Restored motivation tactic [DOK]

[footpatrol2]

This is for those who have forgotten.

The tactic can be found here. You have to scroll down alot to the dark rites spec section.
http://warhammeronline.wikia.com/wiki/D ... _abilities

This is a morale pump tactic.
The tactic reads as:
Restore essence will also grant 250 points of Morale to your ally.

This tactic was used to get dark rite Dok's to their morale 4's 1001 dark blessing which used to have a 30 sec duration, which can be found on that same website page.

The trick at the time was to run 2 dark rites dok's running that tactic and morale pump 1 of the dark rites dok's to reach their morale 4 very fast. Then you'd start the cycle.

You could have kept using the trick throughout the fight for 100% upkeep of 1001 dark blessings.

This is how Dark Elves racial group got their resistance/armor buff.

This was deemed too powerful at the time and taken away. It was thought of as a exploit by the community. I think it was by design for these racial groups.

High elves still maintain their morale pump trick with bolstering boon tactic. Below is a bolstering boon trick I was talking about in a high elf centric 12 man post.

Spoiler:

With a Easy tactic slot switch you can have 6 bolstering boon tactics slotted in this group set up. Thats potentially 1500 morale gain if hard casted Boon of Hysh. That takes 2 Sec's to get one SM or WL 1500 morale gain. The Vaul or Dps Am's can passively instant cast Boon of Hysh this due to their mechanic. So Dps/Vaul AM's are feeding 250 morale every 6th ability use. You don't need to just pump up one target with morale gain. You have options to split up the morale gain as you want too. Note:

Genisaurus wrote:
The morale bar is 3600 points.
You need 360, 720, 1800, and 3600 moral total for each level.
You generate 10 morale each second that you are in combat, base.


So You can take 3 AM's with bolstering boon tactic slotted Hard cast Boon of Hysh taking 2 sec's and 1 of your SM's will have Wings of heaven. Just things to think on... Think about all the combo's you could do... It takes about 4 or 5 sec's too get a single character 3000 morale which is almost to his morale 4 ability. If you guys still want to dismiss what I'm saying...

[Shadowgurke]

I know that in your limited world it is super unfair that DE groups have no way to get armor and resistance. In this game you have 3 races per realm and you can COMBINE them. You know what that means? The moral can be up 100% in MIXED groups. You know the fun part about morals? They stack with Chosen resistance buff.

The devs can't balance the morale around your racial bullshit

[footpatrol2]

This is not just my racial bullshit...

This is a trick that was straight up lost to the destruction side of the game... so shove it.

Order still maintains their morale boosting trick.

[Shadowgurke]

I assume you are talking about AM bolstering boon?

It's not that good, really. Besides you would have to play AM/WP then, hence not getting 100% uptime. Also Destro has their Tanks to push M4 really fast

[footpatrol2]

Thats 100% not the same and not a really good argument.

bolstering boon in the current meta might be percieved as under-rated. But like so many other things it could be incredibly powerful and overlooked.

The morale booster was a single target morale booster to ANYONE. 100% not the same as tanks having quick access to morale 4's. What morale 1 through 4 do you want to to start off the fight with on basically any class on order?

Saying that destro can get their tanks up to morale 4 quickly isn't the same as single target boosting a morale done extremely fast. I know in your limited perspective that bolster boon might look lackluster because your focusing on 6 man thinking. If your running a 12 man mixed you can get 1000 morale in 2 sec's with hard casting boon with 4 AM's healing spec or not. What morale's would you like to start the fight off with?

This game is about to enter t4. This game is going to blow back up with competitive players that have participated in 12 mans. You might not think that the 12 man meta existed but I know it did and there is a very real chance it will come back. I'm already seeing double premades... Its just a knock on the door for it to be 12.

I'm not saying there should be equality on each side because there isn't. But both order and destro used to have access to single target boosting of morale and could be done very very fast.

One side doesn't now.

Spoiler:

Order had the same tricks that could have been done with the runepriest with mountain spirit being 30 sec duration (I can pull up the website if you want) and kotbs aura's. Which is roughly the same as a chosen and Dok's 1001 blessing trick. But Oh god you can't have a WP in the group. Everything ruined now. Premade groups with 2 RP in it as healers can't win against anything...

Spoiler:

I think this game was balanced on racial groups originally. It all points in that direction. It never caught on. Cool. If your going to redesign this game for mixed, cool. It might be important to know why the hell things were put there to begin with, so you have a better understanding of the original designer.

