[White Lion] Pounce need a Cooldown

[Ainianu]

Not read most of the deviations from the original topic, but my answer to OP, is that i actually agree it should have a cooldown, but not a very long one, something like 6s seems reasonable. And when this crops up in the balance forums, that is what my suggestion will be there

[arthur2k]

remove jump mid-air and jump up unto walls.

And i herd someone said that learn to use detaunt and ****, go play a shaman and we will see.

[Azygous]

[WL]

Why would it be locked? People are providing reasonable arguments and all you do is attack them and want the thread closed as quickly as possible.

A balance moderator is weighing in gives me hope for the future of the game.

L2P is not an adult's argument not does it fix broken things. Sorry, I choose to use my brain and will call out something unfair if I see it.

[Azygous]

4[WL]Balance moderator provided valid points.

You on the other hand just want to hold on to your crutch as long as possible. I'm sorry but I have never seen anyone who plays both sides or destro say a WL is balanced. I can't take anyone who plays a WL and claims "it's all good seriously".

The only people I have ever seen defending pounce are those who play WL- surprise surprise!- or those who play order exclusively and have no idea what it's like to be on the receiving end of a broken ability.

You have a charge, a root break and a pet that reaches your target quickly..why do you need infinite pounce, too? If you can't reach your target using charge+root break+a pounce on a reasonable cooldown then I'm afraid you are terrible at being melee. Why should the rest of the player base suffer your inability to grasp basic gaming basics?

Why should you have an ability that instantly and ALWAYS bypasses the whole kiting mechanism and completely negates the ranged classes' main defense..range.. so effortlessly?.

Why are you allowed to have it and no other melee class has access to it? Why should ANY melee class have access to instant gap closers equivalent to that of teleport hacking..it really is if you think about it. How is it in any way different than teleport hacking? Please don't tell me it's an AP drain..I play a WL and it's a non-issue. No smoke blowing, please.

Why are you able to teleport to the top of walls instantly like superman ?

Also, if people are attacking you then you can also use it to target someone far away and get rid of being focused..what the hell is that? I have literally pounced the whole cliff face from the destro warcamp in talabacland to the tavern to get away using scattered destro players.

Why are you able to use it mid-air after being knocked back to get back to your target even before hitting the ground.

Also, while we're at it, why are you allowed to run away while your pet is finishing off your target for you and then you can teleport right back to finish the job or summon another one and send it right over?

Why is your pet tankier than you? It was not like this in live and a pet doing half your damage should not be tankier than the player.

How about we have pounce affected by disrupt and increase the cooldown to 20 seconds? Sounds fair to me since you have charge+root break+fetch.

Pounce is beyond absurd and no self respecting balanced game would have it as it stands. There is no valid explanation to have it in it's current state since T2 for months except someone's bias. The excuse I hear always is that pounce only affects solo play but the people who say that should run vs order premades and see how it actually plays a significant role.

The devs are doing a good job at balancing but there are still glaring persisting imbalances favoring most of the order classes that can't be logically explained. SL for slayer vs useless AOE tree for choppa, Great KOTBS tactics vs inferior chosen ones.

We're losing players -especially on NA time- and we don't want to lose more to this ongoing BS. The balance devs have free reign on this server to balance things so there is no excuse. There is a reason that lots of players play order - no..it's not aesthetic..we have a mentality beyond that of a 10 year old-.

I wish the game would survive with people only playing order but it won't. Tell you what..allow same faction scenario Queing since people playing order say things are balanced..it also will solve the slow que pop

[Marsares]

This thread still going and not locked?

I fully agree on both fronts.

Firstly, the job of a moderator should be to moderate, not to influence. Balance discussions are the most volatile of all, as people have invested time in their toons and are emotionally attached to them. When they are poorly moderated, they become even more incendiary. A moderator should be a voice of reason, and can question or play devils advocate but should neither steer nor state personal preference.

This is a case in point, where a moderator flag is used whilst opinions are stated which could be construed as being done on behalf of the Dev team. I think the moderation rules should be reconsidered if this is how the balance forum will be run. A moderator should calm people down and keep them on topic, can challenge opinions by questioning them but should never seek to drive consensus towards his or her personal agenda.

[Liandel]

This thread still going and not locked?

