Game balance

[Shieldslam]

Really depends on how you look at white lion,Just about every scenario I've been in white lions are topping the K/D in most cases while topping the damage charts not just that it's not fluff damage, so while I get the pet is a big component of the WL and it can die, let's not kid ourselves and assume that white lion is in a terrible state, also it being a not so great class I see the class in top weekly/monthly kills quite often as a melee character that doesn't have amazing AoE like choppa, essentially despite it's shortcomings white lion is quite strong for what it is, sure in warbands it might have in shortcomings, and btw mentioning the loner spec, yeh it's terrible, cause the lion is doing way more than 25% of your damage plus everything else it has to offer.

Double DoT from Tactic+TTH = big dmg numbers - K/D = Leap making it possible to stay on target and Execute lowlife enemies which Mara can't due to no mobility. It really isn't that hard to see why WL is ahead on the leaderboards but at least try to see behind the stats and look at the class as a whole. In the case of SC (who the hell even plays that still?) I'd imagine it's clueless players facetanking WL burst without detaunts while refusing to kill the pet, wouldn't quite say SC is a goldmine when it comes to discovering highly skilled players - or fair matchmaking in any way.

Also no idea what kind of smallscale you've experienced but from what I've played the pet dies within 2-3 globals after being spawned in a 6v6 .. maybe in random NA times scenarios it doesn't which is why I mentioned that any experienced grp will just focus it down.
In general I honestly struggle to find the core statement in your post. Loner is terrible in WB, so what else are people supposed to play? Revenge? WL isn't as weak even though objectively the class has nothing besides a channel AOE and a Leap, so do you have any thoughts to share as to why it's better than I make it seem?

You must suck on a WL.

No arguments, no sense or logic, just a "no u" after being proven wrong and also getting clapped ingame. Classic.

[Shogun4138]

Really depends on how you look at white lion,Just about every scenario I've been in white lions are topping the K/D in most cases while topping the damage charts not just that it's not fluff damage, so while I get the pet is a big component of the WL and it can die, let's not kid ourselves and assume that white lion is in a terrible state, also it being a not so great class I see the class in top weekly/monthly kills quite often as a melee character that doesn't have amazing AoE like choppa, essentially despite it's shortcomings white lion is quite strong for what it is, sure in warbands it might have in shortcomings, and btw mentioning the loner spec, yeh it's terrible, cause the lion is doing way more than 25% of your damage plus everything else it has to offer.

Double DoT from Tactic+TTH = big dmg numbers - K/D = Leap making it possible to stay on target and Execute lowlife enemies which Mara can't due to no mobility. It really isn't that hard to see why WL is ahead on the leaderboards but at least try to see behind the stats and look at the class as a whole. In the case of SC (who the hell even plays that still?) I'd imagine it's clueless players facetanking WL burst without detaunts while refusing to kill the pet, wouldn't quite say SC is a goldmine when it comes to discovering highly skilled players - or fair matchmaking in any way.

Also no idea what kind of smallscale you've experienced but from what I've played the pet dies within 2-3 globals after being spawned in a 6v6 .. maybe in random NA times scenarios it doesn't which is why I mentioned that any experienced grp will just focus it down.
In general I honestly struggle to find the core statement in your post. Loner is terrible in WB, so what else are people supposed to play? Revenge? WL isn't as weak even though objectively the class has nothing besides a channel AOE and a Leap, so do you have any thoughts to share as to why it's better than I make it seem?

You must suck on a WL.

No arguments, no sense or logic, just a "no u" after being proven wrong and also getting clapped ingame. Classic.

Of course you cant argue, you are typically on your back in game.

[Jimsey0000]

Before anyone blames any one class about DPS dont forget the winter 2023 ability rework has screwed up the damage/ttk in this game. Heres a thread about it, some of which are points raised here (i.e. tanks dying twice as fast):
https://returnofreckoning.com/forum/vie ... hp?t=52293

[Ashoris]

Its a great class that adds to everything. Solo, small man, warband. They can reset any fight. Its just obvious. I dont want them nerfed. My point was if they suck on 3 characters then maybe they should play regen WLs

Whenever I read one of your posts it's literally the most dogshit approach I've ever seen. It's beyond clear you got a personal vendetta against WL yet don't know how the class actually functions. Maybe don't engage with your counterclass and then complain about them being the best class in the game?

