Patch Notes 13/10/17

[gke96]

Question!

1)How is the block/parry to guard damage calculated now?
2)Does bonus defensive chance or bonus striketrough apply "after" all this calculation is done?
3)Does previously applied DoTs break detaunt?

[daniilpb]

Now it feels like you should never dot anything dangerous if there is a possibility that it will attack you back.
Also what about AOE dots? E.g. Slayer's ID and Choppa's Yer All Bleedin' Now : you should never apply your detaunt unless these dots are over or your detaunt will disappear almost immediately. Am I right?

Gonna reveal how truly noob i am (don't tell my guild!) and i always figured my detaunt would break on DoT and wouldnt waste it. You just get better at positioning and reading if an enemy is gonna come at you. Plus with a group you should only really die if you **** up bad.

You need to try some competitive fights against setups with Marauder to refresh your opinion about positioning. Just imagine you try to push enemy mara and he suddenly lands his M1 on you. He starts to rush to you with his whole squad. He is full of your dots, your tanks getting punted and... You could have a chance before these changes, just apply detaunt, double pot and pray your gods but now... You are probably dead 9 of 10 cases.

Same with any other mdps who use dots. Probably your detaunt will be useless in cases of sudden focus.

[Annaise16]

Clarification about DOT defense. IS the following true?

1. If the initial hit is defended, the ability doesn't land and so there is no damage. (Same as current.)

2. If the initial hit is not defended, each dot after the first has a chance to be defended but a successful defense does not remove the dot. That is, subsequent ticks can still do damage. For example, dot lands, tick one does 100 points of damage, tick two is defended and does no damage, tick three does 100 points of damage, etc until the dot times out.

From what I have played so far, you pretty much defend nothing. Everyone is doing more damage.

the defense chances should be considerably higher. I'll post about my interpretation of it in the general discussion forum.

[Zanilos]

Clarification about DOT defense. IS the following true?

1. If the initial hit is defended, the ability doesn't land and so there is no damage. (Same as current.)

2. If the initial hit is not defended, each dot after the first has a chance to be defended but a successful defense does not remove the dot. That is, subsequent ticks can still do damage. For example, dot lands, tick one does 100 points of damage, tick two is defended and does no damage, tick three does 100 points of damage, etc until the dot times out.

From what I have played so far, you pretty much defend nothing. Everyone is doing more damage.

the defense chances should be considerably higher. I'll post about my interpretation of it in the general discussion forum.

Have you played this morning?

[Annaise16]

From what I have played so far, you pretty much defend nothing. Everyone is doing more damage.

the defense chances should be considerably higher. I'll post about my interpretation of it in the general discussion forum.

Have you played this morning?

I don't know if the new formulae are working as intended. That's why I wrote "should be".

[Manatikik]

Now it feels like you should never dot anything dangerous if there is a possibility that it will attack you back.
Also what about AOE dots? E.g. Slayer's ID and Choppa's Yer All Bleedin' Now : you should never apply your detaunt unless these dots are over or your detaunt will disappear almost immediately. Am I right?

Gonna reveal how truly noob i am (don't tell my guild!) and i always figured my detaunt would break on DoT and wouldnt waste it. You just get better at positioning and reading if an enemy is gonna come at you. Plus with a group you should only really die if you **** up bad.

You need to try some competitive fights against setups with Marauder to refresh your opinion about positioning. Just imagine you try to push enemy mara and he suddenly lands his M1 on you. He starts to rush to you with his whole squad. He is full of your dots, your tanks getting punted and... You could have a chance before these changes, just apply detaunt, double pot and pray your gods but now... You are probably dead 9 of 10 cases.

Same with any other mdps who use dots. Probably your detaunt will be useless in cases of sudden focus.

NA is definitely lacking solid maras

[anarchypark]

Spoiler:

So... 'strikethrough' just adds to the upper limit of the roll.

