Patch Notes 11/11/2020

[JarlBerzirk]

Engi buff? Literally the last thing the game needs if we are to help restore some sort of balance to Forts. Order is infested with Engis at present. AoE dots + rampaging slayers = destro funnel melts. Thought that was common knowledge.

A small Order RDPS nerf is needed to balance Forts, in much the same way as a small Destro MDPS nerf helped with Cities.

What Destro needs is for people to actually play ranged AoE classes. If that means SH being reworked so they can have an aoe dot then so be it

What order needed for cities was to just play more slayer...but instead you got tons of buffs and we got nerffed...sooo where is the logic behind this statement?

[geezereur]

Huge buff to Engineer that lower cast time.

[Glorian]

This is not critical, but in this version, Hollow-Points loses any meaningful meaning. And the Quick Reloader stacks with the Expert Skirmisher

Potentially MDPS version of engie incoming hehe

There is still the Global Cooldown.
Meaning yes, super fast cast of Gunblast and Snipe but still need to wait 1.4 secs to do anything else.
And some Engis were using Expert Skirmisher before for 20ft hardcore snipes.

[Atropik]

I still have backpain since that 250 ft range Snipe shots patch, please no more.

[zij83]

I would be interested in the thought process behind Engi being given reduced cast times on timestamp abilities such as snipe (imagine this with focussed mind and then add in gun blast..) and not Magus on BoC and FrF. Will magus be given ranged auto attack damage in future to compensate? or will that remain exclusive to Engi/Order.

I think it's pretty clear, doesn't seem to be an oversight...

[Wam]

Regardless of the merits of the actual changes, the timing is terrible (yes, timing matters). Destro is having a hizzy fit regarding forts and order rdps and then, lo and behold, a buff to what seems to be the most popular order rdps. I get that changes are worked on for a longer time and presumably get pushed when ready, but still, bad timing which will cause unneccessary drama.

Its not a complete buff, in some instances mines would be better (better range placement) core tactic etc easier to hit... grenade has better up time but less range, so using from above on fort will be tricky with players counter nuking you (or players landing above and dropping down and ganking or punting) its more a re tweek, if people actually aware of the skill and the counter insane whispers on mara. Used right its pretty strong but not that many used it properly... its more slight buff to ST burst tree and that is not very useful for forts... but i understand how destro take things on face value and don't really understand the tweaks and the bigger picture. Changes like this maybe give engi a spot in city wb in the niche part, but this change seems more for general orvr purposes.

Spoiler:

Destro are very fragile and its nothing to do with realm balance, its all to do with mentality... dev's cannot balance for weak mentality, people who zerg zones and don't organise themselves, and then QUIT because of some resistance then cry about balance without even trying? how can dev's balance for this... same thing today in reikwald 300 d vs 100 o in reikland... in fort numbers are more even, so everything matters... destro try zerg nascar the BO's eventually they get in... one half hearted attempt push on stage 3, maybe one warband, so 24 players out of 160+ of destro actually trying... rest afk or pretending to contribute and then complain about balance...

Order is more pug friendly, there is not much in the way of big hardcore guilds or any really... order ain't that strong but they got a better realm togetherness and spirit especially in defense. Even with order's weak pugs they co-ordinate alot better, destro have weird strats throwing forts just to try lock defenders in them, and go to the next to take empty ones and try stretch order this way... instead of put all your strongest fighters in same zone and believe in yourself and back yourself to win. Destro look for easy option and to make advantage of numbers imbalance, when they cannot take advantage of numbers and easy option dont exist destro throw toys out the pram and give up and start to cry on forums... its very weak mentality.

Its role reversal of order in cities from earlier this year, and order was told to get gud (took them long time to /5 and improve tactics) ... same applies to destro and forts, maybe you know stop repeating same mistakes and afk / quiting when things dont always go to plan ... work on tactics and transitions... dev's have made it easier with less number pop, and more ways into s3 and its still not enough because destro cultivated a weak thrower mindset... where order is more realm pride heroes. Destro over rely on FMJ to get anything done.

I can understand its frustrating when your team mates or realm mates are below par, but both sides have that same issue and its nothing to do with balance. Its a learn to play, and learn to organise / composition matters, you have to accept it as it comes and make the best of what you got. Its all in cycles anyways. Compared to live, things are more balanced here.

