Did they go on like this forever?

[Alfinnete]

Hello everyone.

First I need to apologize for my English.

I need to confess that I do not follow very closely the complaints about unbalance here in the forum, I spend much more time playing. In the game I see tons of complaints against WLs, and with good reason. WLs are very forceful with a very exaggerated initial power when opening a fight. With the help of NB this makes it even more ridiculous.

Well, I do not want to quote what is good or bad in it, we know that today is probably the most OP class in the game for many reasons.

My question is about why it continues like this, since even in the order there are many deboches among the WLs who know that they are with a class that besides not requiring much mental effort has the damage in seconds more absurd than we have already seen.

The fact that we do not see the Devs talk a lot in adjusting for WL is due to limitations or just because they believe the class really looks like this? In my point of view if they believe the class is right, they should look at Mara.

Thank you for your interest

[Osred]

WL is Orders reaction to the Sham/SH+run away+RD+QE kite meta going on at Destro right now.

This thread will be locked anyway. No balance changes for a few years till Sov.

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=20423

[pot]

They nerfed pounce alrdy if i recall

[Danielle]

On this server the WL pet ability usage is fully automated and not manually usable. Afaik they also don't have a lot of abilities off the GCD (I am sure there is one or two, but I can't rememeber a single one atm), nor do they have stance switching like a marauder so NB doesn't to all that much for them.

The problem you are actually trying to address that balance-wise pet specced Leonine Frenzy WL is an absolutely cancerous class ranging from anything like a 1v1 to 2v2's, 3v3's and such other smaller scale engagements. Not to mention being pulled into a zerg by a CC-immune on-crack speed pet is also tremendous fun. The other side of the coin is that for organized 6v6 or 12v12 with premades vs. premades a WL is pretty much an above average or average Order mdps, it's pet gets killed, overall damage isn't that high and outside of the WL's predictable burst window (he has to resummon pet) it does very little pressure. Because the focus is on killing the pet in organized setting you can see why the pet build that is extremely annoying in ORvR is pretty much irrelevant in organized scenario type settings, and if anything weaker than the other available WL builds. Mara is actually by far and wide the better organized 6v6/12v12 class than the WL.

So there's the dilemma; do you nerf a class build that does nothing for the class and is actually underpowered in organized settings, because it's extremely powerful in PuG and non full group settings, or do you let the class run rampant in 1v1's and other cases the balancing wasn't focused on? If Aza is ever back I am sure WL players and haters alike could come up with a rework for the classes pet builds (Because that's pretty much what's needed imo), until then balance efforts are on hold sadly.

[Daknallbomb]

Yea a nerf wl thread btw dont forget to buff shammy...

To topic : there are Tons of anti wls threads atm The most are closed. Balance is on Ice atm

[ToXoS]

WL and Mara have already been nerfed anyway.
WL with the modifications to pounce, and Mara with the CD of thunderous blow being raised from 5 sec to 10 sec.
So people should stop whining in chat/forum and realise that both classes are already nerfed. Or more precisely, that devs have already looked on these classes balance.
Instead of thinking that WL is a nightmare, maybe they should be grateful that pounce is no longer spammable, thanks to the devs.

WL is a beast only against pugs, which generally don't have the time to react to a WL burst. From my experience, being more aware of your environment and being close to your WB will be enough to deal with WL, if your healers and the entire WB are not sleeping on a BO.

[Telen]

It more an issue of survivable mdps in a melee train with very strong debuffs from itself and its tank can carry a huge amount of dps without speccing for it. Its the same situation with the Marauder. Just be thankful that not every single group runs with that same comp on order.

[Aurandilaz]

The argument "WL is barely performing in 6v6" is pretty weak, considering maybe 5-10% of the playerbase does 6v6 fights and the fights are pretty damn rare. In the lakes its always random numbers, and even in Scs it consists of bunch of fights/ganks/raids/pushes/kites with the rare "main fight".

I've given up on dreaming about WL nerf, and decided to roll one. It seems pretty strong so far, easing bursting down people in T1, and as for Midtier, I expect to be able to better chop down a lot of people as soon as I get pounce. For a class that "barely manages in 6v6", it is really strong in smaller scale.
Best suggestion, roll one, go max dmg spec, get to T4 asap and enjoy the bursting of clothies and lowbies.

Besides, with the possibility of renown wipe coming closer, it's perfect time to level up a new WL.

[Danielle]

The argument "WL is barely performing in 6v6" is pretty weak, considering maybe 5-10% of the playerbase does 6v6 fights and the fights are pretty damn rare. In the lakes its always random numbers, and even in Scs it consists of bunch of fights/ganks/raids/pushes/kites with the rare "main fight".

I've given up on dreaming about WL nerf, and decided to roll one. It seems pretty strong so far, easing bursting down people in T1, and as for Midtier, I expect to be able to better chop down a lot of people as soon as I get pounce. For a class that "barely manages in 6v6", it is really strong in smaller scale.
Best suggestion, roll one, go max dmg spec, get to T4 asap and enjoy the bursting of clothies and lowbies.

Besides, with the possibility of renown wipe coming closer, it's perfect time to level up a new WL.

When balancing restarts one day you can go ahead and make your suggestion to balance the game around PuG play as it is 90% of the game (I very much doubt that assertion).

[Aurandilaz]

When balancing restarts one day you can go ahead and make your suggestion to balance the game around PuG play as it is 90% of the game (I very much doubt that assertion).

not saying that everyone is always pugging, but I very much doubt that the majority of playerbase is interested in doing regular "competitive" "6man" "boisbands" action with optimized setups.
There is a lot to WAR/RoR and rvr is so much more than just 6v6 fights.
Obviously I might have my own limited worldview, but I truly doubt that we have a lot of guilds left that do "competitive" 6mans.
And then again, this game is not really balance on just 6v6, nor 3v3, nor 12v12, nor 24v24... it's a bit chaotic, and it has elements of all different scales in it.