even lower population.

Better would be to mirror it.

[Bozzax]

It needs to be done and if you watch some organised order wb vids you soon notice Rampage is called exactly as morale dropss used to be … guess why

Shouldn’t be mirrored it is to broken and creates an archetype imbalance for wbs

[ritual]

Sad part is, if devs nerf Rampage order population will drop drastically and we will get even lower population.

Better would be to mirror it.

"plz allow order to continue face roll rampage and spin to win, otherwise it will lead to an even greater drop of population"
so pathetic

[Tesq]

a remainder for all orders only player that IB and chosen have the same mitigation in s+b ...

ch = 25parry +25parry = 50 % frontal avoidance

ib = 10blok + 25parry =
ib = (10parry +10 front dodg + 10front .disrpt) + 25 p= 55% frontal avoidance (and also give free 25% to a likely slayer buddy )

so you can understand where put any "rampage is fine" talk...

A rampage nerf should likely be follow by a gift of mostruosity nerf ; you know the both 100% stuff in game...of course they dont requrie the same drop or qol change but .... whatever we have someone that keep tell its a slayer unique feature so it cant be tone down ..... dig forum to see who's the one..

P.S: rampage has also been "buff" to ignore guard block/parry compared to live ....

P.P.S: tough @earth is right as chosen you have other way to reduces dmg, still is just lazy easy how order tank can have a better dmg reduction by having less stronger dd to face... Also the slayer create a wb type of play destru wb cant do....they can impose the gameplay of their side onto the other...