SC queueing is working as intended and driving players away?

[Everdin]

Are you trying to pimp your post counter?

[Martok]

Are you trying to pimp your post counter?

No. I was just reading through the thread and responding as I encountered post worthy of responding to.

I have never been a pimp. Although I did play one on TV.

[Phantasm]

New flavour the month is to queue 4 groups all on comms and play is as aoe warband

[Mordd]

Also Im in a guild, a pretty active NA guild. Guild and friends arent always on or available for a SC group.

Oh, and, perhaps by some random chance or complete coincidence would that guild have a name which started with an S and have an F in it somewhere? Because if so, then I was at one time a proud member of that guild and quite distinctly remember many instances of running in pre-mades groups designed specifically to take advantage of said SC queing system and go bash on the opposing force pugs.

I mean, you know, no disparagement meant or anything, just defining irony.

And we are the ones campaigning to have it fixed.
Premades arent the problem.
Solos arent the problem.
A system that stacks premades against solos a majority of the time is the issue.

[Monteaux]

tool work as intent? sorry i've to spit out. i've done this morning 6 times in a row the weekend sc black crag and all the time i get the same orders vs our grps. all orders are the same as the sc before and ya wanna told us that it will be ballanced? low/mid 20th vs. 2 grps mid/end 30th? nope that isn't i called ballance, that i called order bbq.
i tried it with less or more breaks between my sc's so that normally the grps have to switch....nope it doesn't. so it will be the sek time i couldn't play ya event in my played fraction cause the other side will dominate in may locationtime. and i wont let me forced to play an other side to play and end the events onetime. so my 50ct.: tool isn't ballanced and to play the events ya have to play that side who dominate at the location timezone.....really sad and annoying.

p.e.: 1. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 1e0c281e4b
2. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 0d267b5e94
3. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 726fbc6854
4. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 499dc6f047
....
ya will see every time the same ppl...non different orders and so it will be punishment to play destro at this location timezone, horrible game-xp to do the event, impossible to do the event in mid-t at this time.

[ReBiff]

tool work as intent? sorry i've to spit out. i've done this morning 6 times in a row the weekend sc black crag and all the time i get the same orders vs our grps. all orders are the same as the sc before and ya wanna told us that it will be ballanced? low/mid 20th vs. 2 grps mid/end 30th? nope that isn't i called ballance, that i called order bbq.
i tried it with less or more breaks between my sc's so that normally the grps have to switch....nope it doesn't. so it will be the sek time i couldn't play ya event in my played fraction cause the other side will dominate in may locationtime. and i wont let me forced to play an other side to play and end the events onetime. so my 50ct.: tool isn't ballanced and to play the events ya have to play that side who dominate at the location timezone.....really sad and annoying.

p.e.: 1. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 1e0c281e4b
2. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 0d267b5e94
3. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 726fbc6854
4. https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 499dc6f047
....
ya will see every time the same ppl...non different orders and so it will be punishment to play destro at this location timezone, horrible game-xp to do the event, impossible to do the event in mid-t at this time.

you need to reread this earlier post, it wasn't meant to be balanced, its just meant to put 6 players against 6 players and thats essentially it, unless you want 30minute que times again. Because it doesnt work the way you want it to doesn't mean its broken.

It is a rather simple queue. If there's enough people on each side to create a scenario instance, people on both sides are added to it. Then people are added to fill the rest of the slots.

You are focused on a solo experience where there isn't one designed, and that's your expectation, not ours. You may adjust your expectation to match reality and find it is working correctly. If you want to play the discordant queue for a solo experience, it's available for you. If you want to participate in the weekend warfronts, then form a group for best results. We understand not everyone is going to play every kind of content, and when PvP is concerned, having coordination with a group is always going to be an advantage you should grow and learn towards.

Warg you are not a programmer. you repeat what you are told.
Everyone that plays knows its not that simple.

Many times when solo queueing at the same time as friends one person can go several pops with no pop as their friends get multiple SC pops.
Queueing as a 5 man is very hard to get pops on even though all the MM has to do is ad one solo player.
Queueing as a full group will get pops much faster than 6 solo queueing.
these are basics that most players with much experience know. So no it is not as basic and simple as you believe. There is more going on with the MM. As with any system like that there can be unintended consequences to basic small modifications. Something as simple as say prioritizing healers and tanks could cause the MM to stack one SC with all healer and tanks and leaving a second SC with only DPS. I program 4 different languages I have seen things like that happen many times and a system might seem like its ok under normal circumstances and only show problems at extremes of lower than expected or more than expected numbers.

its posible its just random. But the thing is with computers. Nothing is truly random. one of the hardest things to do in programming is to make a random number generator that appears actually random. Because there is no such thing as random in a computer.

