AM in City Instance not worth playing

[cimator]

I've played both. I've played every healer. Every class has escape tools.

What if Run Between Worlds increased WBW's duration to 10s and decreased CD by 20s, thereby giving them a 100%(instead of 50% with current tactic and 1/6th time w/o tactic) AoE detaunt? It would be 30ft surrounding them, so not as powerful as the wp/dok targeted one, but still a 100% uptime AOE detaunt. Copy that to Sham taking out their ele tactic or similar. Would an AoE detaunt make them "tanky" enough? Or would anyone want a tanky AM over an RP anyways?

I don't suggest this change, my point being, is tankiness the problem? Slayers aren't tanky. But they are desired. What does AM/sham bring besides morale, insta rezz, puddles, ST heal spikes, and grp cleanse? 3 of which require individual tactics. Sham morale takes 2 tactics, but is far far far better.

WBW's detaunt duration is already 10 seconds, its not reflected on the tooltip. With the tactic its %66 uptime atm

[Dabbart]

Spoiler:

I've played both. I've played every healer. Every class has escape tools.

What if Run Between Worlds increased WBW's duration to 10s and decreased CD by 20s, thereby giving them a 100%(instead of 50% with current tactic and 1/6th time w/o tactic) AoE detaunt? It would be 30ft surrounding them, so not as powerful as the wp/dok targeted one, but still a 100% uptime AOE detaunt. Copy that to Sham taking out their ele tactic or similar. Would an AoE detaunt make them "tanky" enough? Or would anyone want a tanky AM over an RP anyways?

I don't suggest this change, my point being, is tankiness the problem? Slayers aren't tanky. But they are desired. What does AM/sham bring besides morale, insta rezz, puddles, ST heal spikes, and grp cleanse? 3 of which require individual tactics. Sham morale takes 2 tactics, but is far far far better.

WBW's detaunt duration is already 10 seconds, its not reflected on the tooltip. With the tactic its %66 uptime atm

Thank you I did not know that.

[cimator]

With the detaunt tactic, I think survival wise AM is fine. The main problem is its only good with WW, and even then its too skill based to play and not pug friendly. With RP, WP, Zea and Dok you have a party hot which has so much raw healing done per GCD spent, so even if you arent an experienced healer, 1 button every 10 seconds will do half your job.

[nebelwerfer]

There is a big problem when it comes to playing AM in City instance whereby they are always focused and targeted first, partly because they are insta res but also they have very few escape tools, lightly armoured and are interrupted easily while standing out due to their model. This has got so bad that many high rr AM I know say they just won't play City any more because it is just too rough and no fun and many new players will give up after a few instances, it is just constant focus and death.

Try dropping the insta rez tactic. After they nerfed it to not give you immunity it's not that great if your survivability / positioning suffers so much for it.

Afaik AM has a great m1 bubble with a long uptime, aoe kb with snare (snare being applied even if immunities are up) and mistress of the marshes..

Also they can debuff main stat and drain the AP of their attacker to reduce their dmg output..

That's not bad in my book

[detrap]

Pretty sure it is like playing a shaman but without the explosive knockback and "Run away" tactic.

Explosive knockback? Both classes have the same knockbacks. Even tho I seldom play my shaman in city I usually drop run away as I find it of limited use because of the often small areas in city.

What about Auto Detaunt, this gives the Shaman the ability to Detaunt even when CC'd and knocked down. Also if you are in a City instance where you are getting focussed and it is rough you can then equip run away with auto detaunt to give you the chance of surviving the focus. Am will just have to rely on Tanks and guard.

Any healer will drop without guard and an assist train smacking on it.

[Dabbart]

With the detaunt tactic, I think survival wise AM is fine. The main problem is its only good with WW, and even then its too skill based to play and not pug friendly. With RP, WP, Zea and Dok you have a party hot which has so much raw healing done per GCD spent, so even if you arent an experienced healer, 1 button every 10 seconds will do half your job.

That's the point. Wp/DoK have group cleanse, grp HoT, grp shield, fast grp heal, AP on heals. Z/RP has AoE HoT, AoE HoT/absorp/heal-increase-AP procing ability, large grp heals. AM/Sham has ST spike heals, large grp heals, morale, insta rezz and group cleanse. Even before you look at survivability or class specific tools, they just don't bring enough to the table.

Only 2 spots available per group, 8 spots per WB, if you take an AM or Sham over their conterpart, it's cause they are better at something, or for a specific role. I just don't think they are the best healer for city play.

But to the OP, I think targeting the solo AM/Sham in a city is to be expected. Same if you have an organized WB with 1 BW. You can assume that BW is a pretty fundamental part of what they want to do, and they don't have a backup. So kill it.

[Panodil]

With the detaunt tactic, I think survival wise AM is fine. The main problem is its only good with WW, and even then its too skill based to play and not pug friendly. With RP, WP, Zea and Dok you have a party hot which has so much raw healing done per GCD spent, so even if you arent an experienced healer, 1 button every 10 seconds will do half your job.

That's the point. Wp/DoK have group cleanse, grp HoT, grp shield, fast grp heal, AP on heals. Z/RP has AoE HoT, AoE HoT/absorp/heal-increase-AP procing ability, large grp heals. AM/Sham has ST spike heals, large grp heals, morale, insta rezz and group cleanse. Even before you look at survivability or class specific tools, they just don't bring enough to the table.

Only 2 spots available per group, 8 spots per WB, if you take an AM or Sham over their conterpart, it's cause they are better at something, or for a specific role. I just don't think they are the best healer for city play.

But to the OP, I think targeting the solo AM/Sham in a city is to be expected. Same if you have an organized WB with 1 BW. You can assume that BW is a pretty fundamental part of what they want to do, and they don't have a backup. So kill it.

Shaman and AM have Fury of da Green and Energy of Vaul. That with snare is what they bring, not many people can play the class like that.
Good shaman or AM will outheal any other, but like leaky said, they kinda need WW/waaagh

[Dabbart]

Please. Show me 1 SS of an AM/Sham top healer in a city organized group.

[Arbich]

Please. Show me 1 SS of an AM/Sham top healer in a city organized group.

https://ibb.co/YtnNJ4Y

Can´t remember if this was organized. By the look of kills it seems so.
I usually don´t keep screenshots. Remember also a city where the top 2 healers were AMs. For shamans its even easierer, I would say.
You can definitely be top healer in city. It just require specific conditions. Its far easier on WP/DoK. AM/Shaman have some issues that should be adressed. Healing numbers in city is none of them.

[Tankbeardz]

Please. Show me 1 SS of an AM/Sham top healer in a city organized group.

It can be done as long as you have a BO/Choppa decreasing your cooldowns.

The issue I have with this thread is the bs though...In city, the survivability aint that great if you are slotting things like insta rez and aoe cleanse instead of auto-detaunt/run away. If you go selfish in city, your entire team hurts. There is too much theory crafting going here.