Weekly Event Scenario -observations & changes needed

[wargrimnir]

It was a very helpful list of scenarios to pick from that drive engagement with other players. Grouping up is a goal, not a problem. Go play pug scen.

[Akilinus]

The problem is not pug vs premade. The problem is that you cant PvE to win

[ChaosV]

make T4 sc depends on gears/rr..
for example when a new lvl 40 joining in t4 sc he has anihilator armor against invader-war-sov players.. fix that please make t4 pops with players that got almost same gears and renown lvls!

[zulnam]

Like the seasons, Weekend Warfronts seem to come right on clock with complaints (at this point we should just call them Weekend Whinefronts).

But growing bored of the constant 'no u' chat, i decided to gather some data on my own. So I held a log for my first day of the weekend SC.

In the log I attempted to complete the event on T2/3 characters (BG, SM, WP) as well as T4 (Kotbs).

Observations:

Class: BG.
Notes: was unplayable. I did not get a single pop in my 20 minutes while I waited, and no one was looking for tanks or wanted to start a scenario group. In the end I felt my destro alt would have to wait another day to get the Sorrowmonger title.

Class: Swordmaster
Tier: 2/3
Spec: SnB (4 games), 2H (6 games)
Total games to event completion: 10
Wins: 9
Loses: 1
Time: 2 hours roughly
Notes: First session again I had no pop and no one was searching for tanks, but luckily I was able to form a 4-man team composing of 2 tanks and 2 DPS. We won 3 games and lost 1. Second session I found a group that was willing to compromise and go 3 tanks / 2 dps / 1 healer. It worked fine since my SM was a bit heal speced (heal blade enchant, HoT on enchant tactic) and even managed to top heal charts in one match. We won 6 matches and lost 0.

Class: Warrior Priest
Tier: 2/3
Spec: grace
Total games to event completion: 10
Wins: 5
Loses: 5
Time: 2 hours
Notes: I joined the same group as with the SM since they were still going strong. Some notes on the grouping system were made here, meaning that in T2/3 it seems much more frequent that groups are not filled and you end up in 6v9 or 11v8 situations. Wheter this is due to lack of players in the pool or a possible issue with the new queue changes, i don't know.

Class: Knight of the Blazing Sun
Tier: 4
Spec: SnB
Total games to event completion: 11
Wins: 6
Loses: 5
Time: 1 hour 40 minutes
My knight was next and I have to say, ever since the Mighty Soul removal (NO NEVER FORGET MIGHTY SSSOUUULLL) I only use this character as a talisman bot; so every event I only do it on him until the 2nd reward. This event was special for the little guy however, and I managed to do it entirely. The first 5 games were via pug and should be noted for the extremely negative and flatout insulting comments made in /sc, proving once again that when players lose, they b*tch and moan and see a fault of everyone else except their own. At this stage I also saw a parasite, as i've come to call them: players who are not afk but flatout refuse to play. His name was Duracell, a BW. I have screenshots of him idling around in weird places on the map, and raised an issue with the in-game helper tool. It stung even more since we were actually winning thanks to some flanking and ninja capping of the flag by myself and especially an engi called Lollipop. We lost 500-309.
After this I was able to join a few alliance members in a 3-man (eventually turned into a 5-man party) and LO AND BEHOLD, we started winning. Again of note is that out o fthe 5 losses it took my knight to complete the event, 4 were during pug play and 1 was during premade play.

To summarise:
TOTAL GAMES: 31
- In order to complete the event on 3 characters on order it took me 6 hours, roughly, over 2 sessions
- out of all my played games, 26 were premade (83.87%) and 5 were pug (16.12%)
- out of all my played games, 20 were wins (64.51%) and 11 were loses (35.48%)
- out of all premades, 19 were wins (73%) and 7 were loses (27%)
- out of all pugs, 1 was a win (20%) and 4 were losses (80%)
- out of all games, the total number of games in which the losing side scored more than 100 points was 7 (22.58%)

Here is a screenshot of my data in physical form, in case i missed anything:

Spoiler:

[Massn]

The problem is the order, who doesn't want to run premades. Something is wrong with the faction. Maybe good guilds doesn't exists on the order side, dunno. I'm new here so can't say for sure.