Knowing the structure of how a house is built might be important before you start knocking down walls, and redesigning things.

[Tesq]

that tactic removed from the dok showed that classes originally were suppose to be cross mirrored even by race pairings and not only by cross classing, it's a shame.

it's also a shame the old renown system got lost, there were a tons of differents options which would had allowed more ppl to play in the way they liked with out being penalized, never liked the new renown system....
I really liked war for the renown system and i would had like more diversity in spec; sadly that never was the case.

[Vayra]

Yeah, I miss being able to pump 1001DB and cycle them throughout the fight. I would really like 1001DB to be returned to 30s duration, as IMO the nerf to 10s was totally unnecessary (though the morale gain tactic can come back or not, idc much either way).

[Shadowgurke]

Of course, like everything in the entire game the tactic is magically super strong just nobody actually tested it. You are so focused on gimmicky ideas that you completely forget the big picture.
Let's do the math: 250 Moral on a 2s cast. 3600 for ANY M4. Requires 15 total casts, so 4 heals per healer. Meaning 8 seconds where they are basically do nothing but boost Morale. Of a single target. In a 12v12. You would assume at that point half your people already died.
I'm just assuming you didn't test this before because nothing you post is tested in any way, the Moral push just does not work out of combat.
So in reality, you can't have all healers boost the morale of a single target. Even half your healers would mean that you are risking people to die. You know the fun part about 4 AMs? You have no WP. Good luck healing all the damage, especially AoE.

Is any M4 in the game better than tank M4? Yes. Is Tank M4 still probably the best M4 to get? Probably. Imagine that for your **** to work you have 4 badly specced AMs just to get 1 person up to M4. In the same time, Destro can counter whatever Moral you are using with 4 Tank M4s. Without gimping their setup or specs.

I know you can come up with a setup that crucially relies on a single M4 works with 2 different gameplans, a backline a frontline a supporting backline and WLs jumping around. I don't even care at this point, any theorycrafting, regardless of how lackluster, is better than nothing. But please stay out of balance discussions.

[footpatrol2]

I didn't say the AM's had to be healing. I didn't say you have to use morale 4's.

Your just making assumptions all over the place...

Bring 2 healing AM's and 2 of your precious WP's for your healing and bring 2 Dps Am's for a total of 4 AM's sloted with bolstering boon tactic.

I said what morale's do you want to start the fight off with 1 thru 4.

Lets do the math.
It takes 2 sec's to give one player 1000 morale near instant access to your morale 1 or 2.
it takes 4 sec's to give one player 2000 morale access to your morale 3
it takes 6 sec's to give one player 3000 morale close to your morale 4

You have GCD timers in there also so its slightly longer.

Your Dps am's are trash healing/morale pumping something with every 6th ability use for 500 morale throughout the fight.

Do I have to go through the entire list of morale 1 thru 3 on order side that could be useful in the beginning of a fight. Plus access to early morale 4 if desired say within a minute...you have options. This is in addition to passively feeding players morale throughout the fight.

Example: feed a kotbs to his morale 4 solar flare to strip the opposition's healers from access to Divine intervention and focused mind. Go ask a healer how important those morale's are for them.

While your picking up bolstering boon tactic you also can spend 1 easy point for marsh so you have kiting access on your side and debuffing resistence/initiative type for your AM's.

And how do you know I haven't tested this stuff out? I ran high elf groups for years. I was only able to get it to the 6 man level because of the lack of player interest and ran 3 AM's in one group with this tactic slotted before. I couldn't get higher then a 6 man, mainly due to the pigeon hole advice given by the community. This fear of failing is retarded and unproductive. Just because you fail 5 times at something doesn't make it bad. It means you haven't learned the tricks needed to conduct the playstyle.

Have you actually even tried what I'm talking about? Or are you just trying to countery-theory craft argue with me for the sake of argument. I'm sorry that I think differently then the rest of the community and it might annoy you.

Anything that has the potential to knocks the WP off their throne is a good thing from a balance perspective.

I really hope you don't join the balance forums with your stale perspective of the game.

[Sizer]

Yea, except that people didnt use it for racial groups, and wouldnt if it was put back. Theyd use it to make 2 dok 2 mara 2 tank groups even more dominant. Which is the exact opposite direction this game is going to be heading. It doesnt matter what you argue about the racial premades you dream about. Its not going to happen.

On a slightly off topic note, seeing how it isnt mirrored anymore, I wouldnt mind the AM one going either. Because if they get buffed to viable levels a 2 am exommunicate premade will become way too common.