Last event

[arnoft]

I don`t like events much, I hate quests. But awards for Hexensnacht are awesome! Weapons models are great. When I saw the WL axe, I wanted to play for it again. Dead horses are fun too, more zombi mounts vs all those zoo escape! Thanks a lot!

[JohnnyWayne]

Connected to these events are always some themed SC events. And this one was terrible I'm afraid.

Its rare that I do not complete the SC events on characters I currrently equip. It happened on multiple characters this weekend. The lord kill achievement is only doable in a stomp and should be removed, imho. On order I did get next to no SC pops, as premades take priority over solo players where as the side that has less players gets its pugs thrown against premades nonstop. Technically building a premade on the more populated side is abuse of a broken match maker mechanism, and people abusing it are part of the problem, not the solution.

Please remove useless PVE objectives from the SC event list (they disturb the flow of SCs and leads to thrown games) and finally implement a well thought out SC / city queue match maker. I can help with that, I have experience with algorithmic optimization.

[Everdin]

Connected to these events are always some themed SC events. And this one was terrible I'm afraid.

Its rare that I do not complete the SC events on characters I currrently equip. It happened on multiple characters this weekend. The lord kill achievement is only doable in a stomp and should be removed, imho. On order I did get next to no SC pops, as premades take priority over solo players where as the side that has less players gets its pugs thrown against premades nonstop. Technically building a premade on the more populated side is abuse of a broken match maker mechanism, and people abusing it are part of the problem, not the solution.

Please remove useless PVE objectives from the SC event list (they disturb the flow of SCs and leads to thrown games) and finally implement a well thought out SC / city queue match maker. I can help with that, I have experience with algorithmic optimization.

I Agree on this, PVE content is difficult to archieve, after the first fight that often consume a little bit time, there is not enough time to complete the content before surrender. Either remove surrender for these events or the content that need too much time to finish.

[Lisutaris]

This event has some great design decisions and it's great that it is back for fashionhammer. 100% agreed.

offtopic discussion:

Spoiler:

Connected to these events are always some themed SC events. And this one was terrible I'm afraid.

Its rare that I do not complete the SC events on characters I currrently equip. It happened on multiple characters this weekend. The lord kill achievement is only doable in a stomp and should be removed, imho. On order I did get next to no SC pops, as premades take priority over solo players where as the side that has less players gets its pugs thrown against premades nonstop. Technically building a premade on the more populated side is abuse of a broken match maker mechanism, and people abusing it are part of the problem, not the solution.

Please remove useless PVE objectives from the SC event list (they disturb the flow of SCs and leads to thrown games) and finally implement a well thought out SC / city queue match maker. I can help with that, I have experience with algorithmic optimization.

As I can understand the frustration because of the very short surrender option/timer.
This "PVE Content" IS the objective in this scenario. If you just fight against each other for kills that's cool and everything but not what you are supposed to do in the Garden of Morr scenario.

You grab the item, try to kill or defend the 3 mini bosses and if you manage to get those 3 flags/objectives turned you spawn the vampire lord which pretty much grants you the scenario win.
It's the players fault to farm kills and not try to defend/kill the vampire lords WHILE doing pvp.

No, it does not need to be changed. For the event, maybe additional 2 minutes until surrendering is possible would have been nice, but that's pretty much it.
People need to learn/understand that scenarios are not about mindless killfarming but playing the objectives. Yes, sadly, some scenarios are more or less winable by just stomping, and yes, that should be changed

Long story short --- if ppl would try to kill those mini vampire bosses and take the fight there .... everyone would have been happy. But it's neither the scenarios fault (nor devs) that players are not doing that.

[nocturnalguest]

It's the players fault to farm kills and not try to defend/kill the vampire lords WHILE doing pvp.

Id argue its design fault, not players. Players group up and do most rewarding action to progress and its the kills. Win by scores is pointless if you didn't make enough kills. Kills >>> win in terms of both crests and rr

[arnoft]

In any case, despite the pain of the scenario, the result of the event is worth it.
I avoid PVE zones whenever possible, although they are coolly drawn and there is something to see. But crowds of mobs do not allow you to move normally, as mosquitoes swoop in from all sides. It would be nice to significantly reduce the spawn density.

[Everdin]

This event has some great design decisions and it's great that it is back for fashionhammer. 100% agreed.

offtopic discussion:

Spoiler:

Connected to these events are always some themed SC events. And this one was terrible I'm afraid.

Its rare that I do not complete the SC events on characters I currrently equip. It happened on multiple characters this weekend. The lord kill achievement is only doable in a stomp and should be removed, imho. On order I did get next to no SC pops, as premades take priority over solo players where as the side that has less players gets its pugs thrown against premades nonstop. Technically building a premade on the more populated side is abuse of a broken match maker mechanism, and people abusing it are part of the problem, not the solution.

Please remove useless PVE objectives from the SC event list (they disturb the flow of SCs and leads to thrown games) and finally implement a well thought out SC / city queue match maker. I can help with that, I have experience with algorithmic optimization.