Prior to this update, contested avoidance used to be a roll between 0 and 100, and then was calculated using a different, incorrect formula that normally resulted in -6% to 7% base chance to avoid for those who stacked offensive hardcap stats. So avoidance really never happened except when you stacked it with renown, and even then, it was a low base % chance.

Now, for example, let's say the parry from weaponskill on the paperdoll window for our character is 18%. That same formula is used to calculate how much 'contested' parry strikethrough is obtained from strength. Let's assume the attacker has 37% parry strikethrough from strength, as often a player will have higher strength than weaponskill depending on how their talismans are slotted. Remember, the same formula is used to determine strikethough, just like it is used to determine avoidance, just with using a different stat.

Now, the 100 is added to by the 37% strikethrough, resulting in us picking a number between 0 and 137. If that number we pick randomly is greater than or equal to our 18 parry, we assume the attack hits. Otherwise, the attack is parried.

So using that above example, let's say our random number returned is:
4.5 - this will result in a avoid.
19 - this will result in a hit.
18.5 - this will result in a hit.
10 - this will result in a avoid.
129 - this will result in a hit.

As you can see, the probability of striking through goes up depending on the upper portion of the roll. The more strikethrough, the harder it is (but never impossible) to avoid it becomes. This results in better gameplay just because stacking defensive stats becomes viable and it becomes the closest to the old system from live we could get.

math+english, my brain exploded.
so, strength now reduce parry chance from item/RR/skill? ( from .getstat values )
and weapon skills provide more parry than b4?

Spoiler:

Now it feels like you should never dot anything dangerous if there is a possibility that it will attack you back.
Also what about AOE dots? E.g. Slayer's ID and Choppa's Yer All Bleedin' Now : you should never apply your detaunt unless these dots are over or your detaunt will disappear almost immediately. Am I right?

Gonna reveal how truly noob i am (don't tell my guild!) and i always figured my detaunt would break on DoT and wouldnt waste it. You just get better at positioning and reading if an enemy is gonna come at you. Plus with a group you should only really die if you **** up bad.

You need to try some competitive fights against setups with Marauder to refresh your opinion about positioning. Just imagine you try to push enemy mara and he suddenly lands his M1 on you. He starts to rush to you with his whole squad. He is full of your dots, your tanks getting punted and... You could have a chance before these changes, just apply detaunt, double pot and pray your gods but now... You are probably dead 9 of 10 cases.

Same with any other mdps who use dots. Probably your detaunt will be useless in cases of sudden focus.

yea double edged sword. you can detaunt other dps than mara who is on DoT.
mara alone? detaunt useless, go assault stance.
ST dot is fine. AoE DoT have some restraint now. good for attackers.

[Scrilian]

Why not make single target detaunt remove your dots on the target then? Just a thought :>

[Cimba]

So... 'strikethrough' just adds to the upper limit of the roll.

Okay. So lets assume level 40 for both attacker and defender. For the attacker one can safely assume 1050. AM in full conq gear (with willpower pot) has around 660 willpower. Taking these numbers I get a defense chance of 22.85 which is probably rounded to 22 or 23 (lets go with 23). As attacker you get 40 strike through from 1050.

Now you roll between 1 and 140 and everything lower or equal to 23 will be a defense. That means the effective defense rate is 23/140 = 16.4% correct?

Lets add 18% disrupt from renown tactics => you move up to 41/140 = 29.2% correct? Meaning the effective increase is 29.2 - 16.4 = 12.8%. To combat disrupt stacking you could use strike through. With full conq + 3 piece genesis you could get 7% on e.g. BW. Adding that we have 41/147 = 27.9% and an effectic decrease of 27.9 - 29.2 = -1.3%, correct?. I think the maximum strikethrough you could get was like 3 genesis 5 beastlord + 4 from conq gloves/head making it 12. This would result in 27.3% effective disrupt, so 5 additional disrupt strike through would net you 0.6% lowered defense.

