[Engineer] [Poll] Fixing the three worst tactics for T4

[Jaycub]

Rifleman should have armor penetration/PB mirror for some skills.

Any opinions on what the weakest tactics are? Are there any you don't use?

Stopping power is even worse than the AP tactic, it is a holdover from the days when there was no immunity timers. Like Glorian says, the AP tactics seem kind of redundant when compared to the AP turret tactic especially considering it effects everyone around you as well. I don't think anyone would care too much if those were reworked into something useful/niche.

[Glorian]

Yes to redundant AP Regeneration.
SW, SH, and magus have a mix of their tactics.
And somehow the Engineer ended up with 4 tactics to regenerate or spare AP.
SW and SH = 3
Magus = 2

[Sigimund]

Stopping power. Tiny KB is not worth a tactic and mastery point on a class that already has a better KB.

Extra powder. AOE is capped at 9 targets. Abilities affected are weak dots (acid flask is more a utility tbh)

My third tactic is a little different. I choose Well Oiled Machine. Not because it is bad but because it is nearly mandatory. Playing an engi/magus without WoM/CA is worse than playing a SM without sudden shift. Mythic agreed and were in the process of addressing this. It is pure quality of life and it should not cost a tactic.

[Penril]

I was talking with some friends a few minutes ago. We were discussing Trivial Blows not being implemented in RoR and i thought of something: what if TB was given to Engi/Magus?

Basically, change one of the horrible tactics mentioned in this thread to something like: "groupmates within 30ft of your turret will receive 25% less critical damage". Something like that. I know it is not perfect and some people will disagree with it; i'm just posting it anyway to see what you guys think or what changes would you do to it (30% less crit damage? increase range to 50ft? etc).

[peterthepan3]

Nice suggestion!

[Glorian]

Sounds great. Especially as crits are the bread and butter of T4.

[Sigimund]

I think it's a pretty good idea. The core problems of killing power and quality of life would still need to be addressed but that would make for a good tactic.

[Karast]

I was talking with some friends a few minutes ago. We were discussing Trivial Blows not being implemented in RoR and i thought of something: what if TB was given to Engi/Magus?

Basically, change one of the horrible tactics mentioned in this thread to something like: "groupmates within 30ft of your turret will receive 25% less critical damage". Something like that. I know it is not perfect and some people will disagree with it; i'm just posting it anyway to see what you guys think or what changes would you do to it (30% less crit damage? increase range to 50ft? etc).

It is not an awful idea, but the thing is that whatever tree you put it in, or even if you make it core, you just made it a must slot.

It is now the best tactic in the game and we have to run it in a group setting. To make the most out of it, you are also going to need to run WOM, and probably your going to have to run Extra Ammo as well for the AP.

So it would make tinker specs better, but not much beyond that.

Think about it at 25% or even 30% that is almost as effective as guard with no damage sharing, and it is group wide. People might actually start using Engi's as a tank. But to keep it up your will need to run like a tank and constantly redeploy to keep the buff up. If you are playing more melee with magnet in Tinker that can work.

But if you want to dps with either grenade or rifle it doesn't help you that much.

So while it helps the currently strong tree, it widens the gulf with the others.

I hated and loved TB on live. I hated it because you had to have it, and I loved it because it kept you alive. I would rather see us tone down the retarded mechanics and T4 stat explosion that caused the original problem that TB was designed to fix.

[Azarael]

I would rather see us tone down the retarded mechanics and T4 stat explosion that caused the original problem that TB was designed to fix.

This will be my aim as well, though I agree with the general principle of improving the static defensibility of Engi/Magus.

[Toldavf]

Being a defensive DPS won't see them taken in a 6 man much. On live all they ever did was focus on giving engine more and more utility and it never really compensated for a lack of killing power. The fact is that any engine that wants to DPS is stuffed for tactics as is so giving them more utility tactics seems like a step in the wrong direction to me.