State of IB

[PeterMore]

The idea of standarize 20sec buffs sounds good, 10sec,15sec, 20sec make a mess of timing for longer fights i agree. Specialy a combos like Taunt, armor debuff, nukedown, strength buff, brinding grudge, heavy blow and Earthshatter demand a lot of time if need to keep your oathfriend buff in addition + challanger and punt
So even using 2h IB is a choose between buff pump with some extras like snare or nukedown
or damage dealer. Imho.

Maybe needs to be tested properly, but Watch'learn 20sec + Told Ya So! Tactic + Rising Anger tactic dont feel to OP imho. Keep AP up of Slayer or BW its hard without Rune of Fury like a complement, but i can be wrong of course (not too much time to re-test this days).

Life is easier with IB arround you!

[Nefarian78]

Buffs at 20 seconds means being able to keep 3 oathfriends fully buffed with 100% uptime.

Without even going into the enormous balance problems of why having 2 slayers + a third target with 100% uptime of 25parry+ini and 10crit+str, you don't want to be able to do that either. Once you're able to do that, that is what's going to be expected of you, the entire class is going to be reduced to a pure buffbot because nothing else in your kit will even get close to the value add of 3 people fully buffed.

Ironbreaker has been in a weird spot since the GCD change and tedious to play at times because of it, however raising the duration of buffs to 20 seconds is not something you want if you're complaining about doing nothing but spamming buffs.

Now, if you make it so only 1 target can be affected by Oathbound and Ancestor's Fury then you have something solid in your hands.

[Farrul]

Buffs at 20 seconds means being able to keep 3 oathfriends fully buffed with 100% uptime.

Without even going into the enormous balance problems of why having 2 slayers + a third target with 100% uptime of 25parry+ini and 10crit+str, you don't want to be able to do that either. Once you're able to do that, that is what's going to be expected of you, the entire class is going to be reduced to a pure buffbot because nothing else in your kit will even get close to the value add of 3 people fully buffed.

Ironbreaker has been in a weird spot since the GCD change and tedious to play at times because of it, however raising the duration of buffs to 20 seconds is not something you want if you're complaining about doing nothing but spamming buffs.

Now, if you make it so only 1 target can be affected by Oathbound and Ancestor's Fury then you have something solid in your hands.

That's never going to happen realistically, 15 grudges each cast and all the piano related gameplay + normal tank duties the IB has to do, forget about having the time or grudges for it ( just a simple punt will cost 25 grugdes). The main issue of the IB is the time resource hence why 10s is obsolete, especially after the GCD nerf.

15s seconds would be fine though. As for balance related issues regarding slayer is a different topic, we all know slayer's and choppas need to be toned down but It is not IB balance related.

[Nefarian78]

That's never going to happen realistically, 15 grudges each cast and all the piano related gameplay + normal tank duties the IB has to do, forget about having the time or grudges for it ( just a simple punt will cost 25 grugdes). The main issue of the IB is the time resource hence why 10s is obsolete, especially after the GCD nerf.

15s seconds would be fine though. As for balance related issues regarding slayer is a different topic, we all know slayer's and choppas need to be toned down but It is not IB balance related.

I can already keep 2 oathfriends buffed up with over 80% uptime on a 10 second timer while still punting tanks for kills and use the rest of my kit. Plenty of the better IB players out there can do the same and better. Grudges are never and never will be an issue outside of pug scs as long as you run Dwarven Riposte, running both Riposte and Rising Anger trivializes the mechanic entirely and effectively renders it non-existent.

15 seconds is enough to keep 3 targets easily over the 80% uptime, which is still gamebreakingly overpowered. 20 seconds but applicable to only 1 target at a time is the best solution to free up GCDs without compromising balance whatsoever.

[PeterMore]

Buffs at 20 seconds means being able to keep 3 oathfriends fully buffed with 100% uptime.

