Patch Notes 05/11/2020

[Twick]

I think 25% is far too much, and I let dalen know as much. He agrees, and it's likely this will be changed to 10% to match arcing swings' tactic in a hotfix before the weekend.

I think we'll observe with it at 10% until the next patch, and then adjust to 5% as needed.

I still think it needs an ICD (it's incredibly powerful) but I am reserving judgement for now.

Secrets, the question is- for 5% reduce, why would any sane chosen spec it? Since it requires going full glass cannon to make any actual use of. Even for a 10%- a party in wb needs to be specifically build around chosen in this spec, including guard for him, and including healers which ain't based around absorbs (zealot is straight out, for example).

There isn't really such a thing as a Glass Cannon Chosen in this case, he won't have much parry or block but can very easily get over 1k toughnes and wounds, heavy armour, plus the tactic itself removes the need for Futile Strikes so they only take the occasional crit without having to spend all that rr to get it, which then frees up a whole load of rr to spend on other things. Plus you only need a couple in an entire warband to have the desired effect

Lol. 1 k toughness without FS doesn't does much, armor does nothing vs magical (or slayer). "removes the need for Futile Strikes so they only take the occasional crit"- loool, instant crit spam by all rdps in the area sure isn't an occasional crit. "frees up a whole load of rr to spend on other things"- which ones exactly, since to make use of the tactic chosen can't spec avoidances or FS?

"Plus you only need a couple in an entire warband to have the desired effect"- I am really curious just what was the logical chain that lead you to think that typing this one is a fine idea. Plz enlighten me. Since chosen in spec where he can make use of this tactic needs guard- enlighten me, plz explain how a wb can spare "a couple" of guards, while still having the dps guarded?

Any chosen with half a brain is still going to use the -25% crit talent point and put 0 points into futile strikes, you save the renown points for hearty concession and there you go. EZ tank win.

[Zxul]

Spoiler:

I think 25% is far too much, and I let dalen know as much. He agrees, and it's likely this will be changed to 10% to match arcing swings' tactic in a hotfix before the weekend.

I think we'll observe with it at 10% until the next patch, and then adjust to 5% as needed.

I still think it needs an ICD (it's incredibly powerful) but I am reserving judgement for now.

Secrets, the question is- for 5% reduce, why would any sane chosen spec it? Since it requires going full glass cannon to make any actual use of. Even for a 10%- a party in wb needs to be specifically build around chosen in this spec, including guard for him, and including healers which ain't based around absorbs (zealot is straight out, for example).

There isn't really such a thing as a Glass Cannon Chosen in this case, he won't have much parry or block but can very easily get over 1k toughnes and wounds, heavy armour, plus the tactic itself removes the need for Futile Strikes so they only take the occasional crit without having to spend all that rr to get it, which then frees up a whole load of rr to spend on other things. Plus you only need a couple in an entire warband to have the desired effect

Lol. 1 k toughness without FS doesn't does much, armor does nothing vs magical (or slayer). "removes the need for Futile Strikes so they only take the occasional crit"- loool, instant crit spam by all rdps in the area sure isn't an occasional crit. "frees up a whole load of rr to spend on other things"- which ones exactly, since to make use of the tactic chosen can't spec avoidances or FS?

"Plus you only need a couple in an entire warband to have the desired effect"- I am really curious just what was the logical chain that lead you to think that typing this one is a fine idea. Plz enlighten me. Since chosen in spec where he can make use of this tactic needs guard- enlighten me, plz explain how a wb can spare "a couple" of guards, while still having the dps guarded?

Any chosen with half a brain is still going to use the -25% crit talent point and put 0 points into futile strikes, you save the renown points for hearty concession and there you go. EZ tank win.

So you don't have any tank, nice. Full Hardy Concession is -15% dmg. That, according to you, is enough to replace avoidances (50-70% less dmg, depends on type, more on snb tank), as well as decent init+FS (another 30% or so vs say bw- even all aoe spam from bws will crit first hit), and absorbs (375 absorb every 3 sec just from self tactic, much more from zealot).

So what were you smoking, and where can I get some of that?