Ive seen known destro guilds throw forts after one push, if they even attempt one push... its just pretty weak teamplay and leadership. A lack of confidence / communication and stacking... order are far from invincible lol, they are there for the taking and sometimes it comes down to very fine margins but destro do not execute as well as they should then start the blame game, sometimes rightly or wrongly ... when everyone does not push and contribute.

[zij83]

but i understand how destro take things on face value and don't really understand the tweaks and the bigger picture.

This seems very disrespectful to an entire realm full of people on the server.

[Wam]

but i understand how destro take things on face value and don't really understand the tweaks and the bigger picture.

This seems very disrespectful to an entire realm full of people on the server.

Lets see knee jerk emotional over reaction? check

Perception is the issue here, not reality... the change hardly effects large scale, and can be slightly classed as a nerf more than a buff depending how co-ordinated you are... its not going to stop engi's spamming mines (but probably without the tactic) and giving free immunities out anyways because that is what they do, just like black orks run up to people and start with a aoe knockback despite being a melee class

In forts, engis above would need to be right on the edge now and target who they want to debuff, and this opens up the risk of them being knocked off or counter destroyed by rdps or the new influx of people landing on the top of fort and working their way down... previously with mines they could just put them through the chokes from safety of lord room and more than likely would hit bunch of healer stacks if you know where healers usually position.

Destro see changes for x y z order class, think they are all positive and game breaking... when its pretty minor and probably QQ where are RSH changes inc?

So if anything it gives more counter player in regards to forts because engi's need to be more at risk to use instead of sneaky. In open field its a bonus to order (means they wont have to give free immunities) but if randoms around they will give free immunities regardless, so its perhaps better in cities if you don't have noobs spamming CC for the sake of it (SM's, IB'S, Borks, Engi/Magi in particular )

Mara still has insane whispers, different strengths and weaknesses. Both skills pre existed before this, just how order will use in future is changed and requires a target so pulling it off is harder, especially if terrain (fort wall) is blocking line of sight. so on first glance to those without experience of it prior will think omg this is buffed when in reality it is just changed and requires more effort from engi (instead of fire and forget ability)

[Oglaf]

but i understand how destro take things on face value and don't really understand the tweaks and the bigger picture.

This seems very disrespectful to an entire realm full of people on the server.

Lets see knee jerk emotional over reaction? check

Perception is the issue here, not reality... the change hardly effects large scale, and can be slightly classed as a nerf more than a buff depending how co-ordinated you are... its not going to stop engi's spamming mines (but probably without the tactic) and giving free immunities out anyways because that is what they do, just like black orks run up to people and start with a aoe knockback despite being a melee class

In forts, engis above would need to be right on the edge now and target who they want to debuff, and this opens up the risk of them being knocked off or counter destroyed by rdps or the new influx of people landing on the top of fort and working their way down... previously with mines they could just put them through the chokes from safety of lord room and more than likely would hit bunch of healer stacks if you know where healers usually position.

Destro see changes for x y z order class, think they are all positive and game breaking... when its pretty minor and probably QQ where are RSH changes inc?

So if anything it gives more counter player in regards to forts because engi's need to be more at risk to use instead of sneaky. In open field its a bonus to order (means they wont have to give free immunities) but if randoms around they will give free immunities regardless, so its perhaps better in cities if you don't have noobs spamming CC for the sake of it (SM's, IB'S, Borks, Engi/Magi in particular )

Mara still has insane whispers, different strengths and weaknesses. Both skills pre existed before this, just how order will use in future is changed and requires a target so pulling it off is harder, especially if terrain (fort wall) is blocking line of sight. so on first glance to those without experience of it prior will think omg this is buffed when in reality it is just changed and requires more effort from engi (instead of fire and forget ability)

... and Slayers still have exclusive access to Rampage to give order the capability to break through, offensively AND defensively, in fort/keep fights that Destro lacks.

Not wanting to turn this thread into something else, but yeah - there's that.

[sogeou]

... and Slayers still have exclusive access to Rampage to give order the capability to break through, offensively AND defensively, in fort/keep fights that Destro lacks.

Not wanting to turn this thread into something else, but yeah - there's that.

Rampage is NOT that good at all. I would get rid of it if Choppa pull was removed. Destro just will cry about anything. If getting hit by 2-3 moves kills your tanks, who the slayer is hitting for 300-400 is your problem. Something is wrong with you.