Okay. Now please someone tell me I have made a mistake somewhere. Because to me it looks like strike through just became essentially useless.

Maybe lets take a quick look at a extreme case with 3x HTL (45% defense), full renown (18% defense) and 7% strike through you would look at 86/147 = 58.5%.

Another question. Previously spells that were 'virtually undefenable' added afaik 100 strike through. How is the current implementation of such skills? Does it also add 100 strike through?

Spoiler:

Prior to this update, contested avoidance used to be a roll between 0 and 100, and then was calculated using a different, incorrect formula that normally resulted in -6% to 7% base chance to avoid for those who stacked offensive hardcap stats. So avoidance really never happened except when you stacked it with renown, and even then, it was a low base % chance.

Now, for example, let's say the parry from weaponskill on the paperdoll window for our character is 18%. That same formula is used to calculate how much 'contested' parry strikethrough is obtained from strength. Let's assume the attacker has 37% parry strikethrough from strength, as often a player will have higher strength than weaponskill depending on how their talismans are slotted. Remember, the same formula is used to determine strikethough, just like it is used to determine avoidance, just with using a different stat.

Now, the 100 is added to by the 37% strikethrough, resulting in us picking a number between 0 and 137. If that number we pick randomly is greater than or equal to our 18 parry, we assume the attack hits. Otherwise, the attack is parried.

So using that above example, let's say our random number returned is:
4.5 - this will result in a avoid.
19 - this will result in a hit.
18.5 - this will result in a hit.
10 - this will result in a avoid.
129 - this will result in a hit.

As you can see, the probability of striking through goes up depending on the upper portion of the roll. The more strikethrough, the harder it is (but never impossible) to avoid it becomes. This results in better gameplay just because stacking defensive stats becomes viable and it becomes the closest to the old system from live we could get.[/quote]

I will hopefully come back later to this.

[Annaise16]

Spoiler:

So... 'strikethrough' just adds to the upper limit of the roll.

Prior to this update, contested avoidance used to be a roll between 0 and 100, and then was calculated using a different, incorrect formula that normally resulted in -6% to 7% base chance to avoid for those who stacked offensive hardcap stats. So avoidance really never happened except when you stacked it with renown, and even then, it was a low base % chance.

Now, for example, let's say the parry from weaponskill on the paperdoll window for our character is 18%. That same formula is used to calculate how much 'contested' parry strikethrough is obtained from strength. Let's assume the attacker has 37% parry strikethrough from strength, as often a player will have higher strength than weaponskill depending on how their talismans are slotted. Remember, the same formula is used to determine strikethough, just like it is used to determine avoidance, just with using a different stat.

Now, the 100 is added to by the 37% strikethrough, resulting in us picking a number between 0 and 137. If that number we pick randomly is greater than or equal to our 18 parry, we assume the attack hits. Otherwise, the attack is parried.

So using that above example, let's say our random number returned is:
4.5 - this will result in a avoid.
19 - this will result in a hit.
18.5 - this will result in a hit.
10 - this will result in a avoid.
129 - this will result in a hit.

As you can see, the probability of striking through goes up depending on the upper portion of the roll. The more strikethrough, the harder it is (but never impossible) to avoid it becomes. This results in better gameplay just because stacking defensive stats becomes viable and it becomes the closest to the old system from live we could get.

math+english, my brain exploded.
so, strength now reduce parry chance from item/RR/skill? ( from .getstat values )
and weapon skills provide more parry than b4?



Yes. This is how I read it. I wonder if it's intentional.

To restore the % bonuses to their full percentage amounts they should use the contested chance and then a straight probability roll out of 100.

The contested chance should not include bonuses:

contested chance % = 100% x parry% / (100 + removed defense %)

The bonuses should be added to this and then a new roll made out of 100.

Final success % = contested chance + parry bonuses - strikethrough bonuses


Apology: Stuffed up the quotes.