POLL - RVR - What would make you play more?

[Morf]

I'm kinda curious if it is the gear that made people zerg as much and not really play for the fun of it?

This is the case for some, cant say how many but i know for myself i couldnt do whats fun for me on my shaman because my zone contribution will be really bad, best bet would be to join a proper group and farm randoms (how fun ) or follow the zerg and try and steal some db's while taking advantage of any bo caps or supplies, again boring for me, so i will choose to do the hard work so to speak first and get what i need then i can relax and have fun, just sad that after soooo many bags i still dont have what i need tnx to rng, so i gave up even bothering to even try anymore.

[Daknallbomb]

I'm kinda curious if it is the gear that made people zerg as much and not really play for the fun of it?

This is the case for some, cant say how many but i know for myself i couldnt do whats fun for me on my shaman because my zone contribution will be really bad, best bet would be to join a proper group and farm randoms (how fun ) or follow the zerg and try and steal some db's while taking advantage of any bo caps or supplies, again boring for me, so i will choose to do the hard work so to speak first and get what i need then i can relax and have fun, just sad that after soooo many bags i still dont have what i need tnx to rng, so i gave up even bothering to even try anymore.

Jep and thats exactly the problem aslong As ppl / need / want that gear noone plays for his Own fun. Farm randoms or DB stealing action and that rly no fun
But The Goal from orvr dont should be The gear thats The problem in my opinion

[Ugle]

Only one open zone is the biggest problem imo. Always nice to fight familiar faces that likes smallscale/solo/duo action like daknall and others. Only have one conq piece, the belt, never got anything but a green bag, but thats how it is being a casual with limited playtime, and dosent bother me much.

[freshour]

Only one open zone is the biggest problem imo. Always nice to fight familiar faces that likes smallscale/solo/duo action like daknall and others. Only have one conq piece, the belt, never got anything but a green bag, but thats how it is being a casual with limited playtime, and dosent bother me much.

I kinda wish t3/t4 zones merged. Pending population is what zone is active. So if there aren't that many people on, t4 is in t3 zones (they are smaller and more fit for less numbers). Once a threshold is hit - swaps to the massive t4 lakes.

[dansari]

Yep - I think gear is the biggest factor for "player burnout" and the RVR system is the biggest factor for "how much fun I have." I don't think the two are necessarily mutually exclusive.

The main things that have been mentioned to counteract this: change bag rolls to fragment system and increase the medallions in each, so something like the below. (For the below scenario, imagine there is new currency you can exchange for conq, subj, and genesis; call it a "Seal of the X" for this example).

• 1. Gold bag = 1 piece of conq OR a "Seal of the Conqueror" / 50 conq medallions (I'd prefer to go the Seal of the Conq route so that people don't feel so burnt out with rng. Basically you'd need to get 6 gold bags and you'd have your set. No duplicates. This gives you the option to choose a seal or the 50 medallions if you've already finished your set)
  2. Purple bag = 1 piece of subjugator OR a "Seal of the Subjugator" / 40 conq medallions / 1/2 of a Seal of the Conqueror (so that even if you have all the subjugator you want you can still work towards conqueror)
  3. Blue bag = 1 piece of genesis OR a "Seal of the Genesis" (to exchange for any genesis piece) / 20 conq medallions / 1/3 of a Seal of the Conqueror
  4. Green bag = 1 piece of the other jewelry set / 10 conq medallions / 1/5 of a Seal of the Conqueror
  5. White bag = 5 conq medallions / 1/5 of a Seal of the Conqueror

In this system, you could get 6 gold bags, 12 purple bags, 18 blue bags, or 30 green/white for full conq. So even if all you ever get is green and white you still feel the nice progression of working towards your set. I believe this would be a much better system for casual players. As it stands currently, say you have 30-40 people in a zone -- you're likely going to get 1-2 gold, maybe 1 purple, about 2-3 blues, and a handful of greens. That's roughly 25% of the actual zone population that contributed time and energy towards the capture of a zone that received rewards they are likely to be happy with. The other 75% probably feel like their time was wasted, and this gets progressively worse when you scale up the amount of people in the zone.

To counteract the "having fun in zone" piece, right now I think the simplest solution is to change the BO mechanics (decrease the timer so that it is never above 3min to claim), and change the way VPs are given so that the zone locks relatively quickly after the keep is taken unless the other realm is able to hold BOs for a certain period of time. All other suggestions take more time to test and implement, even though good suggestions (in my opinion) have been shared.

[th3gatekeeper]

I'm kinda curious if it is the gear that made people zerg as much and not really play for the fun of it?

This is the case for some, cant say how many but i know for myself i couldnt do whats fun for me on my shaman............

I feel like many decisions in this game are made with the intention of keeping things more "hardcore" but often times this comes at the loss of "FUN". I think its important to realize that underneath it all FUN is what people want. People dont want second jobs. People want to get online with friends, and on this server - PVP.

