Destro are OP

[peterthepan3]

I don't think any one class is really OP.
But here's my noob 2 cents (it's my thread after all)
1. "Balancing" classes is the way of the devil. If you want everything balanced go find a game where there is only 1 class and everyone is equal (try counter strike)
2. Every class has its place. Example WL and SH (because of pets and skill trees). A SH who has space can pretty much kite 2 tanks across Prague and likely kill them both. But a WL facing 2 tanks is either meat or running for their lives. Stay in your "niche" you win... Leave your "niche" you die.

actually balance is imperative in any game that wants to be successful...that's why certain games are thriving.
balance is needed in this game to promote new combinations/classes being used other than the monotonous FOTM easy crap.

[NSKaneda]

IMO only classes easily replaced are engies and magi due to their lack of mobility.


But then again I've seen really good ones changing the outcome of a battle, so... Like Tenrock said, do what your class was designed to do and watch the purple numbers fly

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

SM and BO are a bug bear atm because of one shared ability their damage is insane.

Mind going into detail?

Spoiler:

stop those filthy guard kicks they are not going to work

[TenTonHammer]

The thing about balance is that certain abilities on certain classes way over preform making those classes a must have in group.

Case and point

Auras from kotbs and chosen

[Gachimuchi]

Bright Wizards are more powerful that Sorcerers. Don't forget about cauterize.
BW have incHD and CC, Sorcs have more damage. When someone is below 50-60% health with WoP on them they die, Boiling Blood isn't so potent. This is coming from someone who has played healers on both sides.
Engineers are more powerful than Maguses. They are ranged attackers not casters.
Magi only have to stack int while Engis need ballistic skill/weapon skill.
Iron Breakers are the same as Black Guards.'
No. IB is infinitely better than Blackguard. BG has a handful of things over IB:
-Detaunt immunity
-Tactic based wounds debuff
-Easier to build class mechanic
-Golf punt
-Better dps in 2H spec than IB
-5s KD in SnB
-Choking fury

Ironbreakers on the other hand:
-Can tank guard damage in 2H spec
-Has on demand KD in 2H spec
-Outgoing heal debuff isn't group cleanseable by DoK(I didn't say M2)
-AoE snares aren't group cleanseable
-IB's AoE snares don't require sinking 13 points into a mostly useless tree
-Very strong buffs for allies
-Skin of Iron & Gromril Plating
-Better trees in general

Additionally the blackguard tank tree is completely useless aside from the parry tactic which requires 11 points sunk into it. I say wave of scorn is useless because its gcleanseable by WP. No reason to run a BG over a Blorc.

KOtBS'es are more powerful than Chosens. Look at their path trees and abilities to understand.
Chosen does more damage than KoTBs because ravage. Chosen also can build morale incredibly fast which allows them to drop a 75% inc damage reduction on the group for 10 seconds relatively frequently. They can go 2H and tank guard damage because of Suppression. Aside from that Knight is much better at group support/buffing and has much more useful abilities/tactics in their trees and I think it sets knight ahead of Chosen.
Runepriests are the same as Zealots.
Master rune of fury > Ritual of Innervation.Other than that, yea mostly the same.
Sword Masters are a bit better than Black Orcs.
Blorcs have an AoE spammable snare/disorent that isn't cleanseable by WP. They also can build morale insanely fast. SM can tank guard damage in 2H spec, Blorc can't. SM has Whispering Winds, Blorc has Not in da face.
Warrior priests are a bit weaker than DoK's, but they have interesting debuffs.
WP can't cleanse most incHD, DoK can cleanse all of them. Khaine's Withdrawal is almost a get out of jail free card for a group. A melee train on someone in your group is M2 away from getting that heal debuff, snare, wounds debuff, toughness debuff, armor debuff any anything else that might be on them instantly removed. DoK is much better in DPS spec than WP. WP however can all cleanse outgoing heal debuffs.
WH's are almost the same as WE's.
I consider all WH finishers(except loldragongun) better than the WE equivalent but beyond that I'm not that knowledgeable.

[Telen]

I don't think any one class is really OP.
But here's my noob 2 cents (it's my thread after all)
1. "Balancing" classes is the way of the devil. If you want everything balanced go find a game where there is only 1 class and everyone is equal (try counter strike)
2. Every class has its place. Example WL and SH (because of pets and skill trees). A SH who has space can pretty much kite 2 tanks across Prague and likely kill them both. But a WL facing 2 tanks is either meat or running for their lives. Stay in your "niche" you win... Leave your "niche" you die.

