4 problems killing this server

[PROsiak]

Finally some valid points have been made. There's nothing as harmful to the enviroment, as organized wb's not participating in defense/offense and active fighting because they do not want to let the other side get a bag roll, or they wait till some pugs destroy keep doors so their realm can get 'easy bags'. I know player behaviour is the factor here as well, but the reward system encourages situations like these...

[Dajciekrwi]

Server cannot be destroyed because someone wrong design decision, because server is item, placed somewhere in France.
What can be worsened is players experience from playing this game.
After such a short time we cannot even evaluate latest patch in gaming experience and we can't be sure that's the “last” change.
What “kills server” is players mentality.All of us can make greate esseys what is going on and why(not/geared players.not/expierienced, not/premades ect ect. And all this bla bla bla that we are familiar with)
At the moment many players think that Destroy is OP and 90% of my gaming time is 20-80 aao for order.Because for some reason all players decide to go destro and zerg the other side. Since there is no serious impact assessment on patch- many players decide to believe the rumours about destro is OP and go there. And random players go where is more players and its simple human atavistic fact. Casual player who need to feel wining goes ther. So only one what “kills server” is players laziness and inability to face failures, also atavistic herd instinct.
And good suggestion - if you want to feel happy/wining you play destro - and if you need/want to play competetive hard game you play order.
Is it true that human atavism should be tamed by game design?- thas possible.
I can't force anyone to do this- but if you see that on one side is to many players or ther is organised warband , and you have opportunity to do this- yes you should Xrealm to the loosing side.
Ther is not problem of organisation on Order- ther will be no leaders when ther is noone to lead- and thats same also for destro. And all someone who pick this argument should think twice whats going on and in what circumstances. Even proper 2/2/2 pug cannot make any sagnificant change when playing vs 2 or 3 wb at the same time.

Ps: Ther was many content added to the game – ther are many events, many new pve content ect.(Bastion stairs ware re-opened)

Its really very interesting opinion, but incorrectly addressed. These all above should be adressed to warbands, warbands matter, not players.
Warband are main actors in this game. One bilion time all says here , RoR its a group/wb focused game, and when all goes veird we call individual players atavistic?

For all this time RoR is worked for that, so stop thinkin about players and start talk about wbs. If we have 8 warbands in server, and 6 goes to Destro, who will win?
If we have 3 premade warbands od Destro versus 5 pugs on Order , which side these pug warbands should choose?
What we expect from leaders- they should throw his warband to meat machine x 1000 times at one evening??
Ofc, all we can read on forum, "my guild always fight on underdog side", im not playing enough to judge.

But my opinion is: The premise of the game is wrong and the behavior od gamers are logical, that all folks!

[Absinth]

...if you mean RVR then you are also wrong because most of the time the zone is either on the equal numbers or in favour of order and we are talking about ~15h 30min of a day order rekts destro (this includes mostly NA time), 5h 30 min is destro having fun (mostly at the end of NA hours and eu mid to late primetime) and 3h is fair fight (early EU primetime) And this is how it mostly sits on, this is how the 24h time distribution is always when i look at the orvr stats. majority of the day is order having higher numbers most of the time.

This is just straight up wrong and you can check here: https://www.rvrstats.additionweb.co.uk/

54% Destro to 46% Order in the last 24h, at the time of this being posted.

"order rekts destro (this includes mostly NA time)" - Are you kidding? Big Inc has been playing almost every single night for the past what, month? HoB also logs in at the tail end of EU and stays for a bit during NA. NA is the most one sided timezone by far.

"5h 30 min is destro having fun (mostly at the end of NA hours" - Again, completely off and the other reason why NA is one sided. Late NA is when The Jempire and sometimes Old School logs in, fights Big Inc for 30min and then Order dominates. Late NA is the only timezone where Order has more numbers (unless Formosa decides to log Order during EU mornings, which they've done once in the last 30 days) and it still depends entirely if those guilds decide to play. When they don't, Destro consistently has more numbers.