As I can understand the frustration because of the very short surrender option/timer.
This "PVE Content" IS the objective in this scenario. If you just fight against each other for kills that's cool and everything but not what you are supposed to do in the Garden of Morr scenario.

You grab the item, try to kill or defend the 3 mini bosses and if you manage to get those 3 flags/objectives turned you spawn the vampire lord which pretty much grants you the scenario win.
It's the players fault to farm kills and not try to defend/kill the vampire lords WHILE doing pvp.

No, it does not need to be changed. For the event, maybe additional 2 minutes until surrendering is possible would have been nice, but that's pretty much it.
People need to learn/understand that scenarios are not about mindless killfarming but playing the objectives. Yes, sadly, some scenarios are more or less winable by just stomping, and yes, that should be changed

Long story short --- if ppl would try to kill those mini vampire bosses and take the fight there .... everyone would have been happy. But it's neither the scenarios fault (nor devs) that players are not doing that.

Unfortune there ist no way to avoid the enemy in this scenario. And fighting 2 groups with a few guys while the rest trying to kill a mob is not that easy, and the result will be an overall loss.

Scenarios are fights with extra tasks, or tasks with fighting, depending on your personel point of view.
If you ignore the fight or let your team alone, you propably will get crushed after them.
If you farm kills and ignore the tasks, you maybe will loose the sc. (Most of the time you will win through surrender)

The target should be to fight as long as needed to get enough space for the tasks, and what is very important: communicate about it.

[Lisutaris]

It's the players fault to farm kills and not try to defend/kill the vampire lords WHILE doing pvp.

Id argue its design fault, not players. Players group up and do most rewarding action to progress and its the kills. Win by scores is pointless if you didn't make enough kills. Kills >>> win in terms of both crests and rr

We could reduce renown gain from kills in scenarios to solve that issue *evil laughter* (maybe) Just kiddin'

[JohnnyWayne]

It's the players fault to farm kills and not try to defend/kill the vampire lords WHILE doing pvp.

Id argue its design fault, not players. Players group up and do most rewarding action to progress and its the kills. Win by scores is pointless if you didn't make enough kills. Kills >>> win in terms of both crests and rr

We could reduce renown gain from kills in scenarios to solve that issue *evil laughter* (maybe) Just kiddin'

A change of the reward structure should be part of the match maker redesign (together with transparency what roles and party sizes are in the "bucket" - as we should move away from the queue concept) to make balanced matches desireable for the players over stomps. Also, even though people hate it, old dwarfen road is pretty well designed from my standpoint. You can play tactically and avoid fights to win even if outmatched when the enemy is only going for kills. I think its the only SC that allows for that at the moment.

[nocturnalguest]

We could reduce renown gain from kills in scenarios to solve that issue *evil laughter* (maybe) Just kiddin'

Yeah most unpopular decision to make, no doubt. Im strongly against such path tbf.
However what if there would be something RR wise, like 3k+ RR (2k+50% bonus from warfront) per vamp kill to each person in sc for the realm which did most dmg to mob? I think that would force everyone to aim to kill them, so fights would be happening in the middle for a skull and then around mobs with mechanic to deny kill for the realm that didnt own a skull (if you dont have skull for your realm then you can heal mob), mobs would need to have some more abilities like cd increase/build up timer increase/60% snare/scary debuffing(dmging) puddles/etc. Would more fit PvEvP theme this SC has.

A change of the reward structure should be part of the match maker redesign (together with transparency what roles and party sizes are in the "bucket" - as we should move away from the queue concept) to make balanced matches desireable for the players over stomps. Also, even though people hate it, old dwarfen road is pretty well designed from my standpoint. You can play tactically and avoid fights to win even if outmatched when the enemy is only going for kills. I think its the only SC that allows for that at the moment.

ODR is a bad example, SCs need to promote fighting and not dodging. Avoiding fights is not playing tactically, its just PvEing PvP content, its an absolute no go imo, such shouldnt be happening in any SC, this need to go, its stupid, skillless and boring. To prevent stomps you either need to completely overhaul combat mechanics, archetypes, synergies, literally everything in this game (like introduce modern MMO style, remove roles, make every class able to selfsustain etc) or introduce somekind of SCs design mechanics which will allow that to happen (like Isha ball, but ball doesnt prevent stomps it allows for pretty equal teams to comeback after wipe when other realm takes flag, it will not anyhow prevent a total stomp, but imagine if there would be 3 balls for tank/dps/heal - it would make equal teams fight pretty chaotic and less skillful as losing side would have way too big advantage but on the other side if e.g. you put balls into spawn, untie it from flag cap but tie into k/d for realms it may prevent absolute stomps from happening).

Proper groups stomp pugs because by design its most rewarding thing to do - you get tons of RR and alot of crests doing so, way more then if you just win by objective. Hence groups ignore objectives and do the farming. That simple.

Imagine how many rewards have been in matches like those:
https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... ce47516edc
https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... bcc40860d7
https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 8d29bcd971