Ive always liked mmos that arent scared to overhaul balance regularly. It keeps the game fresh as players are constantly forced to come up with new combos. swtor is the master of this which is what has kept their 4v4s interesting. Every patch at least one class gets a raft of changes usually the weakest. So if you comeback every few months like I do at least one class is going to feel new.
In war one class may not be really op but some combos certainly piss all over others.

[katroulitsa]

It's just about the looks, Destruction classes look better, but Order has stronger classes.
Archmages are the same as Shamans.
Bright Wizards are more powerful that Sorcerers. Don't forget about cauterize.
Engineers are more powerful than Maguses. They are ranged attackers not casters.
Iron Breakers are the same as Black Guards.
KOtBS'es are more powerful than Chosens. Look at their path trees and abilities to understand.
Runepriests are the same as Zealots.
Shadow Warriors and Marauders. Hard to compare, but SW's deal more damage and are a really strong ranged class.
Slayer is stronger than Choppa. Look at path trees.
Sword Masters are a bit better than Black Orcs.
Warrior priests are a bit weaker than DoK's, but they have interesting debuffs.
White Lions are better than Herders.
WH's are almost the same as WE's.

Truth been told m8s

[peterthepan3]

Magus is a much better PBAOE DPS than Engineer. I'd also argue that they have a better potential burst rotation, too (Snipe hits the target instantly, so you can't really set up 3/4 abilities to hit at the same time with it)

[Collateral]

SM and BO are a bug bear atm because of one shared ability their damage is insane.

Mind going into detail?

Spoiler:

stop those filthy guard kicks they are not going to work

While I don't know what exactly he is talking about, I can say that my bo can do some insane damage. I play a SnB bo, and I more often than not do more dmg than 2h bo and 2h chosen, even maras, choppas and we (and before you ask, I do guard constantly). And the great majority of that dmg is on single target. The only aoe that I have is a snare on big swing, but that is not really a dmg dealer. I can also be pretty tanky, with around 800 toughness with chosens aura and focusing in parry, block and dis/dodge in RR tree. And that's the reason I don't know why people run 2h bo. I think they are far less tanky (unless you stack armour and parry I guess, but what's the point since you are 2h and should be stacking ws, or did I get something wrong?), and the dmg is pretty much the same if not lower than SnB (which is the case more often though, at least when I play).

The combo I use is wot armour to skull thumper to tree hit combo, and spaming aoe snare as much as I can.

I'm not saying I'm the best bo ever, cuz I'm obviously not, but I just thought I'll share my experience, if there is indeed something wrong here. I can try and test it out if the devs want, although I never tested for bugs before. It would suck if that was true though, cuz I really like my bo

[peterthepan3]

SM and BO are a bug bear atm because of one shared ability their damage is insane.

Mind going into detail?

Spoiler:

stop those filthy guard kicks they are not going to work

While I don't know what exactly he is talking about, I can say that my bo can do some insane damage. I play a SnB bo, and I more often than not do more dmg than 2h bo and 2h chosen, even maras, choppas and we (and before you ask, I do guard constantly). And the great majority of that dmg is on single target. The only aoe that I have is a snare on big swing, but that is not really a dmg dealer. I can also be pretty tanky, with around 800 toughness with chosens aura and focusing in parry, block and dis/dodge in RR tree. And that's the reason I don't know why people run 2h bo. I think they are far less tanky (unless you stack armour and parry I guess, but what's the point since you are 2h and should be stacking ws, or did I get something wrong?), and the dmg is pretty much the same if not lower than SnB (which is the case more often though, at least when I play).

The combo I use is wot armour to skull thumper to tree hit combo, and spaming aoe snare as much as I can.

I'm not saying I'm the best bo ever, cuz I'm obviously not, but I just thought I'll share my experience, if there is indeed something wrong here. I can try and test it out if the devs want, although I never tested for bugs before. It would suck if that was true though, cuz I really like my bo

that's probably because you're one of the last targets to be focused/die, and thus your overall damage may be higher. 2H BO isn't as effective as a SNB BO, but it is fun. I use it, and like you said you need to stack parry/armor to make it work. I guess it's more a style choice.