2h tanks guard idea

[Tesq]

Spoiler:

BG only wb spec with 2H?Oh lol.You can equip shield, use HtL and be viable and useful for your wb.You can guard and use Dark Protector.Im just scared how 79rr dont know that.

I was talking about a premade wb, not a pug one LOL. Go ahead and try to join a serious premade WB with a SnB BG and let me know how it goes. Also Why would a premade WB take a SnB BG when CHO/BO can guard, use HTL and buff the ENTIRE group. Not even gonna mention the morale pumps that CHO/BO have that the BG doesnt get.

Serious premade wb dont need 2H tank.Or, let me guess, you playing NA prime time?
For bg/ib place in wb, its all about class ego-mechanics, they always behind others for wb.But still snb BG > 2h BG for mass RvR.

Htl buff 9 target but stack max 3 times which mean you need 3 tank only with shiwed to have a front line in hold the line and a second line buffed by thise 3 tanks.
Of course interrupt, ap management require more tanks to keep it up all the time plus 15% from other tank stack aswell on other tank 45% till 75%.

So to put it simple by remove 1s+b tank your wb loose on just one ppl 15% to doge and disrupt (but he still have 30%).

So for exemple you can take a 2h bg to have otherwise not accessabke utility and also swap 1 hold the line for aoe dmg as in fact bg have his wb spec exatly on 2h build and not on s+b unless you really need an infinite hold the line spammer or someone you can walk inside 1000 bw without miss 1 disrupt....or a party ap battery.

When you fighting against 2+wbs, what happens often at EU prime time, u need your frontline, u need your every tank snb in this meatgrinder, cause they have more surviability than 2h anyway.10% crit debuff dont really matters in this situation, it works fine in 6vs6, even WB vs WB (but you dont need this really), when zerg vs zerg it sucks.And even with capped str crit debuff can be blocked or parried.

Man you talk to some one that has made premade wb from live inside the guild with more renown gained over all server history on des side (was a official counter till sov meta) Maybe im not the skillest player around but i learned a thing or two. Having both experience in wb with my sov till warpforged chosen and my bg here i can tell that here on ror i could always swap 1 tank for a 2h bg compared to bg sich in live. I can also say that the wb that play here on ror dont know how to kite, i saw a premade wb yest with my magus and they instead kite vs 2 wb and get into a good spot litteraly behind them in kv, make enemy long and counterpush they just gone facepunch with em.

There is way and way to face 2x wb. Kite and make enemy overextend is not something only relegated to small scale.

Same thing is 2h bg, it have the tools to support whole wb not just 1 party, it have the durability to play front line. I tested this aswell personally taking time and care to gear it and optimized it for wb play (rr70) and thes what tactics (imp) could had lead to be solid as frontliner ( i even opposed when happened to move down the aoe snare cuz was just to much for 2h bg).

[convexte]

Spoiler:

How u gonna kite 2+wbs who defend keep?

[Kirpich]

25% guard is too small. the developers just do not leave a chance to play with 2h.

[Fenris78]

Accordingly to logs stats (retrieved with warparser), it seems all guard damage sources are meant to be parried, including magical and physical distant attacks.

I got 38% parried guard hits, out out ~40% base parade on my KotBS. I'm assuming there is far more than 2% total distant attacks hitting my guarded player...

I was surprised too when going 2H and full parry, adding leftovers to block skills, by seeing myself not taking significant damage when my guarded player (in range obviously) died.
Meaning that guard + Parry (+block when running with shield) effectively reduce guard damage taken by me to a very small amount.

So yes, parry is very (too much) strong combined with guard, since it can avoid all damage sources.
I'll double check this soon but I think me and Hogun are not mistaken for that matter.

To answer the base question of the topic, my suggestions :
I suggest to keep a significant damage transfert from guard (like 33% for 2H tanks, and 50% for SnB ones), but to lower the chance to parry guard damage (like 25% less chance - in relative value of course - to parry guard damage) for 2H gear.

This way, it lets a real choice getting balanced builds (block and parry) against a powerful full-parry 2H build (that seems to be as resilient as SnB to me, even before guard nerf).

And you gives SnB more survivability doing that, against 2H builds, without impeding too much resilience of guarded players (wich are currently the ones to suffer).
Basically what I'm suggesting is to lower the resilience of 2H (by effectively taking more damage from their guardee), without hurting guarded players (wich are atm getting a big hit).

[Smellybelly]

Accordingly to logs stats (retrieved with warparser), it seems all guard damage sources are meant to be parried, including magical and physical distant attacks.

I got 38% parried guard hits, out out ~40% base parade on my KotBS. I'm assuming there is far more than 2% total distant attacks hitting my guarded player...

I was surprised too when going 2H and full parry, adding leftovers to block skills, by seeing myself not taking significant damage when my guarded player (in range obviously) died.
Meaning that guard + Parry (+block when running with shield) effectively reduce guard damage taken by me to a very small amount.

So yes, parry is very (too much) strong combined with guard, since it can avoid all damage sources.
I'll double check this soon but I think me and Hogun are not mistaken for that matter.

It does not negate ALL damage sources, it directs 50% (before) of the damage taken of your guarded target, the source of that damage does NOT matter, a SnB tank can parry AND block everything the guarded target recieves, a 2H tank can only parry and thus only negates about half as much as a SNB tank, furthermore~ Damage directed directly at YOU as a tank DOES matter, a SnB tank can block ALL ranged, ALL magical and parry+ block ALL melee. A 2H tank can use his parry % to parry ONLY melee, NO ranged and NO magical dmg.

THIS IS BASIC KNOWLEDGE
And it also makes it very very clear that SnB is much much stronger at survivability and negating guard dmg. As it should.

Now read what i wrote again. Hogun is NOT on to something hidden, he has barely managed to grasp the very basis of the guard mechanic

Im getting a braintumor from these lies and missunderstandings....

[bloodi]

I'll double check this soon but I think me and Hogun are not mistaken for that matter.

You can parry/block all guard damage, its been like that forever, i am not even sure why this is news to you or anyone or what point you are trying to make with it.


And yeah, parry is like that so 2h tanks can guard, its by design.

[Ugle]

No surprise there are retard nerfs with all these uninformed morons crying wolf without grasping basic game mechanics.

Usually you can take one look at their ingame toons nick and categorize them accordingly from their performance, in all settings, be it solo, smallscale or wb.

[Tesq]

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

How u gonna kite 2+wbs who defend keep?

Keep siege and open fiels are two world appart and keep siege suffer more with problems linked to def m4 being meh vs moral drop. Btw not the point was trying to say that even if here game is more balanced than live, no doubt about that,ppl should also try to adapt and use their surrounding enviroment but it seems like wb fight these days are like t3 ones...even when give chance you just resolt to punch in face. With who have more win.... which is said is not only small scale that can use certain tactic. Its just make the game experience poor like say no 2h bg because we need to push whatever we have in front of us.

[Grolar]

Does anyone really think a 2h tank is a viable tank versus a SnB tank? or should be? They seem more like a heavy dps class to me. I wouldn't mind if they could tank, but just not nearly as well as a shield tank can.

[Nekkma]

A 2h tank, and even a snb tank, only need survivability up to a certain point, as you have healing, defensive cd, portions etc. If you can survive the expected damage from guard and tanktunneling you may as well go for offensive stats to help with damage. How much defensive stats you need to survive (with some margine of eror ofc) depends on setting, e.g. rvr vs scenarios, and the quality of your group.