Fortress siege + gold bag rolling feedback.

[drmordread]

If you want to make BiS hard to get, then why is it so easy for defenders? Just sit in Lord room and guaranteed a win. Sit on 3rd floor and spam AoE attacks and heals and you have a chance to win a bag.

Attackers are doing all the work, and rightly so, they should. And I understand the concept of "you did not kill lord you do not get gold bag." BUT ...

1- continue artillery barrage/stronger lord mechanic from stage 2 into stage 3. I do not think this occurs. If it already does, then it really is not having that much effect on defenders.
2- A 3% or 5% increase in Block/Parry/Disrupt/Dodge per flag held (max 15% or 25%) to controlling realm. Keep the flags a viable option in stage 3.

[Marocus]

Clearly I see the way this all works differently to most....

If the attackers hold all the CPs the Lord is very vulnerable-One successful push into the Lord room by the attacking force is likely game over with the Lord getting killed.

I think the reason it all feels unfair is we are doing it wrong.
Stage 1-Get organised into grouped warbands and assign responsibilities-This is while we are waiting for the first door to fall which is on a timer.

Stage 2- Enter and hold the flags as attackers. Defenders should be trying also to hold the flags as when the attackers have them the door is taking damage.

Stage 3- Prison for defenders comes into play. Attackers should be whittling down defender numbers and imprisoning them and forcing them to over extend by threatening the Lord. If the Flags/CP are held by the defence the Lord will be too strong to kill. If they are held by the attackers he will be like wet paper.

I've taken part in attacks and defences and so far what I have seen is...

Stage 1..... A discussion/argument about how its unfair who got in and who hasn't, some forming up into warbands. No discussion on tactics or task assignment to groups etc. Lots of bunny hopping around and showing off mounts.

Stage 2...…. Attackers storm through the gate unopposed and as a blob run from CP to CP capping them all. Defenders do some extra bunny hopping around on their horses...Someone will say its all **** and they are only there for their Invader stuff. Some token people will try to get the flags back but will be a minority and will get zerged. The door falls with next to no resistance as fast as it can as all the flags will be held by the attackers. This stage will normally conclude with an instruction being given to set up a defence in the Lord room. Then the door will fall and the attackers will storm in and up the stairs which really is the only point they meet any serious opposition.

Stage 3 At this point we are in flux-When the lord could get pulled downstairs the attackers had a major advantage. Now it seems to have changed If the defensive force is still at max numbers(no one in prison) and the Lord is not rapidly controlled by a tank with healer support he will rampage around slaughtering dps and the attacking force will dissolve very quickly. If they get into a stalemate however the attackers will likely win as the Lord is so fragile.

Moral of the story- If we don't play it right it's hardly surprising it all feels so unfair.

[Tesq]

Prison should be for attackers not defenders, defenders should just ress inside the inner keep since they are the inferior number.

[Marocus]

Prison should be for attackers not defenders, defenders should just ress inside the inner keep since they are the inferior number.

Maybe you should think about how that would actually effect the way it would play out.....
Additionally the defenders have the defensive structures as their advantage and the fact that if the attackers don't kill the lord they will win by default. Defending properly will make things much harder for the attacking team and turn what is currently a walkover into a meat grinder.

[Tesq]

Prison should be for attackers not defenders, defenders should just ress inside the inner keep since they are the inferior number.

Maybe you should think about how that would actually effect the way it would play out.....
Additionally the defenders have the defensive structures as their advantage and the fact that if the attackers don't kill the lord they will win by default. Defending properly will make things much harder for the attacking team and turn what is currently a walkover into a meat grinder.

I know how it turn out now, the building is no advantage because the flags are too near each other(exemple of fail asTM zone) ..... and the inferior number it's not allow to zerg one flag and get out of it as attacker force run in circle and where ever you fight you get zerg after 20 -30 sec if attackers know what they are doing.

Being the attacker the superior force the defender one need the prison to equalise the numbers.

Also the prison is not need in step 3 just in step 2.

In step 3 res inner keep is disable for defenders and res instead between citadel and city which ahould just be at that point as a normal keep fight.


As said in my previously post you can just give a barrier with a timer malus to re enter in fight for the attackrs but attackers need the malus not defender if you have higher number since attackers dont have to def objective but can move around (i reitheraite this make vain anything related to any logic about bigger force being forced to spread between flags and smaller force zerg 1 at time; it DOES NOT working like that pff side yes spread but is not static it RUN as a clock around flags which mean all part of it will run into whatever fight happen anywhere).

