After the nerf/patch SM's how are you.........

[UnspeakableOath]

seriously - no one ofu s is gonna let a class die - some of them just have to be revised.

Explain SW then.

[Aethilmar]

Are you sure about resist debuff stacking? It wasn't against a target dummy, and it shouldn't be, in my opinion.
WW reduces WoDS 5s CD. It's fine; some might say it was OP.

Going to have to go test it again. Maybe my methodology was not good.

If I was just fooling myself then, man, it just gets worse and worse.

Well, even if I was correct and it was, it certainly isn't now.

ED tooltip 437
ED base 326 (160 mitigated) on dummy
ED + WoH 418 (68 mitigated) on dummy
ED + WoH + HB 418 (68 mitigated) on dummy

So add they have turned one of our blade enchants back to fundamentally useless to the list. I says useless b/c I believe Knight will debuff 180-ish with no need to even proc so what is the point?

[Nekkma]

Are you sure about resist debuff stacking? It wasn't against a target dummy, and it shouldn't be, in my opinion.
WW reduces WoDS 5s CD. It's fine; some might say it was OP.

Going to have to go test it again. Maybe my methodology was not good.

If I was just fooling myself then, man, it just gets worse and worse.

Well, even if I was correct and it was, it certainly isn't now.

ED tooltip 437
ED base 326 (160 mitigated) on dummy
ED + WoH 418 (68 mitigated) on dummy
ED + WoH + HB 418 (68 mitigated) on dummy

So add they have turned one of our blade enchants back to fundamentally useless to the list. I says useless b/c I believe Knight will debuff 180-ish with no need to even proc so what is the point?

With the new patch and updated initiative scaling statsteal is alot worse as well. It's time to upgrade BO/SM shout/enchants. It was always stupid that knight/chosen passively provide more stats than BO/sm requiring a proc from hitting/beeing hit. Either they should stack or the numbers should be increased to something like double what it is now.

Edit: The linear scaling actually improves the defensive side of it so perhaps not a negative impact after all. Worse offensively, better defensively.

[Tuxedo013]

What about the only long distance st punt SM had for order side tanks that Is now brutaly butchered by making it Improved Stance + needing a tactic to make it work and even then it provides shity distance while BG needs only condition to have 100 hate?
Btw that was the only long distance punt available on order that was usefull even when it was block proc only!

[Aethilmar]

What about the only long distance st punt SM had for order side tanks that Is now brutaly butchered by making it Improved Stance + needing a tactic to make it work and even then it provides shity distance while BG needs only condition to have 100 hate?
Btw that was the only long distance punt available on order that was usefull even when it was block proc only!

Yeah. To be fair a Knight moon punt requires a tactic to be decent as well.

But another fun bit is with the new AP changes bot WoDS and HTL drain AP as expected. WoDS used to be able to be held through the full 20s time and now I run out of juice at 15 seconds (with 300 AP). HTL goes the full 12 seconds but drains my AP to basically zero. Meanwhile, over in Knight land thanks to Bellow Commands and Perseverance my crappy Conq knight never runs out of AP and can hold HTL basically the full 12 seconds without even moving the AP bar and rinse and repeat.

I know that this is the beginning of the balance changes but SM has just been ripped to pieces by all the changes while Knight has basically been untouched (and actually improved). I have no idea how hard IB has been hit or if it has been buffed. Even if it just has stayed the same, SM is most likely the worst Order tank again hands down.

[Fenris78]

If anything, all that wanted SM players was a ST punt. Nothing more, nothing less.

No idea why SM has been nerfed to the ground with all these unecessary changes ; the clas was far from overperforming, especially compared to other tanks (even BO), being group support or warband asset SM was only a WW bot and nothing much more.

Only thing that the class got slightly better was spirit damage with decent DPS, but still crappy survivability, in small group/solo roam, without much to bring other than personal "tankiness", with specific build (absorb tactic).

Now the class is not even good for keep attack, even before we often had to sacrifice M4 to use M1 jump instead, hoping quicklly disrupt backlines (assuming we didnt get CCed in the way on), and it still was a gambling move...

Yes, SM got a slight up to parry buff (still worse than Chosen, still not on-demand and shorter duration) and finally a remotely useable ST punt like KotBS, and a resist debuffing blade enchant.
But now SM is deprived from his main use in group (WW nerfed), his survivability with 2H build (WoDS still dont stack with other buffs, for reminder), and is now totally AP starved using his only channeling skills...

[Tyrodan]

Yes, SM got a slight up to parry buff (still worse than Chosen, still not on-demand and shorter duration) and finally a remotely useable ST punt like KotBS, and a resist debuffing blade enchant.
But now SM is deprived from his main use in group (WW nerfed), his survivability with 2H build (WoDS still dont stack with other buffs, for reminder), and is now totally AP starved using his only channeling skills...

And on top of it all the best order tank got buffed even further. At this point it is probably best to run 2 kotbs - 1 snb and 1 2H to get all the amazing utility kotbs offers.

Sorry but the balancing is seriously off.

[zgolec]

If anything, all that wanted SM players was a ST punt. Nothing more, nothing less.

No idea why SM has been nerfed to the ground with all these unecessary changes ; the clas was far from overperforming, especially compared to other tanks (even BO), being group support or warband asset SM was only a WW bot and nothing much more.

Only thing that the class got slightly better was spirit damage with decent DPS, but still crappy survivability, in small group/solo roam, without much to bring other than personal "tankiness", with specific build (absorb tactic).

Now the class is not even good for keep attack, even before we often had to sacrifice M4 to use M1 jump instead, hoping quicklly disrupt backlines (assuming we didnt get CCed in the way on), and it still was a gambling move...

Yes, SM got a slight up to parry buff (still worse than Chosen, still not on-demand and shorter duration) and finally a remotely useable ST punt like KotBS, and a resist debuffing blade enchant.
But now SM is deprived from his main use in group (WW nerfed), his survivability with 2H build (WoDS still dont stack with other buffs, for reminder), and is now totally AP starved using his only channeling skills...

This.

Add SW nerf to ground, WL nerf... Yeah. So fun to play elves. GG.

[Sever1n]

Stance required for punt should be removed. Its very hard to manage this combination with your other combos even mentally. 5 sec killed WoDS a lot, it was a signature skill of SM that provided most survival for 2h spec and let you build str. We dont have 100% parry like BG have, now 1 taunt and you completely open for death. WoDS was draining ap fast and it limited it well, but 5 sec nerf for no reason. Eagle fells good, but compared to nerf of ethetdance and wall better this patch didnt happen at all. Why ruin working class?

[akisnaakkeli]

Removing the block Kb from redirected force was a mistake imo,better would be remove the shield req and add parry/block. These new punts shouldnt require tactic to be somewhat good. BG now has Better WW and if they use 2h the super punt cooldown is automatically halved. All others require tactic except BG. Oh and they have 2h KD as well that didnt exist before RoR added it.

I mean BG has so much goods and they give WW to him as well? I dont even think WW belongs to destro side, but if it does then its obviously blorc. And goddamnit add back snb thc. Bg is only tank that gets Enraged beating as 5 pts skill. It used to have Blade of Rhuin that was deleted from the game, Enraged beating replaced it and new 9 pts skill was the 2h KD.

Oh and at the same time BG got Wall of darting steel as well=) That is the only thing that has been removed since super buffs to bg. Maybe rising anger core for IB at least pls? And snb thc black orc?