Nerfed Buttons

[Foofighter]

yes ok, made it sound like 100% non chance to win, let me say it like this, the fact you dont have to click enables you to focus so much on the positioning and other things people have mentioned nerfed buttons does nothing for, exept wait for the exact moment these things happen. But you also get what i meant, it's not a rock paper scissor, just more, i had to play this game for 2 years before i really got the gist of the whole thing, then comes along a sorc with perfect rotations ( nerfed buttons) and procedes to destroy me in every keep encounter orvr, sc premades, where is the fun in that, that is what i mean

[Foofighter]

when i say 2 years it's learning the basic and some more complex stuff about all the classes, before some of you rip apart my whole argument just because of that

[Nekkma]

yes ok, made it sound like 100% non chance to win, let me say it like this, the fact you dont have to click enables you to focus so much on the positioning and other things people have mentioned nerfed buttons does nothing for, exept wait for the exact moment these things happen. But you also get what i meant, it's not a rock paper scissor, just more, i had to play this game for 2 years before i really got the gist of the whole thing, then comes along a sorc with perfect rotations ( nerfed buttons) and procedes to destroy me in every keep encounter orvr, sc premades, where is the fun in that, that is what i mean

I do not want to sound harsh but you kind of proves the point about using NB as an excuse for losing. Sorc/BW burst rotation is quite easy and do not require NB to "perfect" for the average player. Also, you still need to click or press a hotkey to fire of each ability while using NB.

[Zealote]

Im sorry but if your are complaining about NB like the op and many others do its not because they go undefeated, its because they suffered a defeat and looked for a reason, its far easier to blame something you cannot control then to look at yourself and what you done wrong, whether they say this is the reason or not, its a whine, you dont see the more experience and better players calling for a NB ban, you see the weaker and less experienced players calling for a ban, dont get me wrong not hating, been there myself i use to spam csr reports back on live when i was new to the game purely because i didnt understand the game or i listened to hearsay.

I thought my point was clear but in case there was a genuine miscommunication, I'll re-phrase it: there are other people in this thread expressing their dislike of NB and/or their belief that it should be altered/removed, who (to me) clearly aren't doing so because they're "crying" about losing. In other words: it's a complete waste of time for you to keep assuming that that's the primary/only issue people have with it, and attacking that, while ignoring the other more reasonable points/arguments put forward by others.

As far as other addons, target ring and buffhead prolly play a bigger part because they allow you to see player icons behind things like buildings/keep walls etc etc, same for any addon that allows you to mark your guarded target and have the range so you dont stray 1ft out of range, its just easier to jump on the bandwagon and complain about something more commonly hated.

Firstly, again with the assumptions, this time that people are just "jump[ing] on the bandwagon". I know it's easier to disregard others' views if you paint them as inexperienced/uninformed/whining etc, but since that doesn't apply to everyone (unless you believe it's also true of Lileldys, Azarael, Natherul, Saupreusse, ...), it's not actually getting us anywhere.

I happen to disagree that those other addons you mention are comparable to NB's condition-checking (see my previous reply to you for why), but there's a more general point here, I think: someone might feasibly have issues with those addons in addition to NB, there doesn't need to be a dichotomy, and it doesn't mean that NB can't or shouldn't be discussed.

I play on a laptop with no mouse, using the touchpad, to save myself keys, 3 keys on my shaman, 2 keys on my choppa, 4 keys on my bw, 2 keys on my kotbs i use NB AND its it makes me do things like using an extra gcd to apply the same dot twice, having to reloadui mid fight as my key with cleanse(that also has shrug it off on the same key) has bugged out and i can no longer cleanse stuff, sure it helps me but it is also a pain in the ass.

None of which seems to support your assertion that it's impossible --without a gaming mouse (or 3 hands)-- to have enough keys to play without it. Maybe it's a l2keybind issue for you/Jail/anyone else having the same issue (which is actually understandable, it did take me a bit of effort to come up with enough keys for IB/BG and get comfortable with them).

..........

@ People saying it's only the 'pros' who are against it being removed: I did notice that pattern myself, but I don't think it's helpful to keep pressing the point since it just provides ammunition for anyone who doesn't want to see NB changed/removed ("you're only against it cos you're bad/upset about losing/etc" ad nauseam); probably more effective to look at the arguments themselves.

[Luicetarro]

If the majority of the team is against it, just disable it. I don't mind seeing it disabled in general.

All I'm asking is:
What do you gain by disabling it? And what do you loose?