People will do what they are incentivized to do. I keep saying this over and over. So all the activity you see right now, is all BECAUSE of the RVR campaign. You have guilds re-scheduling their RVR times so that they DONT fight opposition - because they want easier/faster bags because the gear system is RNG and makes people frustrated.

You have people NOT wanting to defend zones, because there is no reward for defending, but there IS a loser "zone lock roll" for bags. So you have people willing to lose a zone once a Lord goes down, merely trying to grab contribution for themselves for a higher chance at loot - They are not taking BOs to actually STOP the zone locking...

You have RVR being a massive RDPS fest to the point it killed some of MY desire to log in, because all everyone ever wanted to do was roam as a 6 man RDPS group... melee doesnt seem to have much use outside a coordinated warband.

For me:

1) RVR Campaign needs a rework. Its not fun. Even back in T3 days of locking BOs, and zerging to a keep take seemed more fun than this (not saying it was ideal). You could "ninja" behind a big zerg and back cap a BO, and make it hard for them to take a keep. The Lord kill seemed like an "epic finale" in the RVR lake battle. I dont know if this system would have worked as well in t4 maps, I think what honestly kills T4 maps is the sheer size of the map - designed for ALOT more players than play ROR. This is why I was a big advocate for faster run speed - although that comes at a cost due to people getting "stuck" on stuff. But I would still take faster mounts to cover the large RVR lakes and frankly, I would give all melee classes a "sprint" ability but thats just me...

2) RVR Loot system. As much as it pains me to say this, I think the loser loot needs to scale better based on actual performance. The winner loot as well. There is too much "free loot" for taking undefended zones and losing in zones you didnt defend. This coupled with the RNG factor (that everyone seems to hate but the DEVs seem to love) just KILLS RVR. Its what has created the toxic system we have now. Defending a zone and re-spawning a Lord needs a defense tick. The loot system needs to be changed to a RUIN system or a pure "medallions" system where you buy EVERYTHING via medallions.

3) I would also say that if possible, what needs to be addressed is the death blow = medallion thing. I dont know if its possible to change that, but iot screws over tanks and healers and incentives players to solo roam and steal DBs.

4) Promote warband play. This is a HUGE one. Right now everyone wants to 6 man to que for SCs while doing RVR. This is what also contributes to the toxic environment. Enable queing for SCs in a warband, and ENCOURAGE warbands. Right now you get kills and everyone gets like 5 renown or you can hop in a 6 man, get a kill and get a few hundred renown. You also SEEM to get more contribution. The entire thing is "rigged" against warband play. So this is why people run 6 mans, outside warbands.

All this stuff, and more, is what is killing the RVR scene IMO. I am NA times, but talk to many guys in Phalanx and EU players etc, and seems that MANY people are all on the same page (looking at this thread, the responses, and the traction it has gained in just a few short days confirms all this).

The focus of this game should be on FUN. What people FOUND fun when this game was made =/= what people FIND fun today IMO. I would take a step back, and not ask "how can we make this game the best game we can" but rather ask "how can we make this game the most FUN game we can".

Doing this, will allow you to move AWAY from the "gear grind carrot" and make it better for everyone.

[Vajazzle24]

Yep - I think gear is the biggest factor for "player burnout" and the RVR system is the biggest factor for "how much fun I have." I don't think the two are necessarily mutually exclusive.

The main things that have been mentioned to counteract this: change bag rolls to fragment system and increase the medallions in each, so something like the below. (For the below scenario, imagine there is new currency you can exchange for conq, subj, and genesis; call it a "Seal of the X" for this example).

• 1. Gold bag = 1 piece of conq OR a "Seal of the Conqueror" / 50 conq medallions (I'd prefer to go the Seal of the Conq route so that people don't feel so burnt out with rng. Basically you'd need to get 6 gold bags and you'd have your set. No duplicates. This gives you the option to choose a seal or the 50 medallions if you've already finished your set)
  2. Purple bag = 1 piece of subjugator OR a "Seal of the Subjugator" / 40 conq medallions / 1/2 of a Seal of the Conqueror (so that even if you have all the subjugator you want you can still work towards conqueror)
  3. Blue bag = 1 piece of genesis OR a "Seal of the Genesis" (to exchange for any genesis piece) / 20 conq medallions / 1/3 of a Seal of the Conqueror
  4. Green bag = 1 piece of the other jewelry set / 10 conq medallions / 1/5 of a Seal of the Conqueror
  5. White bag = 5 conq medallions / 1/5 of a Seal of the Conqueror

In this system, you could get 6 gold bags, 12 purple bags, 18 blue bags, or 30 green/white for full conq. So even if all you ever get is green and white you still feel the nice progression of working towards your set. I believe this would be a much better system for casual players. As it stands currently, say you have 30-40 people in a zone -- you're likely going to get 1-2 gold, maybe 1 purple, about 2-3 blues, and a handful of greens. That's roughly 25% of the actual zone population that contributed time and energy towards the capture of a zone that received rewards they are likely to be happy with. The other 75% probably feel like their time was wasted, and this gets progressively worse when you scale up the amount of people in the zone.

