witch elf build aka Rip your spine before action

[Bretin]

Theres is a bugtracker for exactly this reason. If you think that all those things are implemented wrongly, go there and get it fixed.
This is alpha state and not everyone knows every single class mechanic in and out. - So implementations may vary or are done the exact way the ability states.
The correct implementation however greatly relies on people reporting it and providing evidence.

why would you wanna have something "fixed" which works fine, doesn't affect the balance and is just slightly different from live but creates the possibility for a variety of group specs besides the double marauder double slayer troll setup? i just don't get it. if it would be a bug i'd use the bugtracker but a different working system is not a bug, it just makes the game more varied.

[taccr]

I don't even know what different system you are talking about so I give you the absolute standard answer that applies to all those issues.
If it's not mentioned in the "intended changes" thread and not an obvious bug then it's up to the devs to decide what to do.

[bloodi]

l2read or just don't reply is my advice for you today.

I did, you tried your best to not get your new toy fixed, claimed that video evidence was wrong and even tried to insult people who argues against you.

Now you are pathetically trying to call it a balance issue and started throwing mud at Nydig because he expressed a balance opinion.

If merely stating an opinion discredits him, even as a guy who mained WE and dedicated himself to it, what does what you did in this thread do for you? If a balance statment is enough for you to discredit someone and disregard his opinion, what would you do with someone who is wrong, gets called out on it, tries to claim the evidence that is shown is wrong even when its bizarre to do so, throws insults around and then when its clear that he can no longer claim that the sky is yellow argues that the world would be much better if it was?

I am just asking to make sure, if one warrants such a thing, what would be guy with the clowniest avatar i ever seen do to such a person? Exile? Chemical castration? Capital punishment maybe?

[nydig]

I'm just saying not every target is going to be guarded and even if they are a bg will punt the guard far enough away to not matter. Detaunt can't be used when you are knocked down which will happen when you get jumped by a we (once we are all 40). Also with all the chosen around running aura people will not be capped resists. Also I said upwards which isn't every time but it did happen. You forgot to add the extra 10% from infernal gift when sorc runs it and 15% from magus dot. Everything I'm saying is from a premade or 6v6 situation.

Also once we get agile escape we will have one of the best disengage abilities and the only melee class on destro with the ability to completely ignore white lion pull and things like stagger punts. We also has the best melee detaunt in the game with 15 sec duration while choppa mara wl and slayer are all 5 secs AND at least on live don't know about here some of them could actually get disrupted. Now who knows if it was intended or a bug but getting your detaunt disrupted is pretty brutal.

The WE is squishy and for good reason there is no arguing that though. its just ment to be played as a hit and run class.

[TenTonHammer]

Now im not a hardcore 6v6'r but realistically speaking if we go by 2 tank 2 dps 2 healer

would anyone really run a WE and sorc/magus in their second dps slot?

If your an aware player when you see the debuff and red swirl effect from the stealth opener you will hit detaunt, granted the WE/WH will still probably kill you if solo but still you can get detuant off before kd

The devs changed, detuants btw to buffs i belive so that they cant get disrupted?

[Bretin]

I'm just saying not every target is going to be guarded and even if they are a bg will punt the guard far enough away to not matter. Detaunt can't be used when you are knocked down which will happen when you get jumped by a we (once we are all 40). Also with all the chosen around running aura people will not be capped resists. Also I said upwards which isn't every time but it did happen. You forgot to add the extra 10% from infernal gift when sorc runs it and 15% from magus dot. Everything I'm saying is from a premade or 6v6 situation.

so you would run a magus/sorc/we/bg/chosen setup in a 6vs6, just to get you right? have fun with that i would probably 3vs6 your whole group while eating chips.

also your logic requires your target to have no KD immunity and being to dumb to press detaunt right after he has the first dot of the WE. that again also requires he would play with a standard ui which does not show his debuffs instantly and a tank not calling his CC on TS.

Nice try, you failed (again).

