If Order cannot win Scenarios, how do we get emblems?

[Zaxxond]

Balance between the realms for smallscale is honestly fine for the most part. Therefore, the determining factors in winning scenarios will be: a) who has the premades, b) who launches the initiative first (aggressors usually best), c) who can maintain/capture objectives, and d) who has the better players.

^ This is from my 4 years' experience of almost exclusively doing SC.

You forgot the part about using the warcamp guards to your advantage.

[MayoDaen78]

I have tried a bunch myself and heard people talk on the server and there is one thing that Order seems to agree on- They cannot win scenarios. One person I talked to yesterday said they have lost 32 games in a row...

I lost all 4 that I tried yesterday as order. There is bad luck, and then there is bad balancing. Something is amiss if the win ratio is so skewed toward one faction. This gives destruction a HUGE advantage. They have access to all the tiered sets while order does not. I am not sure what can be done, but it would be nice for the powers that be to at least acknowledge the problem.

So many comments here, haven't got time to read them all, but to op, is this Tier 4 you're talking about? or lower tiers?. I think as far as I could tell, it's fine. I lost some win some, and I like to pugs more than premade, so sometimes I lose even more. The problem is with pugs especially on order side is that there seems to be imbalanced group composition, like too many rdps at times ( for example, too many SWs, or BWs, and no healers or few tanks.

Destro on the other hand, usually have a much more balanced and even group setup at least in my experience playing SC, usually they rarely lacks healers sometimes though over abundance of healers (doks, zealots, and shammies) and enough tanks to distribute guards to their dps.

[Unstoppable1776]

Balance between the realms for smallscale is honestly fine for the most part. Therefore, the determining factors in winning scenarios will be: a) who has the premades, b) who launches the initiative first (aggressors usually best), c) who can maintain/capture objectives, and d) who has the better players.

^ This is from my 4 years' experience of almost exclusively doing SC.

You finally accept objectives as wins . I don't see too many fusion groups anymore. Did they fall apart after the iconic 3:2 win ratio on fusion?

[Unstoppable1776]

The title should be if ICONIC always wins how does order get emblems

[zgolec]

Order does not have tanks or healers. That's why it can't win scenarios.

No, no, it is all my fault. Ask anyone. Even those SC's I don't play in that Order loses? My fault. Someone gets killed in an SC? Yep, yep, my fault. Only one emblem rewarded? Got me again. Little old lady got mutilated late last night? Karisanna again...

...i bet you are responsible for my 25yo Glenfarclas disappearance last weekend as well. Bad Karisanna... Bad.

[HappyHubris]

I've taken two order characters to T4 in the past month and have found a decent mix of wins and losses at all tiers. If you keep on losing over and over, do something else for a bit instead of chain-queuing. Doing back-to-back SCs can get you stuck with the same players on each side, repeating an outcome over and over.

Broadly, Order seems to do quite well when they remember objectives exist, but many games that were "in the bag" (Order 350+ to Destro <100) end up Destro wins. This is due to Order choosing to brawl somewhere instead of minding the points, allowing a few smart Destro players to carry the day.

[peterthepan3]

Balance between the realms for smallscale is honestly fine for the most part. Therefore, the determining factors in winning scenarios will be: a) who has the premades, b) who launches the initiative first (aggressors usually best), c) who can maintain/capture objectives, and d) who has the better players.

^ This is from my 4 years' experience of almost exclusively doing SC.

You forgot the part about using the warcamp guards to your advantage.

Hey man! Good banter Good to see you sticking it out, and if you keep practicing I promise you that you'll one day nail that BW rotation.

[CountTalabecland]

Also worth noting that if you go for the premade grp game, some classes work for that and some are novelties, like Slayer, where WL can do the job better in any scenario.

Not necessarily true as a well-played Slayer (who is guarded and healed) will cause more mayhem than a WL will - there's just so few of them.

Would you say a rr80 Slayer plodding into the backlines or a rr80 WL pouncing onto a healer is more mayhem? Respectfully asking. Because in my experience as a Slayer any good destro grp, with god forbid a sorc, can see you coming and cc and blow you up well in time before you get there. Its a little better in AoE spec due to 30ft range on some abilities whereas good luck with Giantslayer. I really haven’t found a way to accomodate for Slayers 400 resists and 22% disrupt making it a magic pin cushion.

Whereas a well-geared and played WL’s ability to instantly pounce and kill anything not guarded is irreplaceable. Of course this is accounting for player skill factoring to ppl who have reached rr70 and maxed out their builds. Not saying one is OP or the other UP, just saying I would rather have WLs speed and burst. If only I didn’t hate the way those knife-ears look so much.

[peterthepan3]

Also worth noting that if you go for the premade grp game, some classes work for that and some are novelties, like Slayer, where WL can do the job better in any scenario.

Not necessarily true as a well-played Slayer (who is guarded and healed) will cause more mayhem than a WL will - there's just so few of them.

Would you say a rr80 Slayer plodding into the backlines or a rr80 WL pouncing onto a healer is more mayhem? Respectfully asking. Because in my experience as a Slayer any good destro grp, with god forbid a sorc, can see you coming and cc and blow you up well in time before you get there. Its a little better in AoE spec due to 30ft range on some abilities whereas good luck with Giantslayer. I really haven’t found a way to accomodate for Slayers 400 resists and 22% disrupt making it a magic pin cushion.

Whereas a well-geared and played WL’s ability to instantly pounce and kill anything not guarded is irreplaceable. Of course this is accounting for player skill factoring to ppl who have reached rr70 and maxed out their builds. Not saying one is OP or the other UP, just saying I would rather have WLs speed and burst. If only I didn’t hate the way those knife-ears look so much.

Both are incredibly potent in their own right, in ways such as those which you described. I think it's important to distinguish that they play very differently from one another: WL is (as you said) the king of being able to pounce on an unsuspecting target and demolish them within a few GCDs, whereas the Slayer is a brawler - the King of sustained, with great AoE and ST capabilities simultaneously.

In an open map with limited LoS? Slayer will be targeted a LOT by Sorc/Magus, and have a very hard time; a WL, on the other hand, will have the mobility needed to negate this, and hard counter the RDPS squads. A slayer can still shine, however, if he has sufficient support that can help him get to his target, and in smaller maps (Gates of Ekrund) with lots of LoS, the Slayer will make for a much more potent adversary: he is in his element when he is allowed to stick onto his target/s and apply massive amounts of ST/AoE pressure.

400 resists on a Slayer is INCREDIBLY low, and you should 100% be running with a KOBS (and IB over SM) if you want to maximise the Slayer's defenses (see point above re sufficient support).

Also worth noting that my comment were more in regards to WL & SL vs organised opponents (6v6+): organised opponents will know how a WL operates, and will have guards on standby for their healers, and will ensure that the pet is disposed of with 100% uptime - which effectively removes the advantage WL has over the SL (frontloaded burst).

[Zaxxond]

Balance between the realms for smallscale is honestly fine for the most part. Therefore, the determining factors in winning scenarios will be: a) who has the premades, b) who launches the initiative first (aggressors usually best), c) who can maintain/capture objectives, and d) who has the better players.

^ This is from my 4 years' experience of almost exclusively doing SC.

You forgot the part about using the warcamp guards to your advantage.

Hey man! Good banter Good to see you sticking it out, and if you keep practicing I promise you that you'll one day nail that BW rotation.

One day, I will move in to the top ten NA BW rankings. Until then, I train to be the 10th best.

Iconiquedeezballs has a 3:2 win ration against Fusion? Surely this banter must have a response.