WH - Need a Straight Answer

[Kaldus]

Hi Guys

I'm a new lv 40 WH, really enjoy the playstyle and understand until I'm much better geared I'm not going to do much to destruction in full sov etc. So in every SC and WB I take it on the chin that I'm trying to damage destro players who in BIS gear - so keep grinding for gear is the answer. But now I see the gear grind ahead of me, I've come to the forums about the WH dmg potential.

The reason I've come to the forums is I'm getting totally conflicting information about the WH with better gear and could use some help.

I've heard two keys things:
1. Once in sov/tri gear your a killing machine.
2. Once in sov/tri your still poor/low dps class out classed by other mele dps - so re-roll basically.

So which is it?, I'm hoping it the first. I don't solo, I enjoy SC's and sneaky around keeps in random WB's.

[bittrio]

WH's are extremely good in SC's.

I don't play WH, but I can tell you from a Shaman experience, WH's are a problem when there's a few on the opposing team destroying our back line.

Also, they disappear when at low HP which is a pretty annoying ability and a get outta jail free card most of the time.

WL and Slayers are also good just an entirely different playstyle. They are more up front melee train with a couple of healers.

[Akalukz]

If you plan on face-tanking a wb at a WH you will be disappointed. If you have the patience to wait for the opportune time to strike, then you will really like it. A couple of WHs can turn the tide of a battle.

[dtjror]

Gear just gives you the ability to realize potential, it’s not what will make you great versus mediocre. Better gear gives you better potential - but you still gotta play up to it.

The problem for WH is, barring dragon gun and the tactic that makes razor strike hit a few targets, they have no AOE, which is the current meta. So the fewer targets the better, i.e., great solo or small scale, ok in SCs, not very good in WB.

But as a fresh 40, yes your gear limits your potential. You probably won’t be able to solo much of anything (unless you get really lucky and run into somebody who is also fresh 40, or just a crappy player). So what to do?

My suggestion is just ride the zerg with a dragon gun build to tag as many targets as you can, collect your crests and rr, and take it easy for a bit. Don’t worry about being really “good” or effective until you’re rr 60+ and in full Vanquisher. There are people out there (Mdpv, Flurhauer) who make the class look crazy good, so it is possible.

[Scottx125]

WH's are great solo ST DPS, and group ST DPS (they bring great utility with dragon gun). HOWEVER. Outside of Cities/SC's you're gonna find it hard to get into organised groups(that follow the 2/2/2 format and play to the current meta strengths) unless they have a utility group up. In RVR ST Ranged is king. And in main WB's it's just AOE melee blob / short range AOE.

[Sofong]

Straight Answer is this class is broken.

[zgolec]

Get yourself Onslaught set [Grezko & CNTK are making ch22 event every sunday]. That is prolly BiS gear untill big boy sets like sov/tri.

If you know your class mechanic / know how to utilize it you should already see difference with it.

Tbf most of today WHs/WEs [wioth very few notable exeptions] are noobs. All they do is 2-6 gank people in lakes. Almost none of old solo WHs/WEs are around these days - with blob derangement of the server its understandable but still...

Back on the topic: once you get geared and know 100% of your class [and 99% of opponent class] WH is scary thing to face be it 1v1 or in case of good players even 1v2 or 1v3.

[Fenris78]

WH is good for :
- Killing oil
- Backcapping flags
- Mercy strike low HP people, from shadows
- Ganking solos who dont know detaunt button

WH is bad for :
- Playing in WB vs WB, albeit you can get remotely decent results with DG build and regen bullets (getting back to full HP hitting half a WB is always satisfying), but you will lack frontline capabilities, as much as AoE ones,

- Catching kiting targets (no reliable speed increase, nor gap closer, unlike pretty much all other mdps around). One bump from a shaman and it's basically over for you ; the time you need to get back to your target, you will be either dead or our of range before he's back to full HP.

- Doing good 1v2+ ; your aoe detaunt is not 100% uptime (unlike other mdps, again), and your defenses are only for 5-7s against melee or ranged, a short timeframe during wich you need to kill one target, a rare scenario only occuring because opponents are underleveled/low skilled players.


To elaborate, the main issue of WH is to be completely tactic-dependant ; while all other classes got their mechanics working in reliable fashion from scratch, WH absolutely need 3 tactics, just to make the class at same level as others :
- Flowing accusations to get his class mechanic not shitty
- Blessed blade to make it for the uber lack of WS (you got like 350 WS in BiS, yay)
- Fanatical cleansing to get decent crit damage
- And a "free" tactic slot, usually needed either for brute force (because even with full STR talis you wont cap your main stat) or sanctified bullets (for regen build).

Play any other mdps without tactic, you'll quickly see for them tactics are only bonuses over a good and working class mechanic. WH is not like that, sadly.

Add to that you need to spec half your renown into crit chances, because even with BiS you will cap upon 25-30% crit chances, wich will prevent from speccing defensively, because all your damage is solely relying upon crit damage and proc damage.

Another big issue is to be pidgeonholed into one or two specs ; one being uber squishy, and remotely more punchy, the other being in every way inferior to his WE def spec counterpart ; survivability is better (100% parry/disrupt, regen bullets) but you need to face squishy opponent to get reliable win before he flees or gets supported, wich is usually a death sentence for the WH.
You cannot go back into incognito when people are hitting you, unless you get cover or a way to hide/jump back far away, unlike the WE that just can flee away and vanish thanks to her absorb tactic preventing damage.

The other issue is WH doesnt have reliable speed increase or gap closer skill (WE got two, a 45ft jump and a speed tactic), wich makes him very vulnerable to pretty much anyone that can bump/knockback ; the charge skill will prevent you from using Shroud of Magnus (your only reliable defense against magic), and vice-versa, while you cannot snare your target while charging forward (unlike gobbos who will just laugh at you while wrecking you from afar).

Finally, WH is ultra weak against high parry, so unless you manage to always hit fro behind, even using Invader gear (7% parry strikethrough), you will often end up losing big time against tanks or other mdps that can have parry gear or tactics, and will destroy your build :
no hit = no bullet proc = no regen, etc.


So, while WH can get decent results in some specific fights, the non-meta class and inability to have good mobility, AoE nor polyvalence dont make it a good class overall.
You can gank lowbies and play hide and seek against unaware players, but dont expect to be a solo roamer godlike, despite what you may hope watching Mdvp videos... :/

[vanbuinen77]

Its a good class

[Ashoris]

Hi Guys

I'm a new lv 40 WH, really enjoy the playstyle and understand until I'm much better geared I'm not going to do much to destruction in full sov etc. So in every SC and WB I take it on the chin that I'm trying to damage destro players who in BIS gear - so keep grinding for gear is the answer. But now I see the gear grind ahead of me, I've come to the forums about the WH dmg potential.

The reason I've come to the forums is I'm getting totally conflicting information about the WH with better gear and could use some help.

I've heard two keys things:
1. Once in sov/tri gear your a killing machine.
2. Once in sov/tri your still poor/low dps class out classed by other mele dps - so re-roll basically.

So which is it?, I'm hoping it the first. I don't solo, I enjoy SC's and sneaky around keeps in random WB's.

You get different answers because people live in different worlds in this game
scale and "skill" (as in understanding gamemechanics and teamwork) makes a huge difference for the WH class. So every answer can be true

WH can be good - but a bad WH is REALLY bad.