Without even going into the enormous balance problems of why having 2 slayers + a third target with 100% uptime of 25parry+ini and 10crit+str, you don't want to be able to do that either. Once you're able to do that, that is what's going to be expected of you, the entire class is going to be reduced to a pure buffbot because nothing else in your kit will even get close to the value add of 3 people fully buffed.

Ironbreaker has been in a weird spot since the GCD change and tedious to play at times because of it, however raising the duration of buffs to 20 seconds is not something you want if you're complaining about doing nothing but spamming buffs.

Now, if you make it so only 1 target can be affected by Oathbound and Ancestor's Fury then you have something solid in your hands.

I have to desagree 99% with your comentator.

IB is a specific class that dance by necesity with a Oathfriend and simplyfy IB discarting buffs and use just 2 sound a solution for the type of game that you descrive, but in a game like ROR where meta recries Assist for focus in offesive and defensive aspect, is not value change the target of your Oathfriend to buff with Ancestors Fury while other groupmate is beeing focus for exemple. So why someone that know how this game is, should expect that?

IB has been in weird spot since GCD change, thats why this post show up with disscusion befor new balance patch show up.

Propose a nerf for Oathbound and Ancestor's Fury to limitate it to just 1 target and keep it 10 sec its something really far of balance omho.

[Bozzax]

Why is IB in a wierd spot? Miles ahead of tanks that lack a punt great syn with kniggit

As pointed out bf if you dont use all possible buff but focus most potent 2-3 for the situation this class is super strong in all situations provided you dont play a 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11, start over

So more potent buffs on several friendlies > All possible buffs on a friend
(hint no CDs)

[Nefarian78]

IB is definetely in a weird spot because it's difficult to justify IBs outside of double slayer groups and even then the SM is a more appealing choice for many, for both WB and 6v6 play.

However, it is certainly not a weak class in any way. IBs have had this weird pity party going on for years now because they haven't learned yet they don't need to use every buff all the time and asking the average RoR player to read the situation is asking for the moon.

[Farrul]

I can already keep 2 oathfriends buffed up with over 80% uptime on a 10 second timer while still punting tanks for kills and use the rest of my kit. Plenty of the better IB players out there can do the same and better. Grudges are never and never will be an issue outside of pug scs as long as you run Dwarven Riposte, running both Riposte and Rising Anger trivializes the mechanic entirely and effectively renders it non-existent.

15 seconds is enough to keep 3 targets easily over the 80% uptime, which is still gamebreakingly overpowered. 20 seconds but applicable to only 1 target at a time is the best solution to free up GCDs without compromising balance whatsoever.

Have fun with that and this sounds like a boast more than something realistic, 99% of the playerbase will never go through that struggle even if was possible so they re-rolled other tanks instead with better utility, also underplaying the duties of a tank which requires punting, snaring, cc, position awereness and then the annoying piano gameplay of the IB post GCD nerf. There just isn't enough time to do what you're saying whilst performing all the other tank duties competently.

With all things considered 15 seconds oath buffs would be balanced for the power that these buffs give and imho nowhere near overpowered. Dwarven riposte + rising anger wont be used thogeter as this means a big sacrifice of more important tactics, also imagine using up 2 tactics to fix what the mirror class get for free more or less, hence why IB quality of life buffs are overdue.

No grudge issues is assuming large scale combat where there is constant damage being taken, when grudges are typically available, but there are plenty of times in different situations when the mechanic matters and can't be utilized like that (BG is different because they got channel attack that generate a lot of hatred + rising anger equivalent for free).

[tazdingo]

plenty of people are capable of doing what he described. nothing wrong with having a difficult to play tank, the complexity of BO and SM's builder mechanic is always wildly overstated and both chosen and knight could be played by amoebas. tank as an archetype involves a lot of keybinds and juggling both targets, IB just takes that to a fun extreme

[Bozzax]

Nod SM and BO is by far the most one dimensional tank. You don't even have CC to time correctly (knigget, Chosen etc).

Ib near snare, disable immune super stronK!