[Gurf]

- The Chosen must be COMPLETELY glass cannon for this to work well. If they avoid damage, it doesn't apply. If they get crit, it hurts. Toughness would be the only benefit for this build, and toughness really works best with chance to be crit reduction.
Anyone who plays a tank knows what it feels like to have 0% chance to be crit reduction, and it's painful to say the least.

It isn't the same as 0% chance to be crit though as they are only likely to take Crit damage from the same player once every 10 seconds, and you need a succession of crits for any burst damage. Plus it frees up a huge amount of renown from Futile Strikes to be used on other defensive stats, so it isn't completely Glass Cannon not in a long stretch.

I generally think you Dev's are doing a great job but I don't understand the reasoning behind this, Destro do perfectly fine in all areas except Forts, why not do something which impacts Forts only rather than a massive faction wide buff which will have an impact on all parts of the game? It took Order about a year to get to a place where they win almost 50% of City but now seeing as ones sides mdps can crit and the others can't I guess we are back to the place where Destro melee ball crushes everything in its path again.

[Cadien]

I'm perplexed by the Chosen tactic change. It seems that a reverse Dirty Tricks would have filled the role without all the hubbub (i.e., on block debuff the attacker's crit by 5%). On paper, at least, seems more balanced, still very valuable, and in-keeping with the chosen's role as a debuffer.

[wonshot]

Why are we assuming chosens would need to go full glasscanons for this to proc lol.

A few of the Order aoes have several ticks, and just dropping a few FS points on the chosen would provide a tick from chosen tactic within each Clense cooldown to be ready again from an order healer if the chosen keeps getting hit by multi-hit abilities in a brawl fight.
Absolute no point in going squishy, just loosen up a little on the FS and spend the points on other mitigation sources to make up for how fast your healers loose you.

10% would make sence, in the comparison of how a 2handed knight could debuff 10% critchance taken. It would make order warband meta even more restricted to what classes and builds are absolute required, but no news there. It fits the chosen identity, but I somehow feel BG needed this for warband-appeal but oh well.

I still crit full def tank chosen as before todays patch, not even but absolutely a few times within 10sec if im not cced and they are within range of my cleaving.

[Cadien]

Why are we assuming chosens would need to go full glasscanons for this to proc lol.

A few of the Order aoes have several ticks, and just dropping a few FS points on the chosen would provide a tick within each Clense cooldown to be ready again from an other order if the chosen keeps getting hit by multi-hit abilities in a brawl fight.
Absolute no point in going squishy, just loosen up a little on the FS and spend the points on other mitigation sources to make up for how fast your healers loose you.

10% would make sence, in the comparison of how a 2handed knight could debuff 10% critchance taken. It would make order warband meta even more restricted to what classes and builds are absolute required, but no news there. It fits the chosen identity, but I somehow feel BG needed this for warband-appeal but oh well.

The reverse mirror to overwhelming swings is better, but it still has the benefit of infinite range over knights. Still, anything is better than it is right now.

[Ramlaen]

Why are we assuming chosens would need to go full glasscanons for this to proc lol.

A few of the Order aoes have several ticks, and just dropping a few FS points on the chosen would provide a tick from chosen tactic within each Clense cooldown to be ready again from an order healer if the chosen keeps getting hit by multi-hit abilities in a brawl fight.
Absolute no point in going squishy, just loosen up a little on the FS and spend the points on other mitigation sources to make up for how fast your healers loose you.

10% would make sence, in the comparison of how a 2handed knight could debuff 10% critchance taken. It would make order warband meta even more restricted to what classes and builds are absolute required, but no news there. It fits the chosen identity, but I somehow feel BG needed this for warband-appeal but oh well.

I still crit full def tank chosen as before todays patch, not even but absolutely a few times within 10sec if im not cced and they are within range of my cleaving.

Running one Chosen in a warband doing a 2h utility build is not an issue.