Stop looking at the 24h combined and start looking at the 30min time frames and you will see you are wrong. You are saying NA is the most onesided? yes it is and you are forgetting jempire that would farm everything there was for months and months and months when there was no big inc. Just because one guild decides to dip when there is actual competition instead of PVD'ing 4th fort of the NA time it does not mean that the game is in favour of destro. There were weeks of NA where nothing was going on, no guild no pugs and it was a time when everything was stalled with no appearent strong force where the highest number was three witch hunters running a party.

[Jajcek12]

Server cannot be destroyed because someone wrong design decision, because server is item, placed somewhere in France.
What can be worsened is players experience from playing this game.
After such a short time we cannot even evaluate latest patch in gaming experience and we can't be sure that's the “last” change.
What “kills server” is players mentality.All of us can make greate esseys what is going on and why(not/geared players.not/expierienced, not/premades ect ect. And all this bla bla bla that we are familiar with)
At the moment many players think that Destroy is OP and 90% of my gaming time is 20-80 aao for order.Because for some reason all players decide to go destro and zerg the other side. Since there is no serious impact assessment on patch- many players decide to believe the rumours about destro is OP and go there. And random players go where is more players and its simple human atavistic fact. Casual player who need to feel wining goes ther. So only one what “kills server” is players laziness and inability to face failures, also atavistic herd instinct.
And good suggestion - if you want to feel happy/wining you play destro - and if you need/want to play competetive hard game you play order.
Is it true that human atavism should be tamed by game design?- thas possible.
I can't force anyone to do this- but if you see that on one side is to many players or ther is organised warband , and you have opportunity to do this- yes you should Xrealm to the loosing side.
Ther is not problem of organisation on Order- ther will be no leaders when ther is noone to lead- and thats same also for destro. And all someone who pick this argument should think twice whats going on and in what circumstances. Even proper 2/2/2 pug cannot make any sagnificant change when playing vs 2 or 3 wb at the same time.

Ps: Ther was many content added to the game – ther are many events, many new pve content ect.(Bastion stairs ware re-opened)

Its really very interesting opinion, but incorrectly addressed. These all above should be adressed to warbands, warbands matter, not players.
Warband are main actors in this game. One bilion time all says here , RoR its a group/wb focused game, and when all goes veird we call individual players atavistic?

For all this time RoR is worked for that, so stop thinkin about players and start talk about wbs. If we have 8 warbands in server, and 6 goes to Destro, who will win?
If we have 3 premade warbands od Destro versus 5 pugs on Order , which side these pug warbands should choose?
What we expect from leaders- they should throw his warband to meat machine x 1000 times at one evening??
Ofc, all we can read on forum, "my guild always fight on underdog side", im not playing enough to judge.

But my opinion is: The premise of the game is wrong and the behavior od gamers are logical, that all folks!

Is the way of organizing players a person or a concept, an abstract? Warband is not a real person.
Warbands are made of players and thats why i addres my previounse point toward players - not toward abstract concepts created by game interfase.
Im not responsible for solving player rotation around the sides- and i don't care about "Destro vs Order discours" couse whan comes to ballance im not competent to speak about it and i have doubts that the developers want to make our gaming experience worse.
I dont look for camouflaged intention of “ballance”- i dont care if side A wins and side B loses- its game and its happen.
I don't know how to respond to the examples given above and what they may refer to.
We can even use abseurd example and say that this one org wb just pick wrong side this day- and what then?- or just that day one leader was sick and cannnot lead – and what then? Or (N+1) examples
Ofcourse players decisions are rational - noone doubt it.Players pick rational decision based on differend data and premises. But one player rationaly pick side A and other side B because ther that player meets its expectations about gamming expierience independently of chosen side. If player decide to be on side A because ther is high chance of winning(couse if bigger player number/org wb ect) feel happy and comforably he will go ther- is this atavism - isnt it? Reason is slave of the passion till its become autonomous. And we all like this feeling- feeling of winning but not all are overcome by it.
The moment when someone pick “loosing” side is them moment of autonomical decision based on common good not on individual comfot. And since not all players make that autonomical(not based on comfort) decision – it is at it is.
In the end – this is game about fighting - fighting involve losing- not about surfing on zergs back for free “wins” Winning without fight isnt gaming. All this game is more or less competative and when this aspect is lost the game loose its meaning.