Also once we get agile escape we will have one of the best disengage abilities and the only melee class on destro with the ability to completely ignore white lion pull and things like stagger punts. We also has the best melee detaunt in the game with 15 sec duration while choppa mara wl and slayer are all 5 secs AND at least on live don't know about here some of them could actually get disrupted. Now who knows if it was intended or a bug but getting your detaunt disrupted is pretty brutal.

just another proof about what i thought earlier about you, sorry but i don't agree with any of these points at all but that has nothing to do with our previous discussion and i cba to argue about even more bs today.

[Klev]

I'm just saying not every target is going to be guarded and even if they are a bg will punt the guard far enough away to not matter. Detaunt can't be used when you are knocked down which will happen when you get jumped by a we (once we are all 40). Also with all the chosen around running aura people will not be capped resists. Also I said upwards which isn't every time but it did happen. You forgot to add the extra 10% from infernal gift when sorc runs it and 15% from magus dot. Everything I'm saying is from a premade or 6v6 situation.

so you would run a magus/sorc/we/bg/chosen setup in a 6vs6, just to get you right? have fun with that i would probably 3vs6 your whole group while eating chips.

also your logic requires your target to have no KD immunity and being to dumb to press detaunt right after he has the first dot of the WE. that again also requires he would play with a standard ui which does not show his debuffs instantly and a tank not calling his CC on TS.

Nice try, you failed (again). But in general it fits to my opinion about americans trying to be competitive in games.

Also once we get agile escape we will have one of the best disengage abilities and the only melee class on destro with the ability to completely ignore white lion pull and things like stagger punts. We also has the best melee detaunt in the game with 15 sec duration while choppa mara wl and slayer are all 5 secs AND at least on live don't know about here some of them could actually get disrupted. Now who knows if it was intended or a bug but getting your detaunt disrupted is pretty brutal.

just another proof about what i thought earlier about you, sorry but i don't agree with any of these points at all but that has nothing to do with our previous discussion and i cba to argue about even more bs today.

So my understanding is that 4x procs of up to 600 on an intelligently selected target that all hit at the same time is close enough to being balanced as it was on live? Where's my instant 2400 damage addition when I open on a target?

In more seriousness, I read often but post rarely. What I do read too often is how Bretin fellow is so willing to put people down and as a whole is often inflammatory to the general folks here on the boards. Why is this allowed to persist? An intelligent discussion will so often spiral down hill once his toxic remarks make it on this forum. I believe he has good stuff to add, but definitely needs to drop the spite and disdain for everyone else.

[Nanji]

started throwing mud at Nydig because he expressed a balance opinion.

Actually for having a bad UI where you cant see ****.
Usually a bad UI is an indicator for a bad player.
Just saying...

[Azarael]

Bretin, drop the aggression. These people may or may not be wrong, but even if they are, it doesn't justify flippant and demeaning responses.

Nor is the condition of one player's UI any kind of relevant argument for this thread, so let's drop that right now.

So. What you're telling me is:

- Witchbrew had an internal cooldown of at least 1500ms
- ALL procs had a similar internal cooldown

I'm going to need solid proof in order to change this - I've asked the testers and they say that Witchbrew always worked like it does on RoR.

Also, as it stands, live implementation trumps all. A balance request thread has to be opened if you believe something was underpowered on live.

[Bretin]

Where's my instant 2400 damage addition when I open on a target?

on a naked target w/o resistance, who already hitted you to trigger a proc with 25% chance of activation after preloading WB in either 6 or 7,5 seconds and another minute of waiting for your stealth to be ready. so every 66-67,5 seconds, compared to a 3 sec cast (doombolt) which will hit a naked target for 3.5-4k w/o a cooldown or snipe, fester or what not. all those abilities can be used with roughly a 10 sec cd while the WE burst is up once every minute. if you want your 2400 instant dmg go Pierce Armor and you don't even need WB to do 15k dmg in 2 seconds.

What I do read too often is how Bretin fellow is so willing to put people down and as a whole is often inflammatory to the general folks here on the boards.

pretty simple, everytime i act "inflammatory" ppl just realized how good several things in the game could work if they are used by a decent player cause they probably watched twitch videos and realized how stubborn their previous opinion about a thing was and in that process they are coming to the forums and trying to get the craziest things nerfed, the ones who were usually called out to be UP i.e. WE, WL, SM, BO. and tbh, it's really pissing me off and that's why i act like that. besides the flame i made multiple points based on facts...