[Akalukz]

as an average bad player. It would be awesome if you killed NB... I use it for cast sequence, but don't have to. I would love if you could keep some sort of cast sequence, and kill the conditionals. But i would gladly play without cast sequence if conditionals were killed in all addons

[Morf]

Spoiler:

Im sorry but if your are complaining about NB like the op and many others do its not because they go undefeated, its because they suffered a defeat and looked for a reason, its far easier to blame something you cannot control then to look at yourself and what you done wrong, whether they say this is the reason or not, its a whine, you dont see the more experience and better players calling for a NB ban, you see the weaker and less experienced players calling for a ban, dont get me wrong not hating, been there myself i use to spam csr reports back on live when i was new to the game purely because i didnt understand the game or i listened to hearsay.

I thought my point was clear but in case there was a genuine miscommunication, I'll re-phrase it: there are other people in this thread expressing their dislike of NB and/or their belief that it should be altered/removed, who (to me) clearly aren't doing so because they're "crying" about losing. In other words: it's a complete waste of time for you to keep assuming that that's the primary/only issue people have with it, and attacking that, while ignoring the other more reasonable points/arguments put forward by others.

As far as other addons, target ring and buffhead prolly play a bigger part because they allow you to see player icons behind things like buildings/keep walls etc etc, same for any addon that allows you to mark your guarded target and have the range so you dont stray 1ft out of range, its just easier to jump on the bandwagon and complain about something more commonly hated.

Firstly, again with the assumptions, this time that people are just "jump[ing] on the bandwagon". I know it's easier to disregard others' views if you paint them as inexperienced/uninformed/whining etc, but since that doesn't apply to everyone (unless you believe it's also true of Lileldys, Azarael, Natherul, Saupreusse, ...), it's not actually getting us anywhere.

I happen to disagree that those other addons you mention are comparable to NB's condition-checking (see my previous reply to you for why), but there's a more general point here, I think: someone might feasibly have issues with those addons in addition to NB, there doesn't need to be a dichotomy, and it doesn't mean that NB can't or shouldn't be discussed.

I play on a laptop with no mouse, using the touchpad, to save myself keys, 3 keys on my shaman, 2 keys on my choppa, 4 keys on my bw, 2 keys on my kotbs i use NB AND its it makes me do things like using an extra gcd to apply the same dot twice, having to reloadui mid fight as my key with cleanse(that also has shrug it off on the same key) has bugged out and i can no longer cleanse stuff, sure it helps me but it is also a pain in the ass.

None of which seems to support your assertion that it's impossible --without a gaming mouse (or 3 hands)-- to have enough keys to play without it. Maybe it's a l2keybind issue for you/Jail/anyone else having the same issue (which is actually understandable, it did take me a bit of effort to come up with enough keys for IB/BG and get comfortable with them).

..........

@ People saying it's only the 'pros' who are against it being removed: I did notice that pattern myself, but I don't think it's helpful to keep pressing the point since it just provides ammunition for anyone who doesn't want to see NB changed/removed ("you're only against it cos you're bad/upset about losing/etc" ad nauseam); probably more effective to look at the arguments themselves.

I cant be bothered to address all your points, mainly because you wont listen anyway, i will still be the guy you dislike so let me address 1 thing, dont list ppl as if they are against my comments and as if i am directing comments towards them, its a snide move(no surprise).

Bottom line is this, can NB help you ? yes, can NB hinder you ? yes, are there other addons that can play as big or a bigger part in certain situations ? yes, does NB play the game for you ? NO.

Like some have said go ahead and remove it as it will be interesting to see what the next excuse is when they lose.

And let me add these ppl you listed are not making NB threads or die and claim "cheat", thats the difference.

[Tiggo]

NB provides an advantage to the players using it vs. players not using it,.

that counts for ANY addon isnt it? so kill lua...

[sullemunk]

NB provides an advantage to the players using it vs. players not using it,.

that counts for ANY addon isnt it? so kill lua...

I'm using the RayCharles addon, that turns the whole screen black, so i am handicaping myself in a sense..

[LordTercept]

I'm still rather new to the RoR community so I can't speak to NB's use on the current private server. However, my reaction to when the add-on was released on live was that it would be game breaking. Luckily in practice I found the following to be true:

First, most of the talented players on my server chose not to use NB for various reasons. Some felt it was unfair, others didn't want or need an add-on to prioritize abilities for them. This led to an overall culture on my server that the best players didn't use NB, which had good trickle down effect to other players on the server.

Second, most of the people that were using NB lacked skill in other areas of PvP that NB could not compensate for, such as positional awareness for example.

Imo, NB can make an bad player look decent, but it will never make a decent player great.