WL quite literally has the LEAST baseline utility in the ENTIRE game: 20% attackspeed slow, STR debuff from behind, pull tied to pet. The only thing WL ever had was strong frontloaded burst and mobility through leap but has to work with a buggy and weak pet to make it work - that's the entire identity of the class. WL doesn't have a single CC in Loner spec - not even one, none of the utility/debuffs Mara has, no groupbuff or similar, it literally has nothing but a single aoe interrupt you need to spec for (which Mara has baseline btw). Mara has higher dmg/dps especially in WB setting due to WL requiring pet for crit tactic while Mara doesn't and also has better crit%/stat tactics. It honestly feels like playing a template or work-in-progress class from an early access game because it's just so damn shallow and empty. The only saving grace is Pounce.
WL is the best mdps on Order, sure, but not because they are good but rather because they are the least shitty option and require negative brainpower to function at a decent level.
Additionally WL is horrible in small scale/grp too (lol) because any group with a basic understanding will immediately burst down the squishy pet and then won't have to worry about WL at all for 15s since they don't do meaningful ST dmg on their own (ranked matches were prime examples of this). Might be broken for solo due to absurd regen stacking with new selfheal + kiting (no experience, mine was always full crit) but then again solo balance is lost anyway and this thread was obviously aimed at largescale.

You must suck on a WL.

No, its the other way around - he talks of another "bracket" of skill level. WL is really good at punishing in a casual enviroment (he also explains why) but is heavily flawed vs Good Players.

Of course you cant argue, you are typically on your back in game.

and because you started it.... (what a take by you with less kills than deaths overall on WE)

its not that he sucks on WL - but probably you are looking at it from the casual view (i just checked our feud history in the Killboard HAHA) while he looks at it from a "ranked" perspective ?

[Shogun4138]

Whenever I read one of your posts it's literally the most dogshit approach I've ever seen. It's beyond clear you got a personal vendetta against WL yet don't know how the class actually functions. Maybe don't engage with your counterclass and then complain about them being the best class in the game?

WL quite literally has the LEAST baseline utility in the ENTIRE game: 20% attackspeed slow, STR debuff from behind, pull tied to pet. The only thing WL ever had was strong frontloaded burst and mobility through leap but has to work with a buggy and weak pet to make it work - that's the entire identity of the class. WL doesn't have a single CC in Loner spec - not even one, none of the utility/debuffs Mara has, no groupbuff or similar, it literally has nothing but a single aoe interrupt you need to spec for (which Mara has baseline btw). Mara has higher dmg/dps especially in WB setting due to WL requiring pet for crit tactic while Mara doesn't and also has better crit%/stat tactics. It honestly feels like playing a template or work-in-progress class from an early access game because it's just so damn shallow and empty. The only saving grace is Pounce.
WL is the best mdps on Order, sure, but not because they are good but rather because they are the least shitty option and require negative brainpower to function at a decent level.
Additionally WL is horrible in small scale/grp too (lol) because any group with a basic understanding will immediately burst down the squishy pet and then won't have to worry about WL at all for 15s since they don't do meaningful ST dmg on their own (ranked matches were prime examples of this). Might be broken for solo due to absurd regen stacking with new selfheal + kiting (no experience, mine was always full crit) but then again solo balance is lost anyway and this thread was obviously aimed at largescale.

You must suck on a WL.

No, its the other way around - he talks of another "bracket" of skill level. WL is really good at punishing in a casual enviroment (he also explains why) but is heavily flawed vs Good Players.

Of course you cant argue, you are typically on your back in game.

and because you started it.... (what a take by you with less kills than deaths overall on WE)

its not that he sucks on WL - but probably you are looking at it from the casual view (i just checked our feud history in the Killboard HAHA) while he looks at it from a "ranked" perspective ?

Yes. You do well in a group in scenarios. If you call that a feud? If you want to dual, we can go to the garden and test this out. No party to hide behind and no party to assist you.

[Ashoris]

Yes. You do well in a group in scenarios. If you call that a feud? If you want to dual, we can go to the garden and test this out. No party to hide behind and no party to assist you.

I did not call that a feud, the killboard does and his WL comment was on purpose excluding solo play and was about Groupplay so why bring up a 1vs1 now ?