[Paxsanarion]

Server cannot be destroyed because someone wrong design decision, because server is item, placed somewhere in France.
What can be worsened is players experience from playing this game.
After such a short time we cannot even evaluate latest patch in gaming experience and we can't be sure that's the “last” change.
What “kills server” is players mentality.All of us can make greate esseys what is going on and why(not/geared players.not/expierienced, not/premades ect ect. And all this bla bla bla that we are familiar with)
At the moment many players think that Destroy is OP and 90% of my gaming time is 20-80 aao for order.Because for some reason all players decide to go destro and zerg the other side. Since there is no serious impact assessment on patch- many players decide to believe the rumours about destro is OP and go there. And random players go where is more players and its simple human atavistic fact. Casual player who need to feel wining goes ther. So only one what “kills server” is players laziness and inability to face failures, also atavistic herd instinct.
And good suggestion - if you want to feel happy/wining you play destro - and if you need/want to play competetive hard game you play order.
Is it true that human atavism should be tamed by game design?- thas possible.
I can't force anyone to do this- but if you see that on one side is to many players or ther is organised warband , and you have opportunity to do this- yes you should Xrealm to the loosing side.
Ther is not problem of organisation on Order- ther will be no leaders when ther is noone to lead- and thats same also for destro. And all someone who pick this argument should think twice whats going on and in what circumstances. Even proper 2/2/2 pug cannot make any sagnificant change when playing vs 2 or 3 wb at the same time.

Ps: Ther was many content added to the game – ther are many events, many new pve content ect.(Bastion stairs ware re-opened)

Its really very interesting opinion, but incorrectly addressed. These all above should be adressed to warbands, warbands matter, not players.
Warband are main actors in this game. One bilion time all says here , RoR its a group/wb focused game, and when all goes veird we call individual players atavistic?

For all this time RoR is worked for that, so stop thinkin about players and start talk about wbs. If we have 8 warbands in server, and 6 goes to Destro, who will win?
If we have 3 premade warbands od Destro versus 5 pugs on Order , which side these pug warbands should choose?
What we expect from leaders- they should throw his warband to meat machine x 1000 times at one evening??
Ofc, all we can read on forum, "my guild always fight on underdog side", im not playing enough to judge.

But my opinion is: The premise of the game is wrong and the behavior od gamers are logical, that all folks!

Is the way of organizing players a person or a concept, an abstract? Warband is not a real person.
Warbands are made of players and thats why i addres my previounse point toward players - not toward abstract concepts created by game interfase.
Im not responsible for solving player rotation around the sides- and i don't care about "Destro vs Order discours" couse whan comes to ballance im not competent to speak about it and i have doubts that the developers want to make our gaming experience worse.
I dont look for camouflaged intention of “ballance”- i dont care if side A wins and side B loses- its game and its happen.
I don't know how to respond to the examples given above and what they may refer to.
We can even use abseurd example and say that this one org wb just pick wrong side this day- and what then?- or just that day one leader was sick and cannnot lead – and what then? Or (N+1) examples
Ofcourse players decisions are rational - noone doubt it.Players pick rational decision based on differend data and premises. But one player rationaly pick side A and other side B because ther that player meets its expectations about gamming expierience independently of chosen side. If player decide to be on side A because ther is high chance of winning(couse if bigger player number/org wb ect) feel happy and comforably he will go ther- is this atavism - isnt it? Reason is slave of the passion till its become autonomous. And we all like this feeling- feeling of winning but not all are overcome by it.
The moment when someone pick “loosing” side is them moment of autonomical decision based on common good not on individual comfot. And since not all players make that autonomical(not based on comfort) decision – it is at it is.
In the end – this is game about fighting - fighting involve losing- not about surfing on zergs back for free “wins” Winning without fight isnt gaming. All this game is more or less competative and when this aspect is lost the game loose its meaning.

