IB mechanical grudge

[hogun]

the purpose of this post is to convince Devs of the validity of the request to restore the generation of Grudge and Hate as well as to restore skills.
Not to compare the BG and the IB. Those who want to compare these two classes can do so in another post, I will participate with pleasure.
So to this day the IB cannot be full grudge in small com and solo which is certainly not the goal of the Devs (it would be a very big nerf of the IB) the BG has an easier time compensating for this problem that does not mean it is a good situation.
For skills:
the addition of the two skills causes an up of the BG and nerf of the IB since these two skills are not of the same interest,
the nerf of HB which has 900 of str made 300 hp average is also a mistake when for exemple Ravage of the chosen makes 500 hp average with the same str.
i can prove with screen if you need.

I suggest :

- restore IB and GB
- restore Rampage + reduce duration to 5s-10s
- restore chop fasta to choppa and let up dmg from git to da choppa

BG and IB don't need to be modified to be more playable, their mechanics being the most difficult they will always be the least playable in WB. But as a small game they are already very good and well appreciated before this patch

[akisnaakkeli]

https://web.archive.org/web/20081207012 ... px?id=9342

Just refreshing everyone's memory that this is the skill that was removed, enraged beating took its place and 2h KD created for BG took Enraged Beating place: D Back then BG also got 2h Wall of darting steel, that was removed though but now they get Better Whispering Wind than SM. And IB has not even gotten free Grudge on hit : D That is imo the least that should be done.

https://web.archive.org/web/20080913014 ... px?id=9425

A reminder that Witchbrew used to be spiritual dmg, Aoe and could crit=)

EDIT; If anyone wants to checkout Patchnotes=) https://web.archive.org/web/20130510122 ... /index.php

[normanis]

ib got double nerfs
1.heavy blow like all skills depend of grudge (40% damage nerf + u still hit weak because its grudge biased. so its in end not 40% nerf byt all 80% atleast)
2.and u cant get grudge becuase of bug and/or sacrefice tactic slot/or how its work
bg got knock down because ib has knock down. who said this is not chess so all sides has their unique skills. . seems unique is only 1 side
p.s health regen is too strong in ror so watching reynor/volgograd videos regen is too op for both clases, so i dont mention it. its should get nerf hammer. i would add hp regen x per 6sec overall.

[Mortgrimm]

The biggest problem beside the nerfed HB (still wonder why) is indeed the very slow generation of grudge. Most of the time IB plays with only half of his potential.
Imagine nerfing all dps classes to half of their dmg

Tbh i don´t know if it would be enough to have Rising Anger passively integrated except we get a free tactic slot. It still takes ages to get grudge even slotting both tactics. Imo the whole grudge mechanic has to be rethink and adjusted. Also please revert HB.

Health regen is a different story for a different post. Way too op for all classes but especially WE/WH. Just take away the regen bonus from Fleshrender and Grimshimmer and we are good.

[hogun]

https://web.archive.org/web/20081207012 ... px?id=9342

Just refreshing everyone's memory that this is the skill that was removed, enraged beating took its place and 2h KD created for BG took Enraged Beating place: D Back then BG also got 2h Wall of darting steel, that was removed though but now they get Better Whispering Wind than SM. And IB has not even gotten free Grudge on hit : D That is imo the least that should be done.

https://web.archive.org/web/20080913014 ... px?id=9425

A reminder that Witchbrew used to be spiritual dmg, Aoe and could crit=)

EDIT; If anyone wants to checkout Patchnotes=) https://web.archive.org/web/20130510122 ... /index.php

These choices are hard to understand when you think of a balance objective. Maybe there's a real reason behind them, but I don't see why these changes have been made.

[Apocaliptico]

IB has been nerfed for a long time. I remember when still in live Cave-in there was a KD of 5sec. However, Ror's DEVs decided that this skill should be from BG, why? I never understood why, given that BG already has the best CC among all tank.

IB has always suffered from grudge, always! This was always a complaint from the community, but DEV always ignored it, they thought it was better to buff other Dest classes. I wonder if the DEVS are from Dest team...