I fully agree on both fronts.

Firstly, the job of a moderator should be to moderate, not to influence. Balance discussions are the most volatile of all, as people have invested time in their toons and are emotionally attached to them. When they are poorly moderated, they become even more incendiary. A moderator should be a voice of reason, and can question or play devils advocate but should neither steer nor state personal preference.

This is a case in point, where a moderator flag is used whilst opinions are stated which could be construed as being done on behalf of the Dev team. I think the moderation rules should be reconsidered if this is how the balance forum will be run. A moderator should calm people down and keep them on topic, can challenge opinions by questioning them but should never seek to drive consensus towards his or her personal agenda.

I agree wholeheartedly. It's disappointing seeing a balance moderator join in on the witch hunt against the WL class. It's a bummer that a thread that scapegoats one class for defeats is allowed to go on for this long.

[Luth]

You are wrong regarding balance mods; they just enforce the extended rules of the balance subforum.
They are completely free to express their oppinion, like everyone else and their oppinion is not more value than any other oppinion. Only arguments matter.
viewtopic.php?f=78&t=11261

@Azygous
Just a hint: Posting in golden letters doesn't make arguments magically more valuable and it's also forbidden:

* No formatting abuse. Use of formatting, such as color and font size, within posts is to be restricted to where it is necessary to aid understanding or make a point. Posts made in a solid color in order to draw unjustified attention to the poster will be removed.

viewtopic.php?f=52&t=13607

[Marsares]

@Luth I am aware of the rules of the balance sub forum and have read them. My post was not suggesting that rules were broken, which would be moot anyways as those rules don't apply to this sub forum anyways, but merely that I believe those rules should be looked at.

As they currently stand, those rules do not represent the role of a moderator in a balance forum as I have seen them on the most successful balance forums and, therefore, I fear that they will unwittingly end up fanning the flames rather than dousing them. There is a reason why a moderator in a debate between two opposing political candidates moderates the discussion in the truest sense, rather than injecting his or her own political agenda.

The same applies here in many ways, but I am sure we will eventually come to that conclusion if the balance forum descends into a farce. And I stress - if - as so far the Devs have shown remarkable common sense and coolheaded-ness.

[Luth]

@Luth I am aware of the rules of the balance sub forum and have read them. My post was not suggesting that rules were broken, which would be moot anyways as those rules don't apply to this sub forum anyways, but merely that I believe those rules should be looked at.

As they currently stand, those rules do not represent the role of a moderator in a balance forum as I have seen them on the most successful balance forums and, therefore, I fear that they will unwittingly end up fanning the flames rather than dousing them. There is a reason why a moderator in a debate between two opposing political candidates moderates the discussion in the truest sense, rather than injecting his or her own political agenda.

The same applies here in many ways, but I am sure we will eventually come to that conclusion if the balance forum descends into a farce. And I stress - if - as so far the Devs have shown remarkable common sense and coolheaded-ness.

I just linked the explanation from aza what the role of a balance mod is. I didn't imply that i think you don't know the rules.
I just think there is a common misunderstanding regarding those mods:
They just moderate the technical part of the discussion, the frame within the discussion takes place. They don't moderate the content (if it doesn't break the rules/crosses the borders of the frame).
They are not nannies, who have to watch the forum 24/7 and caress some nerdrage babies because their parents sucked at education.

If people can't argue in a civic, complete and structured manner, they get simply removed from that subforum. If some of "the customers" get displeased how things are handled here, they can still go to 4chan and restart their "LOL, class xy so OP. fix." topic and enjoy their "target-aimed discussion" with like-minded people.
And if a balance mod breaks the rules, i guess he looses his mod privileges pretty fast and gets probably removed too.

So there is absolutely no reason why they can't be part of the discussion. Or do you think it would be fair, if players like you and me who maybe love that game even more than us, volunteer for that position, investing their free time helping the project and in return get the obligation to stfu as a reward?

Balance mods are neither employees nor soldiers. Same goes for all staff members too. Everyone should be able to express their oppinion openly, as long as it happens within the borders of the rules of the forum.

[Scrilian]

Why a balance discussion going outside the balance forum in the class discussions section?
>losing players because of pounce
>balance tilted to order
So cringeworthy it's priceless.