Well said Jacek, reminds me of why I have always played Order since live. I am going back to playing Order only...after my short trip to Destro. Come what may I will fight for Order.

[Jajcek12]

I dont support any side or wont lobbying for any: order or destro. If my ideas helps you pick decisions good for you and you gamming expectation - good for you.

[Rotgut]

Stop looking at the 24h combined and start looking at the 30min time frames and you will see you are wrong. You are saying NA is the most onesided? yes it is and you are forgetting jempire that would farm everything there was for months and months and months when there was no big inc. Just because one guild decides to dip when there is actual competition instead of PVD'ing 4th fort of the NA time it does not mean that the game is in favour of destro. There were weeks of NA where nothing was going on, no guild no pugs and it was a time when everything was stalled with no appearent strong force where the highest number was three witch hunters running a party.

Ohh i know about NA, trust me. Its the whole reason i made a Choppa to lead pugs there, and i helped Big Inc for like 2 months, i used to lead WBs there. I was half the reason Order was strong during NA, cuz i did 2/2/2 pugbands on my Slayer and beat the **** out of Destro so much (when Evil wasn't farming me during the Ring Event), people stopped logging Destro. So i went to the other side.

"Stop looking at the 24h combined and start looking at the 30min time frames" - i am. i don't think you are tho. its the same pattern almost every night, Big Inc logs on the tail end of EU, stays for East Coast time, Jempire logs during West Coast cuz they've always been a West Coast guild. Lets check last night shall we.

-Big Inc shows up at around 23:30 UK Time, fights some EU boys, Destro has 56% of the pop.
-Pop drops by 50 players signalling the end of the last few remnants of EU boys, Big Inc fighting nobody with 57% of the pop.
-Still Big Inc playing against nobody, 62% Destro.
-Jempire shows up, 61% Destro
-Some more Jempire vs Big Inc, 59% Destro.
-Big Inc logs off, pop is balanced.
-Some more Order log off so pop goes back to being 61% Destro, but it doesn't matter at this point cuz there are so few players around. Jempire is out tho, cuz they are West Coast.

"farm everything there was for months and months and months when there was no big inc." - But there is a Big Inc now. What does it matter how the game looked 3-4 months ago, before they became a thing?

"Just because one guild decides to dip when there is actual competition instead of PVD'ing" - Jempire is West Coast.

"There were weeks of NA where nothing was going on" - Again, what does it matter how the game WERE? We are talking about how it is now.

[Rapzel]

Finally some valid points have been made. There's nothing as harmful to the enviroment, as organized wb's not participating in defense/offense and active fighting because they do not want to let the other side get a bag roll, or they wait till some pugs destroy keep doors so their realm can get 'easy bags'. I know player behaviour is the factor here as well, but the reward system encourages situations like these...

Okay, so it's better to sit and camp in keep the whole evening when the other faction has AAO, like certain wbs (#CityDodgers) used to do?

You think it's more fun to zerg an empty keep than fighting a premade that's defending a keep?

First it was faction imbalances, second it was try hards, premades and people exploiting, after that it was blobbing, now its the reward system? Always exists something to blame I guess.

[OceanSoul]

You need to make pug expirience to feel good in order to keep new players. You've reached a celling for the ppl who wants to install and customize 100+ addons, do 2-2-2 with 60+ rr's premade in order to feel good at sc's, etc.

When joinin sc's at the evenin or pug wb's going to feel nice, you will get surpluse in popilation, imo.

[Ysaran]

You need to make pug expirience to feel good in order to keep new players. You've reached a celling for the ppl who wants to install and customize 100+ addons, do 2-2-2 with 60+ rr's premade in order to feel good at sc's, etc.

When joinin sc's at the evenin or pug wb's going to feel nice, you will get surpluse in popilation, imo.

This