I am not simply repeating what I am told. This is very rarely ever the case.

I have more than enough experience with coding to be able to look at code and understand it. Granted, it's not a full time job of mine, I don't particularly enjoy that sort of challenge, and my skillset is not close to be a standalone core developer. I have an established role on the team and have been around for a very long time working with many developers over many years on many different systems. I thought it was fairly common knowledge that I do contribute to some degree with design on the team, and have a general understanding of how things work and why they work. That's why when people post things that are wrong, I can frequently, accurately, correct them.

Queueing as a full group gets you a faster pop because the matchmaker already knows one side has 6 available. This doesn't contradict what I said. The wait time for each match is very short, only 60 seconds, and has been for a couple of months. Before that it would create matches as soon as enough people were in the queue. Currently the matchmaker will check, first come first serve, for full groups on both sides, then partial groups, then solo players. If it can find anything that creates at least a 4v4 match, it will do so, and then it will attempt to fill the remaining slots as the scenario continues every 30 seconds. There's no randomization involved, it does not try to match groups to item level or renown rank. It does not try to make sure each team has healers or tanks. It simply finds the number of people on each side and creates a scenario. I have specific detailed understanding about this because the last time it was touched, I was working with the dev on it.

The problem with adding more complexity to a queue system is the increase of time between matches. We've done this before, people were very mad they had to wait up to 15 minutes between scenarios, so we turned it off. Could we make sure each group has 1 tank and 1 healer? Yes. We could. But it would take much longer for each scenario. Could we make sure that renown or item level are used to make sure the matches are balanced in power? Yes. We could. But it would take much longer for each scenario. It is a simple matchmaking queue to make sure at least the sides are even before the match is started.

You want it to work differently from how it is designed. That's clear, and we've tried some different things. However, people don't want to wait. The current system is not broken, it is not a bug, it is not some tinfoil hat randomization conspiracy based on code you've never seen. It's actually working as intended.


TL;DR For the people in the back. If you want to be successful in general scenarios (including weekend warfronts), the optimal way to do so is to form full groups and coordinate with your team.

If you want to queue solo and enjoy a more casual experience, play the Discordant queue.

[Monteaux]

you need to reread this earlier post, it wasn't meant to be balanced, its just meant to put 6 players against 6 players and thats essentially it, unless you want 30minute que times again. Because it doesnt work the way you want it to doesn't mean its broken.

then i prefer the 30mins time so i could play i want to play not forced to play

[Sulorie]

you need to reread this earlier post, it wasn't meant to be balanced, its just meant to put 6 players against 6 players and thats essentially it, unless you want 30minute que times again. Because it doesnt work the way you want it to doesn't mean its broken.

then i prefer the 30mins time so i could play i want to play not forced to play

The worse team lost, so what? One side has to lose.
Seeing too few tanks on destro side in your screenshots and those who are in don't guard. I doubt I will be wrong, if I assume the destro dps didn't assist each other. The chances are high those 20s chars will lack appropriate gear to maximize bolster, which appears to be true for almost all who struggle.
They would lose with a full set of rank 30s as well.

[Scottx125]

then i prefer the 30mins time so i could play i want to play not forced to play

Then thank god you're not the majority. I remember when we had 1-2 hour queues for a single balanced pop.. It's ridiculous. People would just stop playing SC's.. And you're not forced to play, you don't have to do SC's like you did back in the past for certain gear. If it's not to your liking don't play it. As infuriating as the system is, it's as balanced as it can be with the limited population pool. The fact that it matches 6v6 first means it tries to put pre-mades together first before matching them with smaller pre-mades and pugs.

It's very simple, form a pre-made and queue. Or don't and be at the mercy of other pre-mades.

And we are the ones campaigning to have it fixed.
Premades arent the problem.
Solos arent the problem.
A system that stacks premades against solos a majority of the time is the issue.

It only does that if there's no alternative at the time of making the match after a period of match making. Only thing I can think of if a bias flag that prevents previous pugs from being matched with a pre-made 2 times in a row. However that may affect those pugs and that pre-made being able to get SC's.

[Mordd]

It only does that if there's no alternative at the time of making the match after a period of match making. Only thing I can think of if a bias flag that prevents previous pugs from being matched with a pre-made 2 times in a row. However that may affect those pugs and that pre-made being able to get SC's.

not according to Dalen and max. When a full group Ques. It attempts to make a scenario. If there was a FG waiting in que and there was no one for them to fight, it will pair them. If there is no FG is will grab 6 small group or solos. So the only way the group gets another group is if there wasnt enough in que for one group to get a pop and a group ques against them. so it will be more common to put smallmans and solos vs FGs.