[Partly implimented] BG: KD problem

[Morf]

I echo both your points tesq and tenton about hate spending abilities however its not hard to get 100 hate, its hard to maintain it, maybe its worth considering reducing hate costs of a few skills.

As for being a 2h def beast i run this spec as def 2h http://waronlinebuilder.org/#career=bg; ... ;893:0:0:0:
(bare in mind wos and anger drives me are moved down)
with around 50% parry, 70% disrupt and 40% dodge with epic quest weapon proc which has 100% uptime, capped tough and close to 5k armor, you also have bolstering anger that can crit heal for 700ish with brutal smash willpower buff, shield of rage absorbing just under 1k damage every 10 secs, banish weakness that needs no introduction and with endless pursuit tactic given how many bw's order have you can quite easily be harder to kill then any other tank in the game due to kiting pressure. It isnt a great spec in terms of group buffs/debuffs but in terms of being hard to kill its right up there, i often outlive def snb chosen in this spec when fighting and kiting zergs with a full group in rvr.

[Penril]

Morf, you don't run Choking Fury, or Soul Killer, or Crimson Death, and don't have a 5s KD. What exactly do you bring to the table? Only the AoE snare?

[TenTonHammer]

But why morf? Why run that spec as 2H? You are inetetionslly gimping yor self, it's like your running 2H just for style points

There is no reason to EVER run 2H on BG if you don't get CD

[Morf]

But why morf? Why run that spec as 2H? You are inetetionslly gimping yor self, it's like your running 2H just for style points

There is no reason to EVER run 2H on BG if you don't get CD

Partly correct, running a 2h takes pressure of your group tho, ppl see a 2h tank think squishy and focus them, no doubt snb would be better, 2h looks coller anyway so who the **** cares if u gimp yaself a bit

[Koha]

I do agree with OP and would incline for the following changes :

Blade of Ruin : 2H required, 3sec CD, hate cost and damage maintained
Spitefull Slam : Shield required + require parry or block

That way 2H BG would catch up with other tanks in terms of CC.
SnB BG will also have a more reliable CC.

[Penril]

But why morf? Why run that spec as 2H? You are inetetionslly gimping yor self, it's like your running 2H just for style points

There is no reason to EVER run 2H on BG if you don't get CD

Partly correct, running a 2h takes pressure of your group tho, ppl see a 2h tank think squishy and focus them, no doubt snb would be better, 2h looks coller anyway so who the **** cares if u gimp yaself a bit

Smart players will learn to ignore you once they realize you are tanky and have no serious debuffs on you.

Also, this is the Balance forum, not a fashion show. So 2H BGs looking awesome is irrelevant; we will stick to the issue raised by the OP from now on.

[Tesq]

well the cc problem also lay in BO snare it have few to do with BG, both BG /BO have aoe snare and aoe KD just that BG have 1 min CD to get a sm/BO cc (is a morale ye so 1 min but BO should not spam snare for free) BO instead can spam the BG snare. That's an issue by his own anyway, the BG coldown on cc are all good (maybe super punt as x the KB thread ) but i think that the KD issue should be fix by his own not considering other cc aviable to bg or other tanks; the KD is a basic CC for every tank not class dependantly, it should be viable both in 2h/s+b; definety present even if with an appropriate cost/trade off. On BG it feel more a problem of skill economy due be a debuffer, if you KD you do not debuff and vice versa (i may seems not a problem but if you play daily with BG you see that you costanlty have stuff to do and you are always late in doing that).

[Stmichael1989]

I admittedly know little about BG, much less the nuances between 2h vs S&B. On the surface, assuming there isn't already a cave in mirror for destro, there's no reason BG shouldn't have a knockdown available for 2h spec. They're supposed to be an offensively focused tank, and on command hard CC is a valuable tool for such a class.

Spoiler:

My primary concern going much further than a cave in mirror is the currently existing BG tools available that are simply outshone by marauder. I do think this is a case of needing addition by subtraction, as retooling the blackguard such that they don't overlap would only strengthen Destro's already strong melee train.

We are not discussing BG/Mara - Penril.

[Tesq]

I do agree with OP and would incline for the following changes :

Blade of Ruin : 2H required, 3sec CD, hate cost and damage maintained
Spitefull Slam : Shield required + require parry or block

That way 2H BG would catch up with other tanks in terms of CC.
SnB BG will also have a more reliable CC.

another problem is that put the KD on bor you bind the 2h too much to the left wing; fix the mid KD would be better because will allow you either focus on mid + left or right instead just mid/left with what ever weapon you want it became more a playstile choice for the third path if go 2h/s+b; potentially putting it on sor limit more the BG guys.
CD require 2h because you need some thing to make nice 2h or otherwise tank will all go with s+b but lock the 2h option to just that feel lazy.

[TenTonHammer]

I do agree with OP and would incline for the following changes :

Blade of Ruin : 2H required, 3sec CD, hate cost and damage maintained
Spitefull Slam : Shield required + require parry or block

That way 2H BG would catch up with other tanks in terms of CC.
SnB BG will also have a more reliable CC.

We can't have SS pric on parry for the same reason that BoR KD proc on parry

Giving either party access to x2 KDs is broken