[Gurf]

There isn't really such a thing as a Glass Cannon Chosen in this case, he won't have much parry or block but can very easily get over 1k toughnes and wounds, heavy armour, plus the tactic itself removes the need for Futile Strikes so they only take the occasional crit without having to spend all that rr to get it, which then frees up a whole load of rr to spend on other things. Plus you only need a couple in an entire warband to have the desired effect

Lol. 1 k toughness without FS doesn't does much, armor does nothing vs magical (or slayer). "removes the need for Futile Strikes so they only take the occasional crit"- loool, instant crit spam by all rdps in the area sure isn't an occasional crit. "frees up a whole load of rr to spend on other things"- which ones exactly, since to make use of the tactic chosen can't spec avoidances or FS?

"Plus you only need a couple in an entire warband to have the desired effect"- I am really curious just what was the logical chain that lead you to think that typing this one is a fine idea. Plz enlighten me. Since chosen in spec where he can make use of this tactic needs guard- enlighten me, plz explain how a wb can spare "a couple" of guards, while still having the dps guarded?

As already mentioned you only likely get Crit once every 10 seconds by a player, so there is no need for FS as there is no burst damage
You wouldn't need to guard the Chosen as you most probably want them to be crit
You think a Chosen with heavy armour, 1200 toughness over 10k wounds is going to go down without a succession of Crits?
You only need a few in a Warband because if you haven't noticed most warband v warband fights are about aoe damage, most aoe hits a large amount of people, so you only need a few to basically debuff anyone throwing around aoe in your Warbands direction, not that hard to work out is it?

[CountTalabecland]

Thank you everyone, reading this thread has been the most time I had on forums for a while.

Now. lets read it again:

- Corruptive Power effect changed from "All Path of Corruption abilities now cost 35% fewer action points." to "Any time you receive critical damage, the attacker is cursed and their chance to critically hit is reduced by 25% for 10 seconds." This curse can be cleansed.

So for it to work, 3 things need to happen:

1. Chosen needs to be crit- so for tactic to have a reasonable chance to go off, chosen needs to drop FS/Flawless Armor, to get a high chance to be crit.
2. "Any time you receive critical damage"- if the hit is parried/disrupted/blocked, no dmg, so need to skip renown avoidance as well.
3. No crit dmg if base hit is absorbed- so no absorb as well.

In other words, for this tactic to have a noticeable effect, chosen needs to spec absolutely glass canon, and then whoever heals him needs to make sure no absorb is used.

If you read a combat log during a zerg fight, there's plenty of crits coming from some AoE regardless of a anti-crit build. Anti-crit helps DPS from chain-critting your 10k wounds away, but you still get crit quite a lot relative to how freaking often this new tactic will be triggering. A choppa/Slayer will have 3-4 abilities hitting a target at the same time, if any of those crits once, boom no more crit.

[forsa]

- 20% on 100 hate/fury, and they can also buff their dark protector / oath buddy by 20%
- absorb does provide crit immunity until the absorb is off.
- damage reduction weighs higher than crit reduction, as damage is applied regardless of crit. also, Raking Talons is 100% uptime, Chosen's reactive ability is not.
- I actually think the crit damage liniment is busted right now. Need to check getstats for it next time I am ingame.
- Hardy Concession is a good point - however, full Hardy Concession means you also aren't dealing damage in return. HC is 15% reduced damage. 10% crit reduction is about 4.4% damage reduction if in a situation where you're always dealing damage.
Crits increase damage by 35% to 55% in a range - so 15% damage reduction from HC isn't too much if you're critting, but it's still significant. Also, remember - getting dodge/disrupted/blocked/parried means the debuff isn't applying. You need to make contact to apply the debuff, and it can be cleansed.

I think the ability having a per-person ICD would be much better - ie; every 10s, the ability can be applied again, lasts for 10s, once cleansed it can no longer apply to that target again until the ICD is up.

-20 is still not 25%
- *Edit: missed the until absorb is off part, still need to check , sure its not like that.
-if sm spams DT, he cannot use WW, BS, DS - and it hinders dps output. even if it is spammed its far from 100% uptime due to need for target.
-it works ok and grants regen.
-What dmg output? you can go with ch barehanded and GUARDED by another tank (bg or bo or whatever, all deal good damage) and provide outrageous debuff to enemy dd.

It should mirror KN tactic and provide 5% anticrit on block to party, then its ok and balanced