[mikke]

Just limit fort entrance with requirement of full vanq (or even better full sentinel )

Then you won't see many tanks in Forts, because both vanquisher and sentinel are really bad for def tanks. Conqueror is the way to go.

I have meant wards.

[Marocus]

Prison should be for attackers not defenders, defenders should just ress inside the inner keep since they are the inferior number.

Maybe you should think about how that would actually effect the way it would play out.....
Additionally the defenders have the defensive structures as their advantage and the fact that if the attackers don't kill the lord they will win by default. Defending properly will make things much harder for the attacking team and turn what is currently a walkover into a meat grinder.

Being the attacker the superior force the defender one need the prison to equalise the numbers.

Also the prison is not need in step 3 just in step 2.

In step 3 res inner keep is disable for defenders and res instead between citadel and city which ahould just be at that point as a normal keep fight.


As said in my previously post you can just give a barrier with a timer malus to re enter in fight for the attackrs but attackers need the malus not defender if you have higher number since attackers dont have to def objective but can move around (i reitheraite this make vain anything related to any logic about bigger force being forced to spread between flags and smaller force zerg 1 at time; it DOES NOT working like that pff side yes spread but is not static it RUN as a clock around flags which mean all part of it will run into whatever fight happen anywhere).

I don't understand how that would work. The objectives have to be held by both sides-If the defenders prevent the attackers from getting to the flags the door doesnt take damage. If they prevent that long enough the scenario ends and the defenders win. Both sides equally have to hold the flags

If the attackers get put in prison...inside the keep one successful push back would win the scenario for the defenders and the game would end-They would all be in prison and unable to try again.

If they had a 5 minute time out...One successful push/wipe would lead to us all waiting 5 minutes between attacks -boring.

I think you will have seen that the attacker respawn point is camped and if all the defenders respawn inside the fort courtyard what will happen is no dead attackers will be able to run back to the battle -They will meet a large group of defenders between them and their team mates and get killed by hugely superior numbers that cannot be moved because they will be respawning in the courtyard that you have to run through. That is assuming 5-6 defenders aren't farming them on their respawn point in any case.

I can't understand why you think the defenders need the structures/chokepoints and the Lord and a prison to put the attackers in and a respawn point that puts you right back into the battle?


Not once have I seen a tank wall and aoe dps and healers set up on the first door- The attackers are always just let in. I don't know why but the defenders tend not to defend anything.

If you just set up in the Lord room and wait for them to come of course its going to be easy for them. You are supposed to be delaying and holding them back until the timer expires.As they push through the first tank wall, you start trying to hold them off the flags and slow the damage to the door as much as possible. When that line of defence fails you fall back to the next. If you are smart you have stealthers at the attacker respawn point preventing them spawning and forcing the attacking force to fall back and reclaim their spawn point before they run out of people.... There are loads of things that can be done other than waiting in the Lord room.

[Tesq]

@morocus

The attacker yea need to hold flags but is not like 5 wb spread and each static hold the flag , again they ALL circle around like a clock to hold both flags and reinfoce anywhere a fight may happen. And i dont wanna sound rude but this is getting ridiculus is the third post i have to make for explain this and why if attackers have a superior number it always end bad with current system for defenders if atk side know what do

Of course you dont have to have prison inside the main buildings......move it in the backyard of the buildings.... Cuz you know it need to be accessable..

Or again just a timer to re enter into the fight post death would be enought for the attacker side yet is not like that hard recive ress you know...it's just something to punish brain dead wipe for higher number.

[Marocus]

I will attempt to have an open mind.... But I never see defenders actually trying to defend. Have you ever seen a tank wall on either door? I havent.

Defence Zerging from flag to flag just means you are back capped by stealthers- Its just bad whack-a-mole. Spotters/stealthers need to guard the flags and call the numbers of the enemy they see while the roamer/bulk responds and rolls over them-Pushing them back outside the walls and trying to keep them out there-Behind a defended tank wall on the gate. Falling back to defend the Lord is the last stand for the defenders not the first option.

[Maleus79]

Any chance to lower duration of last phase in fort from 1h to 30 min? 1 h is just too long .