Permanent Realm Lockouts

[Glorian]

You have missed:

BT (EU order 18dwarfs/wb)
Only once a week, but we dont loged off when the Order Zerg dissappeared from Reikland last Thursday.

[flintboth]

RoR is a guild game more than a Realm game like it was, many of the RvR mechanics work for that.
For sure, players who want to stay and can stay, most of the time, are Guild players first, in majority, but some solo and casual (open wb) keep staying.
This is true for the T4 more than to the others Tiers.

I m ok for a lock timer (6 or 8 hours, because this is the time needed, curently, to have a real confrontation for one map control) not for a permanent Realm lockout.

[lastalien]

Spoiler:

Wam creating zerg yet gloating about fighting like underdog... 5/10

nice bait but

Nah mate... I could do that all the time if i wanted to enforce that win at all costs playstyle (but it would be boring and make even more PVD which some people seem to enjoy but i don't) I only created a counter zerg (which was still smaller) we got halfed wipe a couple times then fully wipe order... then they disappear thats not a gloat thats a fact and I was disappointed because lack of fights, lack of defending reik keep from order = lack of fun.

The thing most people fail to understand/realise is order's playstyle / traditional tactic of balling up if they lose a couple fights (zerging) forces destro to adapt or die (and counter zerg... there might be occasions when destro starts real zerging first and force order to do the same but its usually only a counter measure)

If you can't beat them Just Zerg up... (no matter their number) order would do it to us TUP when we are just 6-12... and bring 2-3 wbs'... 48+ people vs 12... a bit excessive dont you think? but we always fought on

Order do it to phalanx...

Order do it to even our pug wb's usually lead by Ocara...

Instead of work on fighting, tactics and improving, the answer was 9 times out of ten to bring more people to a fight (and cannons)... Look what happens when order can't outnumber destro by a huge amount and the zone population is even... Its not a gloat just I can't remember the last time order locked a zone in prime time with TUP & Phalanx in zone and numbers being even. I remember multiple times when Destro have taken zones where they have lost both keeps and reset it.

Look what happens when destro get tired of such ways and counter it (like i did... I stopped us getting wiped us a 12 man vs multiple organised wb's... I reluctantly opened wb up just to fight fire with fire and for the realm / protecting pugs (i have done on one other occasion to lock KV... when similar happend 3 organised wb's blobbing up) Usually I would just work more closley with Phalanx if they was around and it was needed / called for (but we both have our own identity and look for our own fights instead of hand hold)

Your entitled to play whatever play style way you want (without exploiting) but actions always have reactions...

so in less than a hour from order being dominant almost zone locked to non existent... (they had numbers in the zone just no co operation/morale/will to fight besides 2 FG's who tried in vain (despite 50+ in zone) you would expect more resistance)

So I chose to play lower RR and geared class on the enemy side / underdog side to stimulate some fun/action... The problem is most people who Quit their own or main side... when they percieve it to be losing then swap to the other side creating a snowball effect... spoiling the balance/game and riding other people's coatails...

I don't think there is anyway to balance people who quit / give up fighting because they are losing as there is no way to police that criteria... (if you try incentive increase rewards for losers/defenders... people will exploit it by not defending and throw zones more than they already do just for roll at loot bags... if you try to encourage people to fight harder by rewarding attackers, more fairweather people will swap sides to winning side just for the loot)

In a ideal world the community would police itself better on such issues and not create snowball effect... but the world isn't ideal and a large portion of people like to take shortcuts (prime example all the people who felt the need to exploit and got banned for it on private server)

I think even if city sieges got introduced at some point... Xrealming will still be a issue(because loot and lack of realm loyalty) I think sometimes Xrealming is needed, sometimes its exaggerated, sometimes its abused... it is part of the game. Even Temporary 6 hour lock out would fix xrealming a little on accounts like mine (which do it to produce fights)... but if people really want to x realm = make one order / one destro account each.

I think more consistant / active / organised pug leaders is only way to reduce xrealming (good luck with that thankless task)... leaders both sides rally behind / loyalty / support and you will always have people who game the system no matter what.

It seems to me that if we remove or reduce the influence of morals on the battle, it would increase the duration of the fighting and increase the interest of the participants.

For understanding, I'm not interested in playing with Phalanxes or TUPs when a moral bomb is used, and this is the main thing that they use.

On the topic, a small loсk for a day would be enough.

[Glorian]

Spoiler:

Wam creating zerg yet gloating about fighting like underdog... 5/10

nice bait but

Nah mate... I could do that all the time if i wanted to enforce that win at all costs playstyle (but it would be boring and make even more PVD which some people seem to enjoy but i don't) I only created a counter zerg (which was still smaller) we got halfed wipe a couple times then fully wipe order... then they disappear thats not a gloat thats a fact and I was disappointed because lack of fights, lack of defending reik keep from order = lack of fun.

The thing most people fail to understand/realise is order's playstyle / traditional tactic of balling up if they lose a couple fights (zerging) forces destro to adapt or die (and counter zerg... there might be occasions when destro starts real zerging first and force order to do the same but its usually only a counter measure)

If you can't beat them Just Zerg up... (no matter their number) order would do it to us TUP when we are just 6-12... and bring 2-3 wbs'... 48+ people vs 12... a bit excessive dont you think? but we always fought on

Order do it to phalanx...

