Fun is decreasing - lets discuss

[iagdtod]

Well, if you had read a bit more carefully you'd note I didn't say things have been the same since the beginning. I noted some important changes. That these tactics have been part of the game all the time doesn't mean they are the same, nor does your thinking really stand up. Deft defender is easier to get, so are other things for all classes. But arguing on the internet is bad habit, enjoy your certainty even though you're only a bit right.

[gisborne]

I think people tend to have a rosier perception of the past that doesn't reflect its reality. Just because you've gotten bored of the same content for 10+ years doesn't mean things have gotten worse. That's the nature of PvP games.

It's also ironic that people say they want change, yet when change is made they complain about how much better things used to be 15 years ago on live. I can tell you I've played RoR far more than I played live even though I had a RL friend also playing live with me. The only thing that I recall being "better" on live was the sense of a real campaign incentive. Unfortunately, that incentive (attacking the opposing city so you could get Sov gear) also fueled the gear imbalance. Early live when everyone was in conqueror, maybe invader level gear was good, then it deteriorated massively with tryhards getting Sov while casuals were basically locked out of that, and it completely jumped the shark with rr100 gear.

[Krima]

Fun for me has increased a lot. The changes to the new SCE are amazing. I'm mainly a scenario player, and I'm really enjoying it.

I just wish more of the best players would queue up. Ranked should return to the game.

Also, all PvE gear should be transferred to PvP, or at least mirrored. Players should have the option to obtain that gear entirely through PvP

[Brakh]

I think the game has problems on several levels. With a player base that rarely exceeds a thousand active players during prime time, the only real activity is usually a "blob vs. blob" battle that drags on all evening in a single zone. Furthermore, with such a small population, it only takes one side gathering a organized group to dominate the zone; the opposing side is then left with a simple choice: log out, switch factions, or simply do something else entirely to avoid being farmed.
It is a niche project where, despite the development team's good intentions, they simply lack the resources to roll out new content on a schedule that satisfies the players.
The gameplay itself lacks a clear objective; pushing zones is only feasible if one side has a numerical advantage, and the fort becomes pointless when an unorganized PUG faces a organized team.
For new players, moving beyond Tier 1 and progressing from level 16 to 40 is an agonizing grind; most new people quit at this stage, feeling helpless when facing seasoned veterans.
Was it better 6–8 years ago? I think so. Back then, the game felt new or refreshed. You could really feel the sense of progression and wanted to develop your character. Now, it’s just a boring grind for yet another alt.

[wildwindblows]

fun is over because weapon patch is a totall fiasco. rank 39 random drop weapons are bis. nobody is happy.

[Slowbro]

Too much focus on pve. Too much focus on blobbageddon instead of small-scale and 1vs1. Cool specs get nerfed or completely deleted. Defensive specs and setups are pushed into top tier. Offensive specs are out of the game. Overall defensive stats are way to strong.

[Bankei]

When I talk to people pretty much all of them agree that the fun of fighting has decreased over the last years.

Lets gather some input/feedback here. Feel free to answer one or more of these questions:
-> What do you think got worse? Or do you think it got better? Tell as what and why. Keep it short. What got worse and why, maybe short suggestion to improve.
-> What do you think is currently hurting the overall fun? You don't like pulls or stealthers? Tell us.

Keep it short. Please stay on topic.

------
I do the start.

I personally think that there are some "cheesy" game plays that are really hurting the overall fun for me:

1. Fishing for people with pulls. It's such a low risk/high reward strategy that is very easy to pull off and very hard to counter, granting almost a guaranteed kill in most cases. The pull distance for Maras/WLs is just too far. It feels unfair and not fun.

2. Playing golf with people. Tanks with crazy high defenses walking in knocking someone down and punting it into the own lines. Like with pulls it is a low risk / high reward tactic that is again very hard to counter, almost impossible. Again it feels unfair and not fun.

3. Moral drop farming. This I see a lot in orvr by organized warbands. They wait for their morals, pretend to fall back just to overpower them quickly with moral drops. Again a very cheesy play which can be executed almost every minute. For the casual players just wanting to have fun this feels very unfair and not fun because they keep getting killed without being able to kill anything. Works especially well on destro with their fast moral gains, snare prayer from doks and mara aoe kd.

4. Small scale died off with all the overtuned stealthers everywhere. Nothing to add there. Should be obvious.

There is only one point for me that really made the game better than before:

1. I like the new scenario queue system. Works really well and I think it's the best you can get out of that queue system. Fun in scenarios increased due to more equal matches.

Your turn.

1. Your tank, if there is any light behind their eyes, will keep an eye out for this and taunt the marauder, interrupting the pull. Or slow the lion, at which point if your warband has any amount of dps it is dead in a second.

2. Your tank, seeing the enemy tank close in like that, will get behind their tank, and a) slow them while the dps, who also isn't asleep, sees the enemy tank and moves away; b) knocks them down from behind and punts the tank either into your group to get killed, or away from your group, preventing the fishing strat.

3. Yes, a core difference between a good warband and a bad warband is whether your leader knows how to predict enemy morale drops / set up opportunities for his own and whether the players can follow the warband leaders commands for such things effectively.