[Martok]

Anecdotal information, sure, but yesterday I solo-qued my way through the Weekend Warfront. Only took the ten sc's required to complete the event. Just saying.

[Meliannia]

many people including gms strangely not reading the post
for the 5th time:
this is not a problem with premades vs pugs

the problem is with king of the hill being the weekend event in T4 scens

King of the hill is 90% destro win (not the main issue) but the main issue is 75% of the wins are 500-0 47-0 kills, the losing team gets nothing, is utterly tomped by the unthinking centre zerg ands hold stay putt ball, no progress no renown,no kills no chance, just 12misn wasted. better players make no difference as any1 who sticks their face out is insta smoked by the melee ball apck zerg army.

when the event scen is multiple bases eg gates of ekrund, reik factory, logain, forge, dorf boat the losing team (order or destro) can still get 270 to 470 points taking bases, contributing and fighting small fights, solo fights, using map, and being tactically superior, quicker more mobile and quicker to react and process changes to the battle as it ebbs and flows. Better players are rewarded and can even win the game solo.

again if the gms/devs are happy for the weekend event scen to be 90% destro win of which 75% are 500-0 then this is concerning

if they made the event scen multiple bases then it would be 90% close fights and every1 tryign and contributing and beign rewarded win or lose competitive fun pvp who'd have thought it?

again i would challenge the Gms/devs to gather data on T4 event scen weekend and they will see the stark and obvious differences between king of the hill and multiple base scens.

gather data and look at it, and I'm certain you will see a stark contrast.

[inoeth]

did the recent event with 3 chars, 2 order, 1 destro:
it took me about 20 runs each on order and only 10 on destro (actually 8 to complete the other tasks).
half of the order runs have been in premade, on destro i was solo all the time.
even when outnumbered on destro, we won. even without heals, i did most dmg and most kills on destro.

even though i know half decent order players can be really tough, but on destro its sooo much easier to win somehow.
on the other hand i was reading alot of complains about "order being soo OP" in destro chats xD

not sure what to make out of that. for me personally destro seems to be easier to win even in non optimal conditions.

[p00ky]

The GMs have the data for these events. I've posed the question whether they could publish that data and we can stop speculating over what we all probably suspect is true. I wish they would release said data and we can discuss as a community how we can improve play for both factions. Other MMOs allow their community to see leaderboards, server scores, overall scenario scoring, mmr, ranked season results etc

I suspect the rate is very similar to city scores. Shame they can't rotate the city scenario for all the reasons you have presented here

Im pretty sure some of us order groups would completly ruin your expected data. We farmed destro none stop in this weekend sc. Only time it wasnt the case was when faced with double premades.

The problem is, most order still think that everyone running ranged dps and solo queing into the worst possible pug setup is meant to mean they should somehow win. Add this to the fact that half of these ranged DPS decide to face tank melee dps instead of kitting them and there you go.

I had quite a few friends solo queing destro during this weekend and they were crying just as badly, the grass isnt always greener on the other side

This is, like all other MMOs, a team effort game. It currently evolves around proper 2/2/2 team setups. Making the game force you into that will only make there be basically 0 pops in que as no one on order seems to want to play tank and solo que with random, suicidal dps players. Setting up a premade doesn´t take that long and people are always spamming it in ./5 chat during the weekend, give it a go! This doesnt guarantee a win, but will deff increase your chances.

[Meliannia]

for the 6th time
this isnt about Premades vs pugs

it's about king of the hill being a poor choice for weekend event scens as 90% are stomps, and 75% 500-0 utter stomps, no progress at all for losses, and only 1 little area is used by the packed winners,

other scens eg multiple base scens like gates ekrund, logain forge, nord watch, gates Altdorf, dragon bane, dorf boat, both teams fight over entire map 3 bases and even if losers outclassed they still compete til the end and score 270 to 470 points and get rewarded for trying.

same for objective running on a lesser scale u can do well at stonetroll, phoenix gate, talabac damn, etc just from gettign the objective a couple of times and u can have small fights killing flag runner and his mate, again the losers usually get 100 to 370 points so are rewarded, whereas king of hill u get nothing at all. No points, no kills, no contri, no renown. Zilcho.

the thread is about making the weekend event scen to not king of the hill, it is not about premades vs pugs. have no issue premades vs pugs that part of game, its bout ONE scenario TYPE.