To counteract the "having fun in zone" piece, right now I think the simplest solution is to change the BO mechanics (decrease the timer so that it is never above 3min to claim), and change the way VPs are given so that the zone locks relatively quickly after the keep is taken unless the other realm is able to hold BOs for a certain period of time. All other suggestions take more time to test and implement, even though good suggestions (in my opinion) have been shared.

Logically this makes the most sense. I am to new to be burnt out yet, but I can definitely see it happening when I spend 4 hours in a zone and get just a few conq medals. Whereas I can run scenerios, granted the gear is more expensive, in the same amount of time and actually feel like progression was made.

[Juppstein]

Well in SCs you actually DO something actively, fighting. In oRVR you ride around 80% of the time or stand around. Sometimes you have some brief contact with something that either rolls over you and it just feels a slight bump, or you roll over it in the same manner. The other 20% is banging on doors or respawning . Still a fun game though

[geezereur]

Well in SCs you actually DO something actively, fighting. In oRVR you ride around 80% of the time or stand around. Sometimes you have some brief contact with something that either rolls over you and it just feels a slight bump, or you roll over it in the same manner. The other 20% is banging on doors or respawning . Still a fun game though

I feel the same way thats why I do Scenarios 95% of the time you always get to fight, in RvR its 90% standing and holding Bos and waiting.

[freshour]

Yep - I think gear is the biggest factor for "player burnout" and the RVR system is the biggest factor for "how much fun I have." I don't think the two are necessarily mutually exclusive.

The main things that have been mentioned to counteract this: change bag rolls to fragment system and increase the medallions in each, so something like the below. (For the below scenario, imagine there is new currency you can exchange for conq, subj, and genesis; call it a "Seal of the X" for this example).

• 1. Gold bag = 1 piece of conq OR a "Seal of the Conqueror" / 50 conq medallions (I'd prefer to go the Seal of the Conq route so that people don't feel so burnt out with rng. Basically you'd need to get 6 gold bags and you'd have your set. No duplicates. This gives you the option to choose a seal or the 50 medallions if you've already finished your set)
  2. Purple bag = 1 piece of subjugator OR a "Seal of the Subjugator" / 40 conq medallions / 1/2 of a Seal of the Conqueror (so that even if you have all the subjugator you want you can still work towards conqueror)
  3. Blue bag = 1 piece of genesis OR a "Seal of the Genesis" (to exchange for any genesis piece) / 20 conq medallions / 1/3 of a Seal of the Conqueror
  4. Green bag = 1 piece of the other jewelry set / 10 conq medallions / 1/5 of a Seal of the Conqueror
  5. White bag = 5 conq medallions / 1/5 of a Seal of the Conqueror

In this system, you could get 6 gold bags, 12 purple bags, 18 blue bags, or 30 green/white for full conq. So even if all you ever get is green and white you still feel the nice progression of working towards your set. I believe this would be a much better system for casual players. As it stands currently, say you have 30-40 people in a zone -- you're likely going to get 1-2 gold, maybe 1 purple, about 2-3 blues, and a handful of greens. That's roughly 25% of the actual zone population that contributed time and energy towards the capture of a zone that received rewards they are likely to be happy with. The other 75% probably feel like their time was wasted, and this gets progressively worse when you scale up the amount of people in the zone.

To counteract the "having fun in zone" piece, right now I think the simplest solution is to change the BO mechanics (decrease the timer so that it is never above 3min to claim), and change the way VPs are given so that the zone locks relatively quickly after the keep is taken unless the other realm is able to hold BOs for a certain period of time. All other suggestions take more time to test and implement, even though good suggestions (in my opinion) have been shared.

single greatest thing you have ever posted. I bet it would be pretty difficult to find a single person on this entire server other than that ones in charge who don't want something like this - that disagree.

/s /s /s /s /s /s /s /s /s /s - it was a light jab, I apologize.

But, do we know if a system like this is even possible? If so... I can't really see a good argument against it thinking purely logical and using reason and stuff. Only argument is either, "No" or something about them liking the RNG on RNG aspect. But regardless, I'm saving this post because it is such a pure gold mine of an idea!!!!

Edit: I really hope my sarcasm made it through. I realize that there are multiple staff members who have posted on both sides of this fence and I will not quote them directly but it is only natural to have different opinions. Obviously I think there are people who will not like this idea, but in general, with everything stated in the last 150+ posts. It seems like this idea would cover quite a few of the complaints/listed suggestions.