Initiative Scaling/Stacking: An Experiment

[szejoza]

cant you stop derailing every valuable forum thread, its getting boring having nothing to read cause you bring bias into every area possible (both order and destro) which ends up in threads being locked

[Toldavf]

It's not really a realm issue in my eyes.

Loosing 80 stat points should never result in an increase of up to 40% to be crit.

[tionblack]

I think any smart player knows they have to invest into initiative no matter what side they play.If you have below 250 base with any class you are doing it wrong.

Only one side need to do the mojority of investmet tho. And the price to pay for it is way, way to high.
Order gets by fine with around 4 talismams slots worth while destro needs 8 and 32 points in renown. And that is for a stat that does almoast nothing when not debuffed.

Only one side has aoe melee morale drain,zealot ap ritual for endless meelee train combo(proc on meelee attacks ((not skill use)) ) and like Littlebomber said 5 seconds half century knockdown,punt without using tactics and also armor stacking buffs with % 45 crit reduction buff.

[Cimba]

Only one side need to do the mojority of investmet tho. And the price to pay for it is way, way to high.
Order gets by fine with around 4 talismams slots worth while destro needs 8 and 32 points in renown. And that is for a stat that does almoast nothing when not debuffed.

Dont get me wrong but stacking Initiative to 550 with the help of renown points is pretty unefficient. If you want to spent renown points you go up to 350 Initiative with talismans/gear and then put your renown points into futile strikes.

[Tesq]

I think any smart player knows they have to invest into initiative no matter what side they play.If you have below 250 base with any class you are doing it wrong.

Only one side need to do the mojority of investmet tho. And the price to pay for it is way, way to high.
Order gets by fine with around 4 talismams slots worth while destro needs 8 and 32 points in renown. And that is for a stat that does almoast nothing when not debuffed.

some math: min of green color initiative is 130

so you need 130 + X = perfect value--> where "x" is the enemy realm max stacking debuff

after this you could just go for % crit reduction instead, because it's WAY more effective.

- in case of order is 130+120 =250, pretty easy to achive
- in case of destreu is 130+ 200 = 330, well those 80 ini more gona cost an eye in term of talismans / renown points. + some classes alredy have ini penality than others.

My chosen going around with 291 currently (that's the max i can afford for not loose too much on other important stuff) and my best bet is that someone dont have maxed ini debuff or it get bad....291-200 =91 ini and this mean i image like +20% chance to be crit XD (why 40 ini must concede so much chance to crit dam...)

edit: but im a tank and a zealot can give me what i lack not sure on other classes, still the investiment is yet again in favour of order like in live; where order could spec crit reduction instead TB, Here we have to spec ini and they can spec crit reduction for small scale- Same thing basically, 1 realm have more return from the spec matematically speaking than the other. Not even being bias, it is small scale related amd can be deal with but yet why 1 realm need to have a spec mathematically disadvantage is out of my compression....is due destru being too cool? XD

[roadkillrobin]

Only one side need to do the mojority of investmet tho. And the price to pay for it is way, way to high.
Order gets by fine with around 4 talismams slots worth while destro needs 8 and 32 points in renown. And that is for a stat that does almoast nothing when not debuffed.

Dont get me wrong but stacking Initiative to 550 with the help of renown points is pretty unefficient. If you want to spent renown points you go up to 350 Initiative with talismans/gear and then put your renown points into futile strikes.

Thats still 4 talismans slots and 30 renown points of investment just to be in somewhat safe numbers for crits. They still gona have around 40% to crit you.
And all classes still need armor to deal with the WL debuff. Light Armor classes have like 300 armor after this debuff

[Stickzy]

Close to 800 ini. Whats the point in that? 350 is enough for order, and i would say 400 on destro.

Looks like this topic is gonna be like the rest. Sw/Wl

[Cimba]

Thats still 4 talismans slots and 30 renown points of investment just to be in somewhat safe numbers for crits. They still gona have around 40% to crit you.
And all classes still need armor to deal with the WL debuff. Light Armor classes have like 300 armor after this debuff

Check your math. Assuming 200 Initiative debuff you get 350 - 200 = 150 --> 350/(150/10) = 23,3% chance to be critically hit. Three levels into futile strikes gives you -15 ---> 8,3% chance to be critically hit.

In regards to the huge investment... if I remember correcetly I have about 330 Initiative on my BW without any investment. Aside from that any decent group should have Initiative buffs somewhere (usually zealot/rp).

[shaggyboomboom]

Cry me all a river

[dansari]

In regards to the huge investment... if I remember correcetly I have about 330 Initiative on my BW without any investment. Aside from that any decent group should have Initiative buffs somewhere (usually zealot/rp).

Just depends on the class. My BW is also at about 330 because you get lots of init from conq bonus, gear, etc. With my SW, though, he's at like <200 because a lot of the gear does not have an init bonus.