[hogun]

The biggest problem beside the nerfed HB (still wonder why) is indeed the very slow generation of grudge. Most of the time IB plays with only half of his potential.
Imagine nerfing all dps classes to half of their dmg

Tbh i don´t know if it would be enough to have Rising Anger passively integrated except we get a free tactic slot. It still takes ages to get grudge even slotting both tactics. Imo the whole grudge mechanic has to be rethink and adjusted. Also please revert HB.

Health regen is a different story for a different post. Way too op for all classes but especially WE/WH. Just take away the regen bonus from Fleshrender and Grimshimmer and we are good.

I think the problem with grudge/hate is caused by the 5pts/gcd limit. jumping this limit should be tested ( its the original mecanics)

and yes for take away the regen bonus from Fleshrender and Grimshimmer

[Farrul]

The biggest problem beside the nerfed HB (still wonder why) is indeed the very slow generation of grudge. Most of the time IB plays with only half of his potential.
Imagine nerfing all dps classes to half of their dmg

Tbh i don´t know if it would be enough to have Rising Anger passively integrated except we get a free tactic slot. It still takes ages to get grudge even slotting both tactics. Imo the whole grudge mechanic has to be rethink and adjusted. Also please revert HB.

Health regen is a different story for a different post. Way too op for all classes but especially WE/WH. Just take away the regen bonus from Fleshrender and Grimshimmer and we are good.

Yes it is, one that the devs have failed to recognize or refused to aknowledge for the longest of time. I sincerely wonder why?

Giving Rising Anger passively means IB could have 4 tactics available like most other classes, it wouldn't really change that much but is a step in the right direction.

P.S. As for regen / grimmer nerf this wouldn't be enough to balance Regen WE, they would still dominate as Witchbrew mechanic and supporting utility is overpowered. Regen Tanks have plenty of regen outside of grimmer/fleshrender not sure removing/nerfing these have any real impact. I can easily reach 500 regen on a tank without any of those.

[hogun]

The biggest problem beside the nerfed HB (still wonder why) is indeed the very slow generation of grudge. Most of the time IB plays with only half of his potential.
Imagine nerfing all dps classes to half of their dmg

Tbh i don´t know if it would be enough to have Rising Anger passively integrated except we get a free tactic slot. It still takes ages to get grudge even slotting both tactics. Imo the whole grudge mechanic has to be rethink and adjusted. Also please revert HB.

Health regen is a different story for a different post. Way too op for all classes but especially WE/WH. Just take away the regen bonus from Fleshrender and Grimshimmer and we are good.

Yes it is, one that the devs have failed to recognize or refused to aknowledge for the longest of time. I sincerely wonder why?

Giving Rising Anger passively means IB could have 4 tactics available like most other classes, it wouldn't really change that much but is a step in the right direction.

P.S. As for regen / grimmer nerf this wouldn't be enough to balance Regen WE, they would still dominate as Witchbrew mechanic and supporting utility is overpowered. Regen Tanks have plenty of regen outside of grimmer/fleshrender not sure removing/nerfing these have any real impact. I can easily reach 500 regen on a tank without any of those.

it's not really shocking to see a tank that regenerates, it increases its survival ... a tank that survives is normal.
on the other hand, a WE that tanks so much is abnormal, so taking away this regen would already be a step. well, correct WB.



maybe 83 dmg, even in AE wouldn't be overpowered from saying that the original balance was better .. there's not much

[xablau55]

After reading many, many topics here on the forum, I came to the conclusion that these situations were motivated by discrimination (yes, like racis*), destro players hates dwarfs, its a fact.
Before entering directly into the discussion, I wanted to say that I've seen many mmos nerfed or buffed for futile reasons such as:
*population in each faction;
*class difficulty;
*BY APPEARANCE! (YES, that's exactly what you're reading! The more beautiful the class was, the weaker it became because everyone wanted to play with it)
*and finally, the general case of faction preference and because of this they dictate that x is better than y without carrying out the necessary tests.

With that, I wanted to tell you that everything mentioned above was probably part of the decision about the current nerfs and buffs.

There are several other questions about which path is being chosen for the future of RoR, whether it is focused on the zerg and leaving the small scale aside or vice versa, no test that has had this focus would result in this patch... nothing makes sense. Everything seems to be articulated by personal preferences, unfortunately.