4. No comment, not my horses, not my race.

The summary is, the game is good and fun when people put in effort into it. If they don't, I mean, well, they will lose to people that do. If that isn't fun, then I have two things to say:
1) Why is this theoretical individual playing a game that is inherently based around pvp, a competitive game mode, if he doesn't find competitive aspects fun?
2) Even if this theoretical individual's casual (like extremely casual, because what we're talking about is basic things in terms of effort) preferences end up being catered to, you can only dumb down a pvp game so much before it just becomes a joke and the game becomes an oversimplified grey flavorless colorless goo.

There's a reason why more casual-minded gamers tend to play pve games.

This is a perfect reply to this thread

It's not cheesy to try and give yourself every advantage in a PvP game. Of course, the topic devolved into blob complaining. But again, a weaker pug warband has every benefit of joining forces with an organized warband, this multiplies their power and gives them a chance to have fun.

Destro still have a lot of players running small scale or solo

I understand that some players have been with this game for 12 years and want to see something new. As someone who joined about 18 months ago, I've seen this game improve massively and my level of fun has been improving every day

[Alubert]

What I like:
Great WS/INI changes!
Great tank rework.
Great healer rework.
Excellent tank punt changes!
Good attempts at class balance compared to the live server (except WE).
SC matchmaking.
Changes to itemization.
Great work on PvE!

What I don’t like:
Too powerful AoE in the lobby, encouraging mindless gameplay (AoE should be reduced by 20–30%).
The game encourages blobbing too much.
24 AoE cap.
Lack of tools like Odjira/RD/CW to escape large groups of enemies.
WE should lose its leap, Absorb Tact, and some of its 100% armor penetration.
RvR maps are too small. The OrvR zone should be larger at the expense of some of the PvE areas on the map, forcing players to spread out across the entire map, which should reduce blobbing.
No campaign.
City sieges not resulting from a campaign (as was previously the case after two successful attacks on a fort)

[DevanShell]

When I talk to people pretty much all of them agree that the fun of fighting has decreased over the last years.

Lets gather some input/feedback here. Feel free to answer one or more of these questions:
-> What do you think got worse? Or do you think it got better? Tell as what and why. Keep it short. What got worse and why, maybe short suggestion to improve.
-> What do you think is currently hurting the overall fun? You don't like pulls or stealthers? Tell us.

Keep it short. Please stay on topic.

------
I do the start.

I personally think that there are some "cheesy" game plays that are really hurting the overall fun for me:

1. Fishing for people with pulls. It's such a low risk/high reward strategy that is very easy to pull off and very hard to counter, granting almost a guaranteed kill in most cases. The pull distance for Maras/WLs is just too far. It feels unfair and not fun.

2. Playing golf with people. Tanks with crazy high defenses walking in knocking someone down and punting it into the own lines. Like with pulls it is a low risk / high reward tactic that is again very hard to counter, almost impossible. Again it feels unfair and not fun.

3. Moral drop farming. This I see a lot in orvr by organized warbands. They wait for their morals, pretend to fall back just to overpower them quickly with moral drops. Again a very cheesy play which can be executed almost every minute. For the casual players just wanting to have fun this feels very unfair and not fun because they keep getting killed without being able to kill anything. Works especially well on destro with their fast moral gains, snare prayer from doks and mara aoe kd.

4. Small scale died off with all the overtuned stealthers everywhere. Nothing to add there. Should be obvious.

There is only one point for me that really made the game better than before:

1. I like the new scenario queue system. Works really well and I think it's the best you can get out of that queue system. Fun in scenarios increased due to more equal matches.

Your turn.

1. Your tank, if there is any light behind their eyes, will keep an eye out for this and taunt the marauder, interrupting the pull. Or slow the lion, at which point if your warband has any amount of dps it is dead in a second.

2. Your tank, seeing the enemy tank close in like that, will get behind their tank, and a) slow them while the dps, who also isn't asleep, sees the enemy tank and moves away; b) knocks them down from behind and punts the tank either into your group to get killed, or away from your group, preventing the fishing strat.

3. Yes, a core difference between a good warband and a bad warband is whether your leader knows how to predict enemy morale drops / set up opportunities for his own and whether the players can follow the warband leaders commands for such things effectively.

4. No comment, not my horses, not my race.

The summary is, the game is good and fun when people put in effort into it. If they don't, I mean, well, they will lose to people that do. If that isn't fun, then I have two things to say:
1) Why is this theoretical individual playing a game that is inherently based around pvp, a competitive game mode, if he doesn't find competitive aspects fun?
2) Even if this theoretical individual's casual (like extremely casual, because what we're talking about is basic things in terms of effort) preferences end up being catered to, you can only dumb down a pvp game so much before it just becomes a joke and the game becomes an oversimplified grey flavorless colorless goo.

There's a reason why more casual-minded gamers tend to play pve games.

Well said, mate. I second this.

[kpihuss]

The game was at its most fun and exciting before the content-specific rewards for Ranked, Cities, and scenarios were removed.

Since then, the overall quality of the game has gone sharply downhill, with no brakes in sight.

I had hoped that the game would improve during my two-year break, but that has not been the case. In fact, it has become increasingly monotonous and boring.

Nevertheless, I have high hopes for the new campaign system that the developers announced in the 2026 roadmap.

If the campaign returns to something similar to its previous state, and exclusive rewards are once again offered for each type of RvR content—just as every PvE dungeon has its own exclusive rewards—the game may be able to recover.