Order do it to even our pug wb's usually lead by Ocara...

Instead of work on fighting, tactics and improving, the answer was 9 times out of ten to bring more people to a fight (and cannons)... Look what happens when order can't outnumber destro by a huge amount and the zone population is even... Its not a gloat just I can't remember the last time order locked a zone in prime time with TUP & Phalanx in zone and numbers being even. I remember multiple times when Destro have taken zones where they have lost both keeps and reset it.

Look what happens when destro get tired of such ways and counter it (like i did... I stopped us getting wiped us a 12 man vs multiple organised wb's... I reluctantly opened wb up just to fight fire with fire and for the realm / protecting pugs (i have done on one other occasion to lock KV... when similar happend 3 organised wb's blobbing up) Usually I would just work more closley with Phalanx if they was around and it was needed / called for (but we both have our own identity and look for our own fights instead of hand hold)

Your entitled to play whatever play style way you want (without exploiting) but actions always have reactions...

so in less than a hour from order being dominant almost zone locked to non existent... (they had numbers in the zone just no co operation/morale/will to fight besides 2 FG's who tried in vain (despite 50+ in zone) you would expect more resistance)

So I chose to play lower RR and geared class on the enemy side / underdog side to stimulate some fun/action... The problem is most people who Quit their own or main side... when they percieve it to be losing then swap to the other side creating a snowball effect... spoiling the balance/game and riding other people's coatails...

I don't think there is anyway to balance people who quit / give up fighting because they are losing as there is no way to police that criteria... (if you try incentive increase rewards for losers/defenders... people will exploit it by not defending and throw zones more than they already do just for roll at loot bags... if you try to encourage people to fight harder by rewarding attackers, more fairweather people will swap sides to winning side just for the loot)

In a ideal world the community would police itself better on such issues and not create snowball effect... but the world isn't ideal and a large portion of people like to take shortcuts (prime example all the people who felt the need to exploit and got banned for it on private server)

I think even if city sieges got introduced at some point... Xrealming will still be a issue(because loot and lack of realm loyalty) I think sometimes Xrealming is needed, sometimes its exaggerated, sometimes its abused... it is part of the game. Even Temporary 6 hour lock out would fix xrealming a little on accounts like mine (which do it to produce fights)... but if people really want to x realm = make one order / one destro account each.

I think more consistant / active / organised pug leaders is only way to reduce xrealming (good luck with that thankless task)... leaders both sides rally behind / loyalty / support and you will always have people who game the system no matter what.

It seems to me that if we remove or reduce the influence of morals on the battle, it would increase the duration of the fighting and increase the interest of the participants.

For understanding, I'm not interested in playing with Phalanxes or TUPs when a moral bomb is used, and this is the main thing that they use.

On the topic, a small loсk for a day would be enough.

I second that. I'm so totally uninterested in a wb fight where the one wins who has their raze ready earliest and drops it en Masse.

At locks even a one hour lock is enough. This will most likely not bring you to have a second account but prevents instant hopping to the other side.

[Aurandilaz]

Spoiler:

Wam creating zerg yet gloating about fighting like underdog... 5/10

nice bait but

Nah mate... I could do that all the time if i wanted to enforce that win at all costs playstyle (but it would be boring and make even more PVD which some people seem to enjoy but i don't) I only created a counter zerg (which was still smaller) we got halfed wipe a couple times then fully wipe order... then they disappear thats not a gloat thats a fact and I was disappointed because lack of fights, lack of defending reik keep from order = lack of fun.

The thing most people fail to understand/realise is order's playstyle / traditional tactic of balling up if they lose a couple fights (zerging) forces destro to adapt or die (and counter zerg... there might be occasions when destro starts real zerging first and force order to do the same but its usually only a counter measure)

If you can't beat them Just Zerg up... (no matter their number) order would do it to us TUP when we are just 6-12... and bring 2-3 wbs'... 48+ people vs 12... a bit excessive dont you think? but we always fought on

Order do it to phalanx...

Order do it to even our pug wb's usually lead by Ocara...

Instead of work on fighting, tactics and improving, the answer was 9 times out of ten to bring more people to a fight (and cannons)... Look what happens when order can't outnumber destro by a huge amount and the zone population is even... Its not a gloat just I can't remember the last time order locked a zone in prime time with TUP & Phalanx in zone and numbers being even. I remember multiple times when Destro have taken zones where they have lost both keeps and reset it.

Look what happens when destro get tired of such ways and counter it (like i did... I stopped us getting wiped us a 12 man vs multiple organised wb's... I reluctantly opened wb up just to fight fire with fire and for the realm / protecting pugs (i have done on one other occasion to lock KV... when similar happend 3 organised wb's blobbing up) Usually I would just work more closley with Phalanx if they was around and it was needed / called for (but we both have our own identity and look for our own fights instead of hand hold)

Your entitled to play whatever play style way you want (without exploiting) but actions always have reactions...

so in less than a hour from order being dominant almost zone locked to non existent... (they had numbers in the zone just no co operation/morale/will to fight besides 2 FG's who tried in vain (despite 50+ in zone) you would expect more resistance)

So I chose to play lower RR and geared class on the enemy side / underdog side to stimulate some fun/action... The problem is most people who Quit their own or main side... when they percieve it to be losing then swap to the other side creating a snowball effect... spoiling the balance/game and riding other people's coatails...

I don't think there is anyway to balance people who quit / give up fighting because they are losing as there is no way to police that criteria... (if you try incentive increase rewards for losers/defenders... people will exploit it by not defending and throw zones more than they already do just for roll at loot bags... if you try to encourage people to fight harder by rewarding attackers, more fairweather people will swap sides to winning side just for the loot)

In a ideal world the community would police itself better on such issues and not create snowball effect... but the world isn't ideal and a large portion of people like to take shortcuts (prime example all the people who felt the need to exploit and got banned for it on private server)

I think even if city sieges got introduced at some point... Xrealming will still be a issue(because loot and lack of realm loyalty) I think sometimes Xrealming is needed, sometimes its exaggerated, sometimes its abused... it is part of the game. Even Temporary 6 hour lock out would fix xrealming a little on accounts like mine (which do it to produce fights)... but if people really want to x realm = make one order / one destro account each.

I think more consistant / active / organised pug leaders is only way to reduce xrealming (good luck with that thankless task)... leaders both sides rally behind / loyalty / support and you will always have people who game the system no matter what.

It seems to me that if we remove or reduce the influence of morals on the battle, it would increase the duration of the fighting and increase the interest of the participants.

For understanding, I'm not interested in playing with Phalanxes or TUPs when a moral bomb is used, and this is the main thing that they use.

On the topic, a small loсk for a day would be enough.

uh no?
You realize morals are up once a minute, but both TUP and Phalanx keep killing stuff whether or not morales are ready to be dumped? Sure, morales can be extremely handy at close quarters keep fighting with massives wbs on both sides attempting to the do moral dump that helps winning the fight, orderside LNM and CNTK are just as good at organizing morale dumps.
I would personally estimate that less than 10% of TUP wb kills are from morale bombs.

And your 24 h lock suggestion.... wtf. So you would get one side zerging one day with most likely no opposition as they switched to the other side for that day, and then maybe reverse the zerg the next day because people are then locked to the other side?

You do also realize that a lot of people switch from different realm tiers to different realm tiers, say from T4 destro to Order T3, or from Order T1 to destro T4, all according to moods or where they might find more interesting action. There are other things to do than zerging T4 around the clock and doing it for the realm.

No lockout timers allows undisturbed population balanced to occur, and if you create barriers to that, suddenly you start noticing how imbalanced the game population can get, as people are suddenly locked to one side. Even if they are locked to one side, it would not guarantee that there will be enough heroes in your current tier to defend the realm. But it will surely prevent the guys from the same tier to switching side to balance the numbers.

[Nycta]

A limited time lock-out if it is to help with the game's development and improve the overall experience yes, but to stop players from enjoying both realms (even though I detest the Order side for aesthetic reasons mostly!) is needless, the very least. There is only one server, reality is to be considered as well sometimes..

[lastalien]

uh no?
You realize morals are up once a minute, but both TUP and Phalanx keep killing stuff whether or not morales are ready to be dumped? Sure, morales can be extremely handy at close quarters keep fighting with massives wbs on both sides attempting to the do moral dump that helps winning the fight, orderside LNM and CNTK are just as good at organizing morale dumps.
I would personally estimate that less than 10% of TUP wb kills are from morale bombs.

There is some experience, not a theory. Based on this experience, I concluded.
Moral bombs kill the front, or the most dangerous opponents, or those who are comfortable. In any case for the opponent, this is already a critical loss, which is almost always impossible to win back in a concrete battle if the forces are relatively equal.

[Fractus]

The only people who don't like morales are those who are not working as part of a team, that is so coordinated they can even use morales properly. Join a leader who understands it works and a team that works so well together they can beat bigger numbers with more than just standard abilities, but also use synergies and morales, the real rush is beating bigger numbers with more skilled coordination.

Using morales is the only way to beat bigger numbers than your own, its greater engagement as a team and is rewarding those who are more organised, this is also used in 6 mans in Scenarios i might add.

I'd like to add all those wb's i listed, both destro and order use morales well, both offensive and defensive.

[Hellcon]

Permanent realm lockouts isnt the right way an option but not the right way. For my opinion you need to punish the xrealmer with no getin' any loot or roll. If they log out with the toon they have maybe 5 mins to log back in with it or they get no rr, inf.,Medallions and they are out of the Rollsystem (i hope you understand what i mean). If someone had a dc they may need no 5 mins to log back in but who knows. That would help alot against that xrealmer because they switch the realm only for rewards.

[lastalien]

Spoiler:

I'd like to add all those wb's i listed, both destro and order use morales well.

Old question. Destro have raze - 15 sek, Order have BW 2nd - same, but